16, 18 or 20 inch barrel

I

IABEAR

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I am new to predator hunting and AR-15's. I would like to get a AR .223 that is accurate bench resting at 200 yards within a 1 inch group. What length of barrel would you recommend? I understand it depends on trigger, scope, twist of barrel and the load. I would also use this gun for coyote hunting. I am looking at the RRA 20 inch.
 
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Even a 10" tube can do that. Accuracy in and of itself is not directly related to barrel lenght or diameter.

I would prefer a 20" because of the higher velocities over the shorter ones. It is also handy in the game fields.

Greg
 
I like 20" also. In fact, I have a RRA Coyote 20" upper that is very accurate. You will likely be happy with that choice, but it's just one of many good choices.
 
If you are not using a supressor I would say 18-20" as the blast is pretty good on the 16" tube. Like GL said there isn't a big correlation between barrel length and accuracy.

I went with a 18" barrel and am happy with it.
 
Considering that M4's we used in the Army had 14.5 inch barrels and using open sights targets at 300 meters are not a big problem. I would go with what fit you the best. I use 18 inch my self and have no problems shooting smaller than 1 inch at 200.
 
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I like 20" AR's in 223/5.56, longer for a bench gun.

Asking 1/2MOA from an AR isn't an insurmountable request, but it also doesn't come for free. To do it on the regular, a proper balance/weight, a good trigger, a proper barrel, a solid rest, and a fantastic optic will be in order.
 
I feel that this is a question that ever new predator (coyote) hunter asks themselves. I chose an 18" mid length AR15 system from Daniel Defense's Ambush Firearms Division.

I also think it depends on how you choose to hunt. Are you going to sit and wait in a blind or stand and call them to you OR are you going to walk around a lot and take shot opportunites as the present themselves. Most people that I talk to or read about hunt from a "Stand" sitting in one place and calling the coyote's to them. Now how far you have to walk to your stand might determine the length of your barrel (weight of the gun) and how far you are able to walk carrying all your gear/equipment. A shorter lighter barrel will weigh less.

I recently did some research on the NATO M855 bullet and it's history of development. It was made with the 20" long M15 barrel in mind. The longer the barrel the more power the bullet gets and the higher the muzzle velocity will be. The US Forces found that the M855 bullet when fired out of a shorter barrel (14.5") barrel didn't have the same muzzle velocity and terminal ballistics. So they had to redesign the bullets to work better in the shorter Barrels used by our Special Ops guys. This has something to do with how the bullet was spinning in flight and how it behaved after it entered a body. The design was first made so that the bullet would tumble or espand when it hit a human body. But the US forces were finding that the M855 bullet was not having the impact that was expected. Later it was discovered that it may have been due to the fact that the Army was not using the 20" long barrels as the M855 bullet (green tipped) was designed to use. So now they have a new M855a bullet in design or maybe production. This maybe why I'm seeing a lot more surplus M855 Green Tipped 5.56 mm bullets for sale at places like Gander Mountain. I have been buying this ammo and using it in my 18" long Cold Hammer Forged Daniel Defense Barrel with a 1:7 twist rate inside the barrel's groove and lands. I'm finding that the M855 Green Tip shoots pretty good in my Ambush Firearms gun. I only shoot out to 200 yards and use two optical devises. One is the EOTech HHS1 system and the other is a Nikon M223 4x16x41 with a 600 BDC reticle. Adding some Magpul BUS sights onto the top rail of my gun messed up the location of the Scopes and I had to rezero these optics after I added the back up Magpul BUS site on the rear of my rail.

When I first got my EOTECH sytem and the Nikon Scope I used a lead sled DFT device and was able to shoot 1 MOA groups at 200 yards pretty easily once I had the optic's sighted in with this MSR system.

Now if you want to haul a heavy barreled 20" long rifled gun into the field that's up to you. Only you can decide what's right and comfortable for you.

There is an article in Predator Extreme Magazine this month that talks about Heavy vs. light weight barrels and accuracy of each. You might pick up a copy of that magazine and read that article to help you figure out if the longer or shorter barrels are right for you.
 
Originally Posted By: VarminterrorI like 20" AR's in 223/5.56, longer for a bench gun.

Asking 1/2MOA from an AR isn't an insurmountable request, but it also doesn't come for free. To do it on the regular, a proper balance/weight, a good trigger, a proper barrel, a solid rest, and a fantastic optic will be in order.

Where is the "LIKE BUTTON"? a good short and sweet answer.
 
Please read my response in here. I talked about the research I did on the M855 Green tipped Bullets that were previously used in Iraq and other places with the shorter rifle barrels and the negative results when they hit a target several times. The bullets were not behaving as they were suppose to with the shorter barreled guns and at less velocity. The way the bullets behaved as the entered and went though the targets were ineffective in many cases and were not stopping the enemy as predicted by the designers of the system used by the army in massive numbers. Some guys were being hit and were only having the bullet go right though them with very little damage. IE The bullets were not tumbling as they were suppose to when they hit a human. Thus the redesigned M855A bullet and maybe another one to come. All this was due to the fact that they were using shorter rifle barrels with less velocity and all that encompasses.

Those M855 Bullets were very sensitive to the Yaw of the bullet in flight. The new M855a1 ERP are not so sensitive to the Yaw of the bullet while it's in flight and impacting the target.
 
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I have been using a 20" ar for the last 2 calling seasons. I have concluded that the 223 is just flat out not that impressive of a coyote killer. I have to do far too many finishing shots. next someone will chime in and say shot placement this or that, yeah whatever. go shoot something for once and get back to me. my coyotes don't always just stand there at 100 yards full broadside. with that said the 223 needs all the help it can get and a 20" barrel is pretty much mandatory. I would also suggest working up loads that have as much steam behind them as you can get. There are some more anemic loads out there in factory loadings.

I would suggest an upper that uses a 20" criterion hybrid, lilja ar 740 or black hole LTR profile barrel. This IMO makes the perfect coyote calling upper. its not a pencil barrel but does have enough weight in it that your going to get the accuracy you need. at the same time you end up with a very handy package still.
 
so 1" groups and 200 yards? so I assume that is .5" at 100 yards. that is tuff to pull off in an ar 15. YES I have done it, could I do it consistently? I don't think so. the biggest problem is you can't reload for an AR like you can for a bolt gun. I am sure guys will chime in and say I shoot 1/4" with mine. IMO I think AR's are more accurate with heavier barrels. or maybe the word is more consistent, which is really accuracy stated another way. if you have an AR 15 that shoots even 1 moa you are going to have more accuracy than you can use for the range of the cartridge with IMO is around 300 yards.
 
Originally Posted By: steve garrett I have concluded that the 223 is just flat out not that impressive of a coyote killer.

next someone will chime in and say shot placement this or that, yeah whatever.

i wont chime in and say anything. i will just laugh at you silly conclusion.
 
Originally Posted By: steve garrettI have been using a 20" ar for the last 2 calling seasons. I have concluded that the 223 is just flat out not that impressive of a coyote killer. I have to do far too many finishing shots. next someone will chime in and say shot placement this or that, yeah whatever.

I will say it. Place your shots and it works. I have no problem killing coyotes with a 223 and there are lots of people using it with great results. Maybe the caliber is not the problem.
 


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