AR10 7WSM?
- Thread starter Hoier
- Start date
I've been reading and researching this for about 4 months now.
A WSM and 168VLD in an AR10 mag...No. However, if they make the 7mmSAUM it will be a lot more likely due to the shorter case length.
Here's your numbers. WSM Case is 2.1" and the ogive on the 168VLD is .763" meaning that if you loaded the round with the bullet seated ALL The way down to the ogive (less than ideal for accuracy) you'd have a COAL of 2.863" and 2.8 is considered the max for AR10 mags.
HERE ARE THE REAL FUN NUMBERS
SAUM case length is 2.035 (could be trimmed to 2.015 safely) and 180VLD has an ogive at .764" meaning that you'd get an OAL of 2.799 AND if I run my VLD PMAG mod I can likely gain an extra .15" of seating depth taking it out to roughly 2.95"
Still not ideal, but very very tempting.
If they make a SAUM, I'm all on board. If they go with the WSM, I'll pass and have a custom build done.
AND, SAUM achieves about 98-99% the velocity of the WSM and uses less 7% LESS powder to do it.
A WSM and 168VLD in an AR10 mag...No. However, if they make the 7mmSAUM it will be a lot more likely due to the shorter case length.
Here's your numbers. WSM Case is 2.1" and the ogive on the 168VLD is .763" meaning that if you loaded the round with the bullet seated ALL The way down to the ogive (less than ideal for accuracy) you'd have a COAL of 2.863" and 2.8 is considered the max for AR10 mags.
HERE ARE THE REAL FUN NUMBERS
SAUM case length is 2.035 (could be trimmed to 2.015 safely) and 180VLD has an ogive at .764" meaning that you'd get an OAL of 2.799 AND if I run my VLD PMAG mod I can likely gain an extra .15" of seating depth taking it out to roughly 2.95"
Still not ideal, but very very tempting.
If they make a SAUM, I'm all on board. If they go with the WSM, I'll pass and have a custom build done.
AND, SAUM achieves about 98-99% the velocity of the WSM and uses less 7% LESS powder to do it.
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It would be quite do-able with the SAUM as C bass said. You could have an upper built to your specs using a reamer of your specs as well. That way, you would be able to utilize every last bit of design-ability into the system. Meaning, you could potentially put the bullets mag length, into the lands, or optimize capacity or whatever. There are more than a few good builders out there that would easily accommodate your request. It might be a little pricey, but rest assured it will always shoot better than you.
KAG
New member
Have you looked at all at the 338 and 300 RCM? The numbers coming out of a 20" barrel make it something to look at. I would think simply necking down the 300 RCM to 7mm would be fairly straight forward.
You might want to take a look at http://www.ar15performance.com/
He has been working with the RCM cartridges in AR10 format.
You might want to take a look at http://www.ar15performance.com/
He has been working with the RCM cartridges in AR10 format.
I'd start (and hopefully finish) with George Gardener at GA Precision. He has plenty of experience with the AR10 platform, not sure about the 7SAUM case though. It certainly wouldn't hurt to ask. If he'll do it, no reason to look any further, period. I don't have anything done by him, but have a couple buddies that have him do everything. There isn't anything that I've seen done by either himself or his crew that isn't absolutely top shelf, and shoot itty bitty groups with astonishing regularity.
Hoier
New member
Originally Posted By: esorensenI'd start (and hopefully finish) with George Gardener at GA Precision. He has plenty of experience with the AR10 platform, not sure about the 7SAUM case though. It certainly wouldn't hurt to ask. If he'll do it, no reason to look any further, period. I don't have anything done by him, but have a couple buddies that have him do everything. There isn't anything that I've seen done by either himself or his crew that isn't absolutely top shelf, and shoot itty bitty groups with astonishing regularity.
That's what I've heard about him also.
That's what I've heard about him also.
knockemdown
New member
A 7SAUM might run close to a 7WSM, but you'll be running higher pressure in that smaller case to do it. No free lunch, that velocity comes at a price...
There are already 300SAUM AR-10s on the market, so a 7SAUM shouldn't be a problem.
NO doubt, GAP can do ya a 7Shamu on an AR-10. Same work, different reamer, so I can't see an 'up charge' for a Shamu over a .260.
Ya get what ya pay for from a GAP rifle. The fit & finish is TOP notch, and they indeed do shoot bugholes. Ask me how I know!
