What advantages is there to have a 220 swift over a 22-250 if any? I have a Tikka T3 lite in 22-250 and I shoot Superformance ammo at about 4000fps. I have a chance to trade another firearm for a NIB M77 220 swift but considering the availibity of 22-250 ammo vs 220 swift ammo and the fact that there is little if any difference in these two calibers I am not sure I see any advantage of the 220 over the 22-250. But I have no experence at all with the 220 swift. Any thing I am missing? Thanks
22-250 vs 220 swift???
- Thread starter Scalloper
- Start date
biggen0_8
New member
The Swift will outrun the 22-250 (even though some refuse to admit it) but you will probably have to handload to realize that gain. And there is the main thing, if you don't reload your own ammo, I would stay away from the Swift. It is tough finding anything in factory ammo for a Swift.
I've owned Swifts for better than 25 years and will never be without one, but somehow I've never had a hankering for a 22-250.
It's kind of a Chevy/Ford thing with loyal owners on both sides.
At the end of the day, the coyote won't know the difference and if your happy with what you got, I'd stay with it. That Tikka is one heck of a gun and I'd probably keep it.
I've owned Swifts for better than 25 years and will never be without one, but somehow I've never had a hankering for a 22-250.
It's kind of a Chevy/Ford thing with loyal owners on both sides.
At the end of the day, the coyote won't know the difference and if your happy with what you got, I'd stay with it. That Tikka is one heck of a gun and I'd probably keep it.
Rustydust
Active member
As an almost 40 year .220 Swift owner/shooter/lover I think that I am fairly qualified to give some answers to your questions.
First off, if you have a 22/250 right now that shoots well and you enjoy it then you may as well hang onto it. Even nowadays factory ammo is way easier to get for the .22/250 than it is the Swift, and even though it pains me a bit to say this, it's better too. Not many companies load the .220 Swift anymore and those that do don't load it to its potential. Originally loaded with a 48 grain bullet to over 4000 FPS (a real gee-whiz 80 years ago!) it has since been toned down a bit over the years. Most 50 grain ammo is loaded to around 3700-3800 and 55 grainers around 3500-3600. Not bad, but eh, not what the Swift is really capable of either.
If you handload then you can certainly get all the performance out of the Swift that anyone in their right mind (I am not saying that's me!) should ever want. And if you wring the Swift out to it's max you might get 100-150 FPS over the .22/250. Hardly worth it in my book. There sure aint going to be a prairie dog ever been born that is going to be able to tell the difference with what it was hit with I can tell you that.
Now then, as an owner of a .220 Swift as well as .22/250 I will tell you right now that if I had to get rid of one of them I would not have to ennie meenie miny moe the guns. The Swift would stay and the .22/250 would go. My Swift just has a place in my heart that the 250 does not have. Something about shooting that gun that brings an enjoyment that just cannot be duplicated with any other gun. Many other .220 Swift owners will tell you the same thing.
If your Tikka shoots good keep it. It's a fine gun. But you if you can swing getting that M77 Swift some other way then you might just want to do what you can to get it. It's very difficult to put it in words, but there is just something very special about a .220 Swift. If I had to get rid of every one of my varmint rifles but for one there would be no question as to what the soul survivor would be.
First off, if you have a 22/250 right now that shoots well and you enjoy it then you may as well hang onto it. Even nowadays factory ammo is way easier to get for the .22/250 than it is the Swift, and even though it pains me a bit to say this, it's better too. Not many companies load the .220 Swift anymore and those that do don't load it to its potential. Originally loaded with a 48 grain bullet to over 4000 FPS (a real gee-whiz 80 years ago!) it has since been toned down a bit over the years. Most 50 grain ammo is loaded to around 3700-3800 and 55 grainers around 3500-3600. Not bad, but eh, not what the Swift is really capable of either.
If you handload then you can certainly get all the performance out of the Swift that anyone in their right mind (I am not saying that's me!) should ever want. And if you wring the Swift out to it's max you might get 100-150 FPS over the .22/250. Hardly worth it in my book. There sure aint going to be a prairie dog ever been born that is going to be able to tell the difference with what it was hit with I can tell you that.
Now then, as an owner of a .220 Swift as well as .22/250 I will tell you right now that if I had to get rid of one of them I would not have to ennie meenie miny moe the guns. The Swift would stay and the .22/250 would go. My Swift just has a place in my heart that the 250 does not have. Something about shooting that gun that brings an enjoyment that just cannot be duplicated with any other gun. Many other .220 Swift owners will tell you the same thing.
