243 brass made from .308 Lake City military brass

Bluedog

Bluedog

New member
So 243 brass isnt as plentiful as .308 military brass and so I decided to try and make my own 243 brass from .308 Lake city brass. I read up on it and watched a video or two and decided to give it a try.

My best luck was when I used a 7mm-08 die with the stem removed....and then full length resized in a 243 die. I loaded my usual charge of varget behind a 75grain vmax and took 18 rounds to the range. Every round chambered easily and shot sub MOA at 100 yards. No split necks or case anomolies ...no problems at all.

My next adventure will be 6.5 creedmore brass from .308 military brass. Its pretty satisfying to be able to make your own brass from $.10 military brass.

How many of ya'all out there do or have done the same ?

Happy New Year!

Bluedog
 
A whole bunch of us for a very long time. For me 35 Whelens from 06's, 222 Rem and 6x45 from 223/5.56 with military brass. Just about very factory round and millitary round has been necked up and down since the brass case hase been in use. Even the major ammo/arms manufactures do it to creat new offerings.

From factory chamberings I make 22-204, 6mm-204 and 25-205 from 204 brass. I even take 9.3x72R to 6.5x58R.

9.3x72 right, to 6.5x58R center, ref. 243 Win left

 
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I will be getting an annealer later this spring. Hopefully that will make the process even more smooth than it already is. I think 6.5 creedmoor will be a little trickier...but should work as well.
 
I do all my annealing with an electric drill, appropriate deep socket and a propane torch but I do small batches, 50 or less.
 
Blue Dog, I like your initiative to try and make a better mouse trap. There are some pit falls which should be avoided.

1. as you neck down, the necks get a lot thicker. Necks should be annealed. I have been using'
AWS method of annealing since the late 60's using a cheap half inch variable speed drill
that has the speed control in the trigger.

2. if the Lake city brass you are using was fired in a M60, the dia is huge, and the dia at the
web may spring back to larger than you sized it down to over a period of time. This may
leade to a tight chambering round. We have found this over the years and learned to
use a small base sizer(which takes the size back down to new brass size) to avoid problems

3. Not all lake city is created equal, so sort your brass by year. Also, check flash holes for
flash holes that were punched off center. You can throw this brass away or use a triangle
file and file a notch in the rim of the case to use this brass as fouling shots or to
use in setting up a full length sizer, etc

4. as you get smaller in size the case necks get much thicker, this will require neck turning
and this is an additional expense...look before you leap.

5. Lake City brass is very, very good and tough. You can often reach a higher pressure accuracy
node with Lake City than you can with Lapua, but often after 5 or so firings, the brass is
toast. Primer pockets will open up or the brass just simply will NOT size down small
enough to fit comfortably in your chamber.

If you like forming brass from 308 military brass, try and find a supply of brass that is new
or once fired in a bolt gun, (advertise a want to buy on accurate shooter).

if you are going down this road of forming brass from a larger parent brass, a tube micrometer and a regular micrometer that both measure in the .0001 is advisable. K & M Neck turners with the expander mandrel makes neck turning a cinch, just spend the money one time.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Helios-0-1-Micrometer-0001-Grad-made-in-Germany-original-Wood-Box/132458346652?hash=item1ed721f89c:g:rxgAAOSwzlNZiMNr

https://www.ebay.com/itm/USED-Mitutoyo-115-313-tube-anvil-micrometer-0-1-0001-with-case/322965384801?hash=item4b323cae61:g:7D4AAOSwZW5aRS7v

The only calipers I will trust are Brown and Sharpe, Starett, and Mitutoyo Absolute AFTER I have checked them against gauge blocks.
 
Originally Posted By: BluedogOriginally Posted By: reb8600I have seen plenty of 243 brass.

For 10 cents a piece?

Nope but you didn't say you did it for the price. You said it wasn't as plentiful. It is a lot of work for the savings and in my opinion just not worth the hassle. I pick up a lot of 243 brass and don't pay anything for it. After buying the additional dies, I would have to lose or need to replace brass a lot to justify buying the extra dies and spending the time doing it.
 
Originally Posted By: reb8600Originally Posted By: BluedogOriginally Posted By: reb8600I have seen plenty of 243 brass.

For 10 cents a piece?

Nope but you didn't say you did it for the price. You said it wasn't as plentiful. It is a lot of work for the savings and in my opinion just not worth the hassle. I pick up a lot of 243 brass and don't pay anything for it. After buying the additional dies, I would have to lose or need to replace brass a lot to justify buying the extra dies and spending the time doing it.