Of course, you could look into a 7WSSM from Dtech and run if off a AR-15. Case capacity will be limited from seating those long boolits down to mag length though. So it most likely won't hang with a 7 Shamu, but may be closer in performance to a 7-08. That's just a SWAG though...
There are already 300SAUM AR-10s on the market, so a 7SAUM shouldn't be a problem.
NO doubt, GAP can do ya a 7Shamu on an AR-10. Same work, different reamer, so I can't see an 'up charge' for a Shamu over a .260.
Ya get what ya pay for from a GAP rifle. The fit & finish is TOP notch, and they indeed do shoot bugholes. Ask me how I know!
Of course, you could look into a 7WSSM from Dtech and run if off a AR-15. Case capacity will be limited from seating those long boolits down to mag length though. So it most likely won't hang with a 7 Shamu, but may be closer in performance to a 7-08. That's just a SWAG though...
Pricy, indeed. I don't believe that the sun rises and sets over the house that George built, however, I can assure you that whatever comes out the door will be the absolute best it could possibly be. It may be cliche, but in this instance, you do get what you pay for. For my friends that own GA gear, what they pay for is the peace of mind that the ability of the equipment will eclipse their own each and every time they pull the trigger.
Originally Posted By: esorensenthe absolute best it could possibly be. so is GAP the ONLY PLACE that can build anything the best it could possibly be? I'm not trying to take anything away from GAP, they've got a proven track record, but to think others can't or couldn't is just silly.
GAP = 3/4 MOA Guarantee for minimum $2500
Accuracy Systems = sub 3/4 MOA Guarantee, Upper quoted at $1400
(a 3/4 guarantee is nothing special these days either)
Originally Posted By: knockemdownThere are already 300SAUM AR-10s on the market, so a 7SAUM shouldn't be a problem.
NO doubt, GAP can do ya a 7Shamu on an AR-10. Same work, different reamer, so I can't see an 'up charge' for a Shamu over a .260.
Of course, you could look into a 7WSSM from Dtech and run if off a AR-15. Case capacity will be limited from seating those long boolits down to mag length though. So it most likely won't hang with a 7 Shamu, but may be closer in performance to a 7-08. That's just a SWAG though...
Unless thay have a steady supply of bolts, they'd need to either make some from scratch, or get some. I already tried getting one from Armalite and they said they are out forever. Checked with DPMS as well and they never reply to us lowly peons.
Cutting a barrel is no big deal, its getting a hold of a bolt that is the problem. If they are just doing a 1 off, then that will cost extra no doubt.
The 7mmWSSM just about a lost cause if you're even considering the bullets that I am looking at. You'll have the ogive burred so far in the case it would probably fall inside.
GAP = 3/4 MOA Guarantee for minimum $2500
Accuracy Systems = sub 3/4 MOA Guarantee, Upper quoted at $1400
(a 3/4 guarantee is nothing special these days either)
Originally Posted By: knockemdownThere are already 300SAUM AR-10s on the market, so a 7SAUM shouldn't be a problem.
NO doubt, GAP can do ya a 7Shamu on an AR-10. Same work, different reamer, so I can't see an 'up charge' for a Shamu over a .260.
Of course, you could look into a 7WSSM from Dtech and run if off a AR-15. Case capacity will be limited from seating those long boolits down to mag length though. So it most likely won't hang with a 7 Shamu, but may be closer in performance to a 7-08. That's just a SWAG though...
Unless thay have a steady supply of bolts, they'd need to either make some from scratch, or get some. I already tried getting one from Armalite and they said they are out forever. Checked with DPMS as well and they never reply to us lowly peons.
Cutting a barrel is no big deal, its getting a hold of a bolt that is the problem. If they are just doing a 1 off, then that will cost extra no doubt.
The 7mmWSSM just about a lost cause if you're even considering the bullets that I am looking at. You'll have the ogive burred so far in the case it would probably fall inside.
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KAG
New member
Originally Posted By: cbass16Sent them an email 2 weeks ago with no response. 7mm RCM didn't quite tickle me the way the 7mmSAUM did. Not only that, I haven't found much published data on a 7mm RCM to make comparisons with.
You are not going to find a lot of data...its a newer wildcat
.....have you looked at the data with the 300 RCM, SAUM, and WSM and compared them with the barrels lengths they are using. The 300 RCM is using 20" and the rest are using 24" barrels.
You are not going to find a lot of data...its a newer wildcat
.....have you looked at the data with the 300 RCM, SAUM, and WSM and compared them with the barrels lengths they are using. The 300 RCM is using 20" and the rest are using 24" barrels.