25 wssm Range report

R

ricky_arthur

New member
I already showed a picture of it and yesterday I made a couple trip to the range for Break in, Sight-in and Load development.

I just got a new shooting rest, so I was trying that out also.

couple range pics.

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I started out load development by trying some lower pressure loads and working up as I was sighting in and breaking in the bbl. I didn't really care to see them on paper because I was simply checking to see if there were any pressure signs as I worked up to higher charge loads. The bullet I hoped to use was a 100gr Nosler Partition, my back up plan was a 100gr sierra pro hunter.

Max load was listed at 42.8 Gr varget. I shot 3 loads for the 100gr Nosler Partition with 3 shots each, just to guage potential.

Charges and velocities are ...
41.7gr 3052,3059,(no data chrono error)
42.0gr 2930(possible chrono error also),3099,and 3088
42.3 gr 3127,3124,3114.

The results were not too impressive, the 3rd shot on the 42.3 load was off the paper. There were no pressure signs but the bolt locked back on a loaded mag 4 times in 9 shots.
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The next loads with the SPH's were...
41.7 3119,3103,3104
42.0 3141,3169,3171
42.3 3187,3158,3162

These showed some promise, there were no pressure signs, but again the bolt locked back on a loaded mag. I unscrewed the Mag catch one turn and it happened one more time but then stopped.
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I returned home and loaded a few more of the sierra pro hunters at, 41.5, 41.8 and 42.5.

results were
41.5.3089,3096,3115
41.8 3107,3110,3112
42.5 3161,3169,3165 Pretty impressive ES on those last 2 loads.

Function was perfect with all of these loads and again they show some potential.

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42.5gr showed slight primer flatening, but very minor. I will load 5 more at each of the loads that showed promise and maybe 5 at Max load of 42.8 and try them tomorrow.

So far so good, I hope to have this rifle ready to go by deer season.

A couple notes, the shooting sled worked great and gave a very stable platform, sportsmans warehouse had them on sale for 49.95 last week and I'm glad I picked one up.

The vortex scope was very good except for one thing, the eye relief when at the max Power (20X) was very stingy, I had to move the mount back one slot on the rail even though it was perfect at low power when I mounted it. I was pleased with the PEPR mount, in that when I removed it and moved it back a notch, POI did not change.


Thats my results so far, I hope to dial it in tommorow.
 
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Nice Rifle
Just curious; are the loads your trying, loads that proved good for others or are you starting from scratch ?
Also if you don't mind, what is the model of the Sled, my brother needs one
Thanks
 
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Yep thats the rest. The scope is a Vortex Viper 6.5-20 X 44.

Hylander, The loads are from scratch, mainly because just because something works good in someone elses rifle is no idication of how well it will shoot in THIS rifle.
The 100gr Nolser partition was a recommendation from Mike at Dtech and he said it typically performs well in his 25 WSSM's, However, having tried it unsuccessfully in 3 WSSM uppers, it hasn't worked for me personally, which goes to prove my above point.
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The Sierra pro hunters have worked well for me in the 6.8 SPC, but I'm a little cautious as to how well they will hold up to the higher velocities of the wizzer on deer sized targets. The partition would have been a better hunting bullet but the accuracy so far has been abysmal with that bullet YMMV.

Ricky
 
Nice looking set-up all the way around! I have had a couple of the 25wssm and they have always shot well with H4350 and the 95gr Nosler BT's with a CCI LR mag primer, I've never had any luck with Varget either.... The Scope looks great on the rifle too..
 
Ricky,

When I had my Dtech 25 wssm, I had better luck with the 115 grain partitions and IMR 4350. See if you can get some of those.

Also, I have that same Vortex. While the tracking and clarity is great for the price, the eye relief at only 3" (and if that) is less than desirable. Mine sits on a .22lr and I may get another for a .223.
 
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Now I'm curious, why is it that everyone USED to have a 25 WSSM? Why did you not keep them?

Also I would agree I think the stated 3 inch eye relief is exaggerated.
 
My decision to sell was purely economical. I loved that upper and still do. It did take a while to figure out some powder/bullet combos but I battled through it. After having it a few years and killing a few things, it sat in my safe as new builds came in and new ideas for builds came to mind. Since it was sitting and the thrill was over for me, I sold it to fund another build.
 
Originally Posted By: BBsteelMy decision to sell was purely economical. I loved that upper and still do. It did take a while to figure out some powder/bullet combos but I battled through it. After having it a few years and killing a few things, it sat in my safe as new builds came in and new ideas for builds came to mind. Since it was sitting and the thrill was over for me, I sold it to fund another build.


AHHH This I can Understand. I have thought of selling one of my 6.8 uppers to fund a 6DTI build. But I can't bear to do it.
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Very thorough report. You'll find something it likes...

to answer your questions, I shot the crap outta my 25Wizzer upper. It never was a real 'tackdriver', but it was accurate enought & sure kilt stuff. Could expect around an inch @ 100, with the occasional 'internet' group
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. My deer load was a 100gr TSX w/ VARGET @ 3125, IIRC. One thing I did determine, is that that rifle shot best with a hot load...