I already had the 7mm-08 dies...so.no extra cost. I pick up a few 243 brass here and there at the range...but it was interesting to me that I could make my own by taking a few steps and sizing down some excess. 308 military brass I have. I can afford the finest brass available...but the self satisfaction of being able to produce my own from $10 a hundred brass is interesting to me. It honestly isnt about the cost. This is just a new path i decided to follow, and so far is quite satisfying.

Bluedog
 
Originally Posted By: BluedogOriginally Posted By: reb8600Originally Posted By: BluedogOriginally Posted By: reb8600I have seen plenty of 243 brass.

For 10 cents a piece?

Nope but you didn't say you did it for the price. You said it wasn't as plentiful. It is a lot of work for the savings and in my opinion just not worth the hassle. I pick up a lot of 243 brass and don't pay anything for it. After buying the additional dies, I would have to lose or need to replace brass a lot to justify buying the extra dies and spending the time doing it.

I already had the 7mm-08 dies...so.no extra cost. I pick up a few 243 brass here and there at the range...but it was interesting to me that I could make my own by taking a few steps and sizing down some excess. 308 military brass I have. I can afford the finest brass available...but the self satisfaction of being able to produce my own from $10 a hundred brass is interesting to me. It honestly isnt about the cost. This is just a new path i decided to follow, and so far is quite satisfying.

Bluedog




Yup, no problem. Many of us have already been there though.

In the old days it was worth it. Today not so much, unless you are staying with military chambers. Using 5.56 back for 223, or 7.62x51 for 308 etc... Otherwise you will get over it. It's really not worth it. There are many pitfalls.
 
Originally Posted By: ackleymanForming, neck turning, full length sizing makes for a great little hobby when Winter weather has us glued indoors.


This guy right here.....^^^^^^....he gets it.
 
Originally Posted By: ackleymanBlue Dog, I like your initiative to try and make a better mouse trap. There are some pit falls which should be avoided.

1. as you neck down, the necks get a lot thicker. Necks should be annealed. I have been using'
AWS method of annealing since the late 60's using a cheap half inch variable speed drill
that has the speed control in the trigger.

2. if the Lake city brass you are using was fired in a M60, the dia is huge, and the dia at the
web may spring back to larger than you sized it down to over a period of time. This may
leade to a tight chambering round. We have found this over the years and learned to
use a small base sizer(which takes the size back down to new brass size) to avoid problems

3. Not all lake city is created equal, so sort your brass by year. Also, check flash holes for
flash holes that were punched off center. You can throw this brass away or use a triangle
file and file a notch in the rim of the case to use this brass as fouling shots or to
use in setting up a full length sizer, etc

4. as you get smaller in size the case necks get much thicker, this will require neck turning
and this is an additional expense...look before you leap.

5. Lake City brass is very, very good and tough. You can often reach a higher pressure accuracy
node with Lake City than you can with Lapua, but often after 5 or so firings, the brass is
toast. Primer pockets will open up or the brass just simply will NOT size down small
enough to fit comfortably in your chamber.

If you like forming brass from 308 military brass, try and find a supply of brass that is new
or once fired in a bolt gun, (advertise a want to buy on accurate shooter).

if you are going down this road of forming brass from a larger parent brass, a tube micrometer and a regular micrometer that both measure in the .0001 is advisable. K & M Neck turners with the expander mandrel makes neck turning a cinch, just spend the money one time.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Helios-0-1-Micrometer-0001-Grad-made-in-Germany-original-Wood-Box/132458346652?hash=item1ed721f89c:g:rxgAAOSwzlNZiMNr

https://www.ebay.com/itm/USED-Mitutoyo-115-313-tube-anvil-micrometer-0-1-0001-with-case/322965384801?hash=item4b323cae61:g:7D4AAOSwZW5aRS7v

The only calipers I will trust are Brown and Sharpe, Starett, and Mitutoyo Absolute AFTER I have checked them against gauge blocks.

Thanks for the info I appreciate it sir!
 
Originally Posted By: BluedogOriginally Posted By: ackleymanBlue Dog, I like your initiative to try and make a better mouse trap. There are some pit falls which should be avoided.

1. as you neck down, the necks get a lot thicker. Necks should be annealed. I have been using'
AWS method of annealing since the late 60's using a cheap half inch variable speed drill
that has the speed control in the trigger.

2. if the Lake city brass you are using was fired in a M60, the dia is huge, and the dia at the
web may spring back to larger than you sized it down to over a period of time. This may
leade to a tight chambering round. We have found this over the years and learned to
use a small base sizer(which takes the size back down to new brass size) to avoid problems

3. Not all lake city is created equal, so sort your brass by year. Also, check flash holes for
flash holes that were punched off center. You can throw this brass away or use a triangle
file and file a notch in the rim of the case to use this brass as fouling shots or to
use in setting up a full length sizer, etc

4. as you get smaller in size the case necks get much thicker, this will require neck turning
and this is an additional expense...look before you leap.