If your Tikka shoots good keep it. It's a fine gun. But you if you can swing getting that M77 Swift some other way then you might just want to do what you can to get it. It's very difficult to put it in words, but there is just something very special about a .220 Swift. If I had to get rid of every one of my varmint rifles but for one there would be no question as to what the soul survivor would be.
Want type of attachment do you have to the firearm you're trading on the Swift? There is nothing wrong with having both the 22-250 and 220Swfit.
If you were trading out of your 22-250 to get the Swift, that would be a different story. In this case, pending any attachment or fondness of the trade piece, I'd go ahead and do it. If you're not hand loading, yet...now is a great opportunity to get into it. Get max performance from both the fast 22s.
If you were trading out of your 22-250 to get the Swift, that would be a different story. In this case, pending any attachment or fondness of the trade piece, I'd go ahead and do it. If you're not hand loading, yet...now is a great opportunity to get into it. Get max performance from both the fast 22s.
Anton Chigurh
Member
I've not had a swift, that said I would say keep the Tikka if you like it and stay with the 22-250 as well. Do you really need to shoot bullets at the speed of light?
Winny Fan
New member
I own a couple of each and today my favorite cartridge between the two is based on which rifle I choose to use today. Tomorrow might be a different story.
If you realistically look at one versus the other, the difference in ballistics will translate to hitting a target on the top side of a single stand of hair with the 220 Swift versus hitting the bottom side of the same strand of hair with a 22-250 inside of probably 400 yards. After that they both start to lose their horsepower rather quickly with conventional weight bullets.
The only other thing I can report to is something I read somewhere on the internet - maybe even here - about one of the cartridges. It's not a confirmed thing with me as I've never had it actually happen to me, but I understand that for some Swift owners that their rifles actually talk to them. Every time I walk by a gun safe with a Swift in it, I listen intently, but so far no joy.
And I do hand load for both. A quick look at the most recent Nosler manual shows that you might get @3975 fps with a 22-250 while a Swift clocks a velocity of @3988 fps, both with a 50-52 grain bullet. That's the difference in the top or bottom side of that single strand of hair I was talking about earlier. Individual rifles will no doubt provide slightly different results, but that is some published current reloading data that is pretty representative.
If you realistically look at one versus the other, the difference in ballistics will translate to hitting a target on the top side of a single stand of hair with the 220 Swift versus hitting the bottom side of the same strand of hair with a 22-250 inside of probably 400 yards. After that they both start to lose their horsepower rather quickly with conventional weight bullets.
The only other thing I can report to is something I read somewhere on the internet - maybe even here - about one of the cartridges. It's not a confirmed thing with me as I've never had it actually happen to me, but I understand that for some Swift owners that their rifles actually talk to them. Every time I walk by a gun safe with a Swift in it, I listen intently, but so far no joy.
And I do hand load for both. A quick look at the most recent Nosler manual shows that you might get @3975 fps with a 22-250 while a Swift clocks a velocity of @3988 fps, both with a 50-52 grain bullet. That's the difference in the top or bottom side of that single strand of hair I was talking about earlier. Individual rifles will no doubt provide slightly different results, but that is some published current reloading data that is pretty representative.
Winny Fan
New member
Originally Posted By: ScalloperI have a model 94 win carbine in 32 spc made in 1925 but has been reblued. Thats what the guy wants for the new M77 220 swift. I will not use the 32 spc but I also may not use the 220 swift.
Thanks for the imput
I do reload and I am not selling my Tikka
This is just me. but I probably wouldn't make that trade even in a Scotch induced drunken stupor. Prices vary by regions of the country, but south of me in Houston there is an extremely large gun shop that stocks just about anything old and new that you can find.
Here is a representative sample of current Model 94 32 Winchester Special prices. Your rifle might be worth less depending on how well the re-finish job was done and other factors relevant to your rifle, but the three examples show what is possible based on condition and alterations.
http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-94-32-win-spcl-w6281/#.UwOlFoX74wA
http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-94-32-win-special-w6300/#.UwOlXoX74wA
http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-94-32-win-special-w6121/#.UwOlgYX74wA
In contrast, I saw a Ruger 77 220 Swift new in the box in a local gun shop near where I live yesterday for $775 out the door.
Thanks for the imput
I do reload and I am not selling my Tikka
This is just me. but I probably wouldn't make that trade even in a Scotch induced drunken stupor. Prices vary by regions of the country, but south of me in Houston there is an extremely large gun shop that stocks just about anything old and new that you can find.