Not saying you should do anything potentially dangerous, just conveying what I found that may be of help.
As for not owning it anymore, I had Mike build me a .223Wizzer to try & something had to give. It's a nasty SOB & I like it, plus I'm weird about wanting to try off the wall rifles that burn barrels
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Also, I've got a .25DTI to play with, too. There still isn't another caliber in an AR-15 that will give you the pure smackdown that a .25Wizzer will...
 
Originally Posted By: knockemdown I've got a .25DTI to play with, too. There still isn't another caliber in an AR-15 that will give you the pure smackdown that a .25Wizzer will...

Thats why I have persisted. I thought several time about calling Mike and Asking him to just change it to a 25 DTI, but I know that as awesome as that round is,...it just isn't what a 25WSSM can be...If you can get them to shoot.
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I'm headed back to the range now and I will try a few more loads and report back.

Ricky
 
Well, Just got back. I picked up a friend on the way to the range and he was sighting in a 7mm-08. This range trip should be titled "The trouble with 3 shot groups".
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I tried 3 different Loads today, two with the Nosler partitions.(because I didn't want to give up on them) and one group of 5 on the load I though I might settle on for the sierra pro hunters.

First 3 shot group at 40.7gr varget with the Nosler Partition was about 1.5 inches.

Then I tried the 5 rounds with 41.8 varget and 100gr sierra Pro hunters. I loaded 3 in the magazine and shot 1, wrote down the chrono reading and picked up the brass for inspection. All looked well. I took shot 2, wrote down the chrono reading, picked up the brass and looked it over and returned to the scope.

"Wait, Did I miss the paper?"

My buddie looked through the spotting scope..."nope its in the same hole".

I took shot 3. Repeated my routine and looked through the scope. "wait, that's in the same hole too?

Buddie, "almost"
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I had to walk down range and take a pic just for fun.
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I loaded the last 2 rounds in the mag, determined to finish the 5 shot group but with high hopes that I had my load.
I took shot 4, wrote the data, inpected the brass and looked through the scope.

"Danggit" low and Right.

settled in for shot 5.

"Crap" high Left, my great 3 shot group had turned into a craptastic 1.50 inch group

Guess I don't have my load after all
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This is why I don't use 3 shot groups for load evaluation, I've seen it before.

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I finished with the Nosler partion load at 41.0 Varget and it was right at 2 inches...sigh the struggle continues
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I wish I had a magazine that held 5 rounds, so i could shoot a continuous string without moving everything about.

Guess I'll try some IMR4350

 
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Ricky, I'm telling ya man, I ran 100 grain tsx and 100 grain partitions with varget and IMR 4350 and never did get them to settle down under 1.7" or so. I had one group at 1" but couldn't repeat it. Not that paper pumching means the world to hunting....I personally have fun doing it.

I read somewhere on here of a guy having success with 115 nosler partitions. I had some and gave them a try and found a load that would produce 1" groups. I could have kept playing with that load but didn't.
 
Originally Posted By: BBsteelRicky, I'm telling ya man, I ran 100 grain tsx and 100 grain partitions with varget and IMR 4350 and never did get them to settle down under 1.7" or so. I had one group at 1" but couldn't repeat it. Not that paper pumching means the world to hunting....I personally have fun doing it.

I read somewhere on here of a guy having success with 115 nosler partitions. I had some and gave them a try and found a load that would produce 1" groups. I could have kept playing with that load but didn't.

AWWW Man, don't tell me that. LOL

I'f I can't get consistently below 1 MOA I will not be happy. This isn't a 500$ off the rack production rifle here, I have high expectations.

I am avoiding the heavier bullets for the simple reason that the longer and heavier they are, the more magnified the handicap of a magazine COAL restriction comes into play. I might try a 110gr bullet. Interesting that Nosler does not even list IMR 4350 as an option for their 100gr bullets.

I just loaded up loads with IMR 4350 and H380 with Nosler partition, Nosler ballistic tip and Sierra pro hunters and one more with varget just to try that load one more time. I'll try again tommorrow. Something has got to work.
 
Got any RL 17? Try 47 gr RL17 with that 100 grain Sierra.

I also had good luck with 51 gr RL17 with an 80 gr TTSX, and 75 gr Vmax.

I'm starting over with a new barrel, I had Mike upgrade my SUM to the Shilen. I just got it back yesterday, but have had it to the range twice! What a beauty, this thing is sweet, and with 22 rounds down the tube I have yet to see more than a smear of copper on a patch. The upgrade was well worth it, I have a feeling this one is here to stay.

