223 Experts--How Short Can I Go

H

HOGGHEAD

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I just bought a new Savage LH-12VLP-DBM in 223 Remington cartridge with a 1in9 twist barrel. I also ordered my suppressor toady. The length of the suppressor is just under 7". The Savage currently has a 26" barrel. I am going to have the barrel shortened when I have it threaded for the suppressor. How short can I go. I was thinking about going 18", or 20". But now I am thinking about going shorter.

I will be developing two loads for this rifle. A regular load, and a sub-sonic load for shots under 75 yards. The other load will never be shot over 300 yards.

I am going to order some of the Calhoon double hollow point bullets tomorrow because they are suppose to reliably expand at lower velocities.

I need the shorter barrel because I am a handicapped hunter and I do all my groundhog hunting off my Kawasaki Mule. So the shorter the better.

How short can I go?? What do you guys think?? What powders work best in shorter barrels?? Thanks, Tom.
 
I'm not positive all state regulations are the same, but I think legally you can only have a 16" barrel and that does not count the suppressor. As far as loads the super 14 contender barrels are very accurate out past 200 yards.
 
Take the barrel down to 16". You need to reduce the velocity as much as possible. Hope you have heard a 5.56 suppressor before or you will be disappointed if you think it will be "Hollywood" quiet. I have one I shoot on a 16" AR and also use it on a 16" Contender. Sure takes the blast out but still kinda loud. Search you tube and you can witness different suppressors in use.
 
If you permanently attach it you can go to 9"
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But you'll need to load up some sub-sonics if you want it to actually be quiet even with the suppressor.
 
Under 16" is where the 223 starts to really lose speed in relation to barrel
length. I have been downrange while a suppressed ar15 was fired and it is
pretty quite. I think you still hear a lot of the chamber blast back at the gun.
 
I've got one of the little Ruger M77 Compacts in 223 with the 16.5" barrel. Never chronied it but the little buggar shoots fairly well. I shot it out the tractor cab a few weeks ago and couldn't hear in one ear for 2 hours, that thing will deafen you.
 
He has already stated that he will be using sub-sonic rounds as well, so I am sure that he knows that the sonic round will not be as quite. He is wanting to know how long the barrel should be. I am wondering what you are going after, mainly, and what gr bullets you will be shooting out of this rifle. If I were you I would cut it down to 16"-18" (I am guessing that you do not want to permanantly attach the suppressor, and that would be the only way to go shorter then 16" legally) and look at the 60 gr v-max, and use it in both of your loads. The 60's will carry a little more energy down range out to 300 yrd, and more energy with the sub-sonic loads, but should still open up fairly decent on the smaller stuff. It might drop a little more out to 300, but still should be manageable. If you don't like the 60 gr V-max...I would look at the 65 gr gamekings. I have not tried them, but have heard good reports on them. They might not open up as much as the v-max bullets, but should still open up enough and penatrate a little deeper. Either way you should be good on everything from groundhogs to coyotes. But this is just my opinion, and just do what you feel would be best for your applications, since you are going to be shooting it...make it however you want it.
 
Fantastic link, thank you pieeyed.

I have not decided on a bullet yet. I am going to call Calhoon tomorrow. He makes a double hollow point bullet that is suppose to expand at extremely low velocities. It also looks like a great coyote bullet.

Most of my hunting will be for ground hogs.

A lot of people are talking about AR's. However this is not an AR, so action noise is not an issue. I realize that AR's are louder than bolts.

300 yards will be the longest shot, and most shots will be under 200 yards(probably under 100 yards).

16" might be a great length. It looks like I can still maintain pretty good velocity for a faster load, and keep the rifle fairly short for the tight quarters on my Kawasaki Mule.

I am wondering about the powder. Will unburnt powder cause a problem in the suppressor??

Thanks for the suggestion about pistol loads, I will have to check out the TC loads. Thanks Again, Tom.
 
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The Savage wears a 26" heavy barrel. The rifle comes in at 10#. I wonder how much weight I will knock off by shortening the barrel to 16 or 16-1/2"s?? The suppressor weighs 20 ounces.

Man that should be one fast handling, well balanced rifle if I cut it to 16"s.

This is going to be funnnnnnnnn.
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Tom.
 
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My 14" contender barrel sounds quieter to me than my 16" barrel AR. I think in a bolt gun in the ranges your thinking 16" is plenty and with a can it should be fun to shoot. the noise from your gun will be quiet (think like a nail gun maby less)and all people will hear is the supersonic bullet.
DaFUnk
 
I have a Rem. 700 in .223AI with a 1:8 twist Douglas barrel that is cut to 17 1/2" that I shoot suppressed. It shoots quite well out to 300 - 350 yds.77 gr. SMKs are running 2650 - 2700 fps. With the suppressor it sounds like a .22 RF at about 50 yds. out.
 
Something about buying a 223 and making it perform at sub 22 LR levels just seems wrong. They sell 60gr bullets for the 22 LR that will match your 223 sub-sonic.
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Most of the people I know shooting 22 subsonic with any weight bullets aren't very happy with them. A few report they will not penetrate critters as small as ground hogs. Based on thousands of GH kills I've racked up with subsonic guns in different calibers I'd say they are wrong but it will not be any different than shooting them with a 22 short. or 22 LR from a pistol. When you jump to large caliber the bullets won't penetrate enoug to cover the bullet. The 22 long and skinnys will but forget hollow pointa and expect 98% of what you hit to run back in to their holes.

I wouldn't cut the barrel down past 18". I would also live with the noise and use supersonic rounds.
 
Hey there was a good article on .223 sub-sonic ammo in predator extreme either this or last month that you might want to check out. If I remember right they talking about how it was not going to work that well. As for the barrel just remember the noise factor. I have a Savage model 10xp and could not imagine how loud it would be 16 or 18" barrel. I know your puttting a suppressor on it but that will not take all your noise away
 
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