This is crazy, data center boom

Couldn't they just buy land? Instead of buying land for millions and then spending billions more to build on it? If they just want land as a hedge? I don't think data centers have anything to do with acquiring land as a hedge. Seems like just about the most expensive way possible to go about that.

I don't think there is any conspiracy going on about them either. There's way too much vicious competition between the mega wealthy people and huge companies building them. They're all trying to take bites out of each other and get theirs before the other guy can. Not working together. Not anything resembling working together. More like trying to eliminate each other.

- DAA
 
I'd also say I've yet to see any vast amounts of land involved. Even the huge ones are only a couple hundred to about a thousand acres. That's not vast amounts. That's not even a very big amount, in the grand scheme. A thousand acres in Utah is nothing. What, like less than 5 sections? That's a tiny piece of land. Not a vast amount.

Out west, they buy up chunks that big just to get enough water rights. They'll only build on about 40 acres of it and leave the rest untouched. I'm just not seeing destroying much land at all. Californians moving in and building McMansions is what has destroyed vast amounts of land in Utah. And put the big hurt on our water supply too, for that matter.

Here in the drought stricken west, it's the water usage that is the huge deal. And that is a HUGE deal. The power usage, pretty much a nothing burger for the huge ones that have to build their own power generation. The negative downstream effect is on supply of the energy source. Here it's going to be natural gas. The west has vast amounts of that. Might spur some extra drilling to keep up with increased demand. Maybe build a new pipeline from the gas field to the site. No big whup, to me.

None of that amounts to diddly poo. Except the water. The water is HUGE. The current technology will be unsustainable in the west. There's not enough water to go around already. Someone coming in and sticking a huge straw in and sucking up huge amounts for anything but food production is just not going to be viable long term.

- DAA
 
DAA said:
None of that amounts to diddly poo. Except the water. The water is HUGE. The current technology will be unsustainable in the west. There's not enough water to go around already. Someone coming in and sticking a huge straw in and sucking up huge amounts for anything but food production is just not going to be viable long term.

- DAA
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Exactly. Consider this. It takes about 500 mls of water to generate a 100-word email. Compare that to all the things even us peasants are using AI for and you'll start to get an appreciation for just how damaging these data centers are to the west.
 
In some ways I see a benefit to data centers if done right. Dave's comments are spot on about water. They want to buy large tracks of land mainly for the water but also as a buffer to the population. My argument in favor of data centers especially in the west where dave and I live is that, they can take up large tracks of land but only use a small footprint even as little as 5% of the property. If part of the deal was the rest of the area had to be open space. THAT BEATS THE LIVING HELL OUT OF ENDLESS AMOUNTS OF NEW HOMES!!! does a data center that takes up 20 acres on 1000 have more or less impact than 3000 houses? This is the argument that has failed that I have tried to make with all the emotional types that are saying oh big bad data center. 3000 homes is way worse. The traffic will suck, The people will demand more government services, ie higher taxes! the open space will be gone forever. people don't seem to understand that open land if its anywhere close to a city isn't going to stay that way, especially in utah. frankly I am sick of the endless housing that always seems to be built, I guess the argument I am making is too complex for lay folks to understand easily.

data centers like dry air the west has because they can use evaporative cooling, power is cheaper too. I have a small involvement in a 2000 acre piece of land out of state. A data center company has been kicking the tires on the property, lately. They are willing to pay as much or more as a housing developer would for the property as it sits. Its raw undeveloped land. I suspect they would only use 20-30 acres of it. use up the water the land has etc. If the community could get a deal that says the rest has to be open space and non developed, isn't that a way better deal? I say HELL YES.

The west has a problem that much of the rest of the country doesn't have. Its endless population growth. When I was a kid growing up in Texas there really wasn't population growth, New homes barely replaced the old ones that people no longer lived in. I think this is the situation still across most of the country. The west on the other hand sees entire new cities. in my 25+ years in utah, I saw the city I lived in go from 1500 people to 65,000!! same with the city directly to the south of me. Frankly put a friggen data center up and put 2000 acres on lockdown. antelope will frolic, coyotes will still howl, and cattle will still graze, and my ass will not have to sit in traffic and waste me time. heaven forbid a rational argument gets in the way of emotion.
 
Well here in the east farm land is being taken for this crap as well as solar. Imminent domain isnt a good enough excuse for me. One family is loosing their house for a transmission line to go through.

Also a farmer in Texas has had still born calf's or no calf's at all since one center went up near his farm. I need to see some real data on this but...
 
My problem with data centers is like sports complexes. Big tax/water/elec. drain, very little real profit for the local communities, long term. Most will go broke!! Seems like they are an investment opportunity like truck terminals/warehouses - large number around major cities that are EMPTY. Put them in the countryside and you got to put a lot metro fiber underground and new high tension power lines to support them. Local one had the lines from the nearest switch station replaced with new towers. A lot of cost. Taxpayer get hit by that cost. Kinda like the proposed 760KV lines to go to the Permian for oil pumps, from east Texas. Needed? Maybe but lots of cost to the general population. Or like DAA's example, replace 300 servers/month = one M$ gross monthly to break even. Yes, long time ago I worked for a server mfg. co.
 
bohunr said:
gotta ask why all the interest in "data" centers, unlimited funding for the "data" centers.

whats really behind this ? Hint: its not really just for AI

theres more push for "data" centers than there ever was for green energy...WHY ?
Click to expand...
From an article at Harbingers Daily(https://harbingersdaily.com/the-spi...alvation-from-sources-other-than-the-creator/):
On July 23, 2025, the White House released Winning the Race: America’s AI Action Plan, a roadmap designed to secure American dominance in artificial intelligence. The stated goal was clear: to usher in a new era of human flourishing, economic competitiveness, and national security through AI.
To support this initiative, three executive orders were issued that accelerated AI infrastructure, expanded governmental adoption of artificial intelligence, and promoted American leadership in AI worldwide.
Among the priorities were:
• Massive expansion of data center infrastructure
• Government standards for AI deployment, eliminating all “woke” AI.
• Global leadership and influence through artificial intelligence
The message is unmistakable: technology will solve our problems, secure our future, and elevate humanity. Scripture warns us that mankind has always sought salvation through human achievement. From the Tower of Babel to the coming Beast system, humanity repeatedly attempts to build a future apart from God.
 
Another problem for Trump (us really), like internet and crypto. Are we going to manage it or another 'country'? Like patents, DNS - we gave the management away and it's hurt us. Actually, if it weren't for Musk we would be way behind in the rocket/satellite race.
 
Think long and hard about ANI,AGI or ASI( the 3 catoegories of Artificial intelligence) being about the betterment of your individual life. It's about money, access(obtaining, retrieving) your information and for some individuals controlling your life. What you can use, eat, do. You won't own anything, you will have access if needed.
 
I don't think we, the pleebs, will ever have access to AGI or ASI. I think the powers that be will have functioning AGI within five years though. For that matter, it wouldn't shock me that some SAP or China has it in rudimentary form already. ASI is still science fiction in my mind, but... But, but... It would be foolish to underestimate.

It's going to take a revolution in computing technology to really get there. Quantum? Maybe? I'm not so sure about that. But, maybe. The environment controls required for the current vision of quantum are what hangs me up. Something closer to room temperature will be the eventual break through, I think.

- DAA
 
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