5. Lake City brass is very, very good and tough. You can often reach a higher pressure accuracy
node with Lake City than you can with Lapua, but often after 5 or so firings, the brass is
toast. Primer pockets will open up or the brass just simply will NOT size down small
enough to fit comfortably in your chamber.

If you like forming brass from 308 military brass, try and find a supply of brass that is new
or once fired in a bolt gun, (advertise a want to buy on accurate shooter).

if you are going down this road of forming brass from a larger parent brass, a tube micrometer and a regular micrometer that both measure in the .0001 is advisable. K & M Neck turners with the expander mandrel makes neck turning a cinch, just spend the money one time.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Helios-0-1-Micrometer-0001-Grad-made-in-Germany-original-Wood-Box/132458346652?hash=item1ed721f89c:g:rxgAAOSwzlNZiMNr

https://www.ebay.com/itm/USED-Mitutoyo-115-313-tube-anvil-micrometer-0-1-0001-with-case/322965384801?hash=item4b323cae61:g:7D4AAOSwZW5aRS7v

The only calipers I will trust are Brown and Sharpe, Starett, and Mitutoyo Absolute AFTER I have checked them against gauge blocks.

Thanks for the info I appreciate it sir!

As it looks like you've discovered, ackleyman is someone to listen to. He's been there done that and is still doing it.


It's possible he is older than brass.
ohmy.gif
grin.gif
 
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Originally Posted By: pyscodogOK, I'll say it. I'm just to lazy to mess with it.

Exactly.
Aint nobody got time fo dat!

(but I do applaud your enthusiasm. I myself have to make brass for my 6.5saum and 22 creedmoor. To me, the juice I get from those chamberings is worth the "squeeze", but not for a factory chambering.)
 
Little different, but I just formed .350 Remington Magnum brass from 7mm Mag. brass. I have plenty of new factory .350 Rem. Mag. brass, but just wanted to have another option on brass. Was also looking at forming 6.5mm Remington Magnum out of the 7mm Mag., it can be done but not quite as easily as the .350.
 
Paul Bike over on Accurateshooter.com sells some fantastic form die sets, if you like to play.

I took 308 military brass down to the 6 XC size. The neck was .425 long on the formed case. Necks on the SAAMI 6 XC was in the are of .300(I can't say exactly, using this as an example). So, I ordred a Neck only reamer from PGT, cut a .400 long neck in the chamber, then throated it .130 for using long 105g bullets.

There are some that claim that there is a "turbulance" point in front of the case' neck where a lot of powder and gases get blasted into the throat. The longer necks are "supposed" to contain the worst of the blast back inside the case instead of funneling into the barrel.

This is my experiment. After 900 rounds, I measured the throat dia growth, which was .0002. Leade had only grown .006! So, this long neck thing may have something to it....a lot of work and some pay off.
 
Originally Posted By: ackleymanPaul Bike over on Accurateshooter.com sells some fantastic form die sets, if you like to play.

I took 308 military brass down to the 6 XC size. The neck was .425 long on the formed case. Necks on the SAAMI 6 XC was in the are of .300(I can't say exactly, using this as an example). So, I ordred a Neck only reamer from PGT, cut a .400 long neck in the chamber, then throated it .130 for using long 105g bullets.

There are some that claim that there is a "turbulance" point in front of the case' neck where a lot of powder and gases get blasted into the throat. The longer necks are "supposed" to contain the worst of the blast back inside the case instead of funneling into the barrel.

This is my experiment. After 900 rounds, I measured the throat dia growth, which was .0002. Leade had only grown .006! So, this long neck thing may have something to it....a lot of work and some pay off.

Interesting! I recall "he who can't play here anymore" talking about measuring your specific neck chamber length for each weapon, and not trimming necks shorter than that. I'm with the OP on this since I haven't done it yet as a lot of you guys here have. Wanna do some 223 to 222 also.

Now, a question to those who have done this, to take the OP's question a bit further if I may - have you found it necessary to turn necks due to them becoming too thick for "generous" factory chambers? Just thinkin out loud. Maybe a lot of factory chambers arent that "generous" to begin with?
 
Mike,the neck will be thicker. It has been 20 years since I formed 222 from 223's. Perhaps a bushing die could accommodate the thicker neck, but uniformity maybe an issue, depending on your accuracy requirements. I turned the necks on mine, 2000 cases in a Winter project, 40x p.dog rifle.

Annealing would be a must.

I made a bunch of 221 FB from 223's, yes had to turn necks.

On a straight neck down with no neck turning, your neck dia would have to be in the neighborhood of .257...my memory maybe wrong on this, but I think that after the neck down, the necks were .015 thick?
 
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