Eastern Coyotes

A

AlphaDog

New member
I hunt the Eastern Coyotes, and as you guess they are bigger then the western cousin for they bred with timber wolfs and they have learned to keep quiet. I can't get them to howl

question is.......how do you call them?....how do you hunt them?....more info on hunting the eastern coyote.

Thank you,

AlphaDog
 
Hello Alpha dog and welcome to the board.

A lot of begining easterners have the same thoughts or misconceptions you do. The eastern coyote is the same animal as the one in the west.Food availability and close proximity to man are what make them diferent as well as the diferent terrain we have here. They all respond well to calls if you can get yourself in the right place at the right time.

The main key to hunting them in the east is learning how they use the ground you have in your part of ohio.Where they go and when. The where they go is the hard part. It takes a lot of time and some worn shoeleather to learn this.Your probably going to start with yoru deer scouting real soon if not already, pay close