Anyway Ricky, not trying to steal your thread, but we're about in the same boat. My last group this afternoon was 4 shots within about 1/2", but one shot was a flier. That may have been my fault. 75 gr Vmax with 50.8 gr RL17.
 
Originally Posted By: 204 ARGot any RL 17? Try 47 gr RL17 with that 100 grain Sierra.

I also had good luck with 51 gr RL17 with an 80 gr TTSX, and 75 gr Vmax.

I'm starting over with a new barrel, I had Mike upgrade my SUM to the Shilen. I just got it back yesterday, but have had it to the range twice! What a beauty, this thing is sweet, and with 22 rounds down the tube I have yet to see more than a smear of copper on a patch. The upgrade was well worth it, I have a feeling this one is here to stay.

Anyway Ricky, not trying to steal your thread, but we're about in the same boat. My last group this afternoon was 4 shots within about 1/2", but one shot was a flier. That may have been my fault. 75 gr Vmax with 50.8 gr RL17.

Feel free to join the thread and keep me posted as to how your load development goes. It looks like you are looking for Coyote loads with the v-max bullets?? I plan on using this one strictly for deer so I'm trying a little heavier bullets than you are.

This BBl was full of copper the first 2 times I cleaned it, after the first range session I spent over an hour on it before it came out clean (not counting the multiple cleanings during sighting in). Tonight when I cleaned it, it took 8-10 patches with Butches Bore Shine to get a clean patch so it was an improvement. I think I may try a different solvent, I've tried Montana Extreeme copper killer, Hoppes and Butches bore shine and Butches seems to clean the BBl Faster, but maybe I'll see if I can't find something better.

Anyway keep me posted on your load progress and post up some pics.

Ricky
 
I'm all in in this thread also. Had my 25wssm for about a month now. I've only made it to the range twice. The first was to break in the barrel. Used some loads I bought from a PM member. Almost put a five shot group in the same hole. That load turned out to be 41.5 grs of varget pushing a 100gr Nosler ballistic tip. CCI mag primers. I posted the target a while back

Since then I've tried 75 gr vmax with 45.5 varget with no luck. Also Berger 100gr soft point and Berger 90gr hollow point. Both with 4350 and varget. Also no luck.

Keep me posted fellas. Ill be watching this thread like a hawk. Hope it gets better for ya Ricky. You'll dial one in here eventually.
 
Ricky keep it up, The 25 WSSM is a Tack Driver you just got to find the right combo. If I could only have 1 powder in the world it would be varget, but thank God its not. I have found Vihtavuori 560 works the best for me and I prefer the 117 grain bullets.

You can see here the work up using N-560 and 117SST. These are mild loads. I was looking for accuracy load.

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here is a closeup of the last target on the page.

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Here is the 87 grain Sierra Varminters and IMR 4350.

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another mild load with the N-560 117 Sierra Prohunters

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I have been having my 25 whizzer since 2005 and don't have any plans to part with it.
 
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That's some good shooting. I have awalys wanted a wizzer, but it seems like they are alot harder to get to shoot than most calibers in the ar. 25 DTI is trying hard to make my list
 
Originally Posted By: sigprosThat's some good shooting. I have awalys wanted a wizzer, but it seems like they are alot harder to get to shoot than most calibers in the ar. 25 DTI is trying hard to make my list

The WSSM's are more difficult to develop loads for than most other calibers fired from an AR simply because they are more over-bore by far than most calibers fired from an AR. It really doesn't matter what you fire it from, an over-bore cartridge is must more difficult to develop a load for than a non-over-bore cartridge.

Take the .223/5.56 as an example: It's fairly easy to load for. Most folks, whether they are shooting an AR or a bolt-action, can find a load that will shoot good. When I say "shoot good" I mean one that accurate when it's hot, cold, clean-bore dirty-bore, day in and day out. Now, take the 6 x 45, simply a .223/5.56 case necked-up to 6mm, pretty much any bullet/powder combination will shoot pretty good, and with just a little adjustment, you can easily have a load that is scary accurate. Now lets go the other way. Let's take the .17 Remington. Pretty much the same case-capacity, but a much smaller bore. Now there are folks that may have developed a load for a .17 Remington without any problem, but I can assure you that there are plenty of folks that have struggled with it.

You can follow this same phenomenon throughout a huge range of cartridges with similar case-capacities, but varying bore-capacities. The less over-bore cartridges are always easier to load for, less fickle, less spiky.

While I was growing up, my father built custom guns, and did general gunsmithing. As soon as I could walk I was a permanent fixture in his shop. I have literally been hand-loading all of my life. When I started hand-loading for the .243 WSSM, it blind-sided me. I though for sure I had a problem with my optics or barrel, but not so. That upper turned out to shoot great, once I found the load it liked.

And yes, the .25 DTI is far from over-bore, and about as simple as it gets to load for, But like Knock-m-Down said, if you want horsepower, the .25 WSSM is the ticket.
 


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