Here is a representative sample of current Model 94 32 Winchester Special prices. Your rifle might be worth less depending on how well the re-finish job was done and other factors relevant to your rifle, but the three examples show what is possible based on condition and alterations.
http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-94-32-win-spcl-w6281/#.UwOlFoX74wA
http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-94-32-win-special-w6300/#.UwOlXoX74wA
http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-94-32-win-special-w6121/#.UwOlgYX74wA
In contrast, I saw a Ruger 77 220 Swift new in the box in a local gun shop near where I live yesterday for $775 out the door.
Anton Chigurh
Member
No you read it right, I didn't. Sorry Scalloper, I guess I don't have anything of value to add then.
Originally Posted By: Winny FanOriginally Posted By: ScalloperI have a model 94 win carbine in 32 spc made in 1925 but has been reblued. Thats what the guy wants for the new M77 220 swift. I will not use the 32 spc but I also may not use the 220 swift.
Thanks for the imput
I do reload and I am not selling my Tikka
This is just me. but I probably wouldn't make that trade even in a Scotch induced drunken stupor. Prices vary by regions of the country, but south of me in Houston there is an extremely large gun shop that stocks just about anything old and new that you can find.
Here is a representative sample of current Model 94 32 Winchester Special prices. Your rifle might be worth less depending on how well the re-finish job was done and other factors relevant to your rifle, but the three examples show what is possible based on condition and alterations.
http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-94-32-win-spcl-w6281/#.UwOlFoX74wA
http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-94-32-win-special-w6300/#.UwOlXoX74wA
http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-94-32-win-special-w6121/#.UwOlgYX74wA
In contrast, I saw a Ruger 77 220 Swift new in the box in a local gun shop near where I live yesterday for $775 out the door.
You really should keep that 32 Spcl. It's a dandy round, in a great platform. Listen to Winny here...you will likely regret ridding yourself of that rifle. Find someone to make up some nice has checked cast loads for that rifle and shoot it. For no real reason, I prefer it over the 30-30. Just a personal preference.
Thanks for the imput
I do reload and I am not selling my Tikka
This is just me. but I probably wouldn't make that trade even in a Scotch induced drunken stupor. Prices vary by regions of the country, but south of me in Houston there is an extremely large gun shop that stocks just about anything old and new that you can find.
Here is a representative sample of current Model 94 32 Winchester Special prices. Your rifle might be worth less depending on how well the re-finish job was done and other factors relevant to your rifle, but the three examples show what is possible based on condition and alterations.
http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-94-32-win-spcl-w6281/#.UwOlFoX74wA
http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-94-32-win-special-w6300/#.UwOlXoX74wA
http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-94-32-win-special-w6121/#.UwOlgYX74wA
In contrast, I saw a Ruger 77 220 Swift new in the box in a local gun shop near where I live yesterday for $775 out the door.
You really should keep that 32 Spcl. It's a dandy round, in a great platform. Listen to Winny here...you will likely regret ridding yourself of that rifle. Find someone to make up some nice has checked cast loads for that rifle and shoot it. For no real reason, I prefer it over the 30-30. Just a personal preference.
midwestpredator
Active member
Originally Posted By: Winny FanOriginally Posted By: ScalloperI have a model 94 win carbine in 32 spc made in 1925 but has been reblued. Thats what the guy wants for the new M77 220 swift. I will not use the 32 spc but I also may not use the 220 swift.
Thanks for the imput
I do reload and I am not selling my Tikka
This is just me. but I probably wouldn't make that trade even in a Scotch induced drunken stupor. Prices vary by regions of the country, but south of me in Houston there is an extremely large gun shop that stocks just about anything old and new that you can find.
Here is a representative sample of current Model 94 32 Winchester Special prices. Your rifle might be worth less depending on how well the re-finish job was done and other factors relevant to your rifle, but the three examples show what is possible based on condition and alterations.
http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-94-32-win-spcl-w6281/#.UwOlFoX74wA
http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-94-32-win-special-w6300/#.UwOlXoX74wA
http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-94-32-win-special-w6121/#.UwOlgYX74wA
In contrast, I saw a Ruger 77 220 Swift new in the box in a local gun shop near where I live yesterday for $775 out the door.
WOW!!! Based on this info I would not make that trade either. Even if your Winchester is worth $12-1500, depending on the refinish job and the rest of the condition, you would be better off selling it outright and then you could buy 2 rugers. They are probably worth around the $6-700 range when in excellent condition.
Like was stated above the 220 can/will outrun the 22-250 but the gain is marginal and factory ammo will be a wash. Plus there is not a lot of factory offerings for the 220 and for the price difference it is not worth it to me. I have 22-250s and have never had a 220 but relatives do and it is a great round but to benefit from it you will need to reload IMO.
Thanks for the imput
I do reload and I am not selling my Tikka
This is just me. but I probably wouldn't make that trade even in a Scotch induced drunken stupor. Prices vary by regions of the country, but south of me in Houston there is an extremely large gun shop that stocks just about anything old and new that you can find.
Here is a representative sample of current Model 94 32 Winchester Special prices. Your rifle might be worth less depending on how well the re-finish job was done and other factors relevant to your rifle, but the three examples show what is possible based on condition and alterations.
http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-94-32-win-spcl-w6281/#.UwOlFoX74wA
http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-94-32-win-special-w6300/#.UwOlXoX74wA
http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/winchester-94-32-win-special-w6121/#.UwOlgYX74wA
In contrast, I saw a Ruger 77 220 Swift new in the box in a local gun shop near where I live yesterday for $775 out the door.
WOW!!! Based on this info I would not make that trade either. Even if your Winchester is worth $12-1500, depending on the refinish job and the rest of the condition, you would be better off selling it outright and then you could buy 2 rugers. They are probably worth around the $6-700 range when in excellent condition.
Like was stated above the 220 can/will outrun the 22-250 but the gain is marginal and factory ammo will be a wash. Plus there is not a lot of factory offerings for the 220 and for the price difference it is not worth it to me. I have 22-250s and have never had a 220 but relatives do and it is a great round but to benefit from it you will need to reload IMO.
I actually just bought a 220 swift and it became my favorite gun right from the start. I also own a 250 and it don't leave my gun safe awhile lot even before the 220 I just got to say the 220 is just a sweet gun and if u are looking for factory ammo it's not to hard to find if u look it's pretty easy
I think the advantages/disadvantages are like apples and oranges, If I felt good about the trade I would go for it, I had both a Swift and a 250 for years and played with them both, presently I just own a 250...but if a sweet deal came along for a swift I would jump, my only concern presently would be finding brass.
Rustydust
Active member
Originally Posted By: pahntr760Did I read it wrong...? I think he is saying he has a firearm, separate of the Tikka, that he was using to trade? Sorry, it's. Even a rough AM for me. Please advise OP.
No, I did read it wrong. Sorry! My bad on this one.
But like I said, it would be fun to have both the .22/250 as well as a .220 Swift. And I really like the M77 Swifts for sure. Especially the early tang safety ones like my first one was. I was too late smart on keeping that gun!
No, I did read it wrong. Sorry! My bad on this one.
But like I said, it would be fun to have both the .22/250 as well as a .220 Swift. And I really like the M77 Swifts for sure. Especially the early tang safety ones like my first one was. I was too late smart on keeping that gun!
I sold my 22-250 and got a swift 20 years ago never looked back it was a good move so i thought easy answer. Then it said 32spl and i stopped. I have one also that came from my grandpa to my dad to me my dad shot his first deer i shot my first my son shot his first deer with the same gun. so keep the 32 your grandkids will love it. sell somethin and get the swift.
For me it would be the Swift. It is the one gun I wanted the most when I started shooting. I have one now, M77, Liberty.
The swift can do what the 250 can't, the difference may be minimal, but is indeed a difference.
I was lucky, got the rifle with about 400 rounds of ammo, so brass won't be an issue for me for a long time.
When someone tells you there is something magical about that rifle, they are not lying.
As far as ammo availability goes, the 250 wins, but I don't buy guns based on ammo availability. I just could not imagine a situation where I would find myself so suddenly in need of ammunition that it would influence such a significant purchase.
Matter of fact, I am going to go hug it right now, haven't done that since this morning.
The swift can do what the 250 can't, the difference may be minimal, but is indeed a difference.
I was lucky, got the rifle with about 400 rounds of ammo, so brass won't be an issue for me for a long time.
When someone tells you there is something magical about that rifle, they are not lying.
As far as ammo availability goes, the 250 wins, but I don't buy guns based on ammo availability. I just could not imagine a situation where I would find myself so suddenly in need of ammunition that it would influence such a significant purchase.
Matter of fact, I am going to go hug it right now, haven't done that since this morning.
I have one of each in Savage model 12. The Swift has a new Criterion barrel while the 22-250 is factory Savage with over 4500 rds fired. I'd honestly have a hard time picking one over the other. Both are extremely accurate, fairly easy to load for, not too hard on brass. Main difference is the amount of powder it takes to load the Swift vs the 22-250. IMO it's basically a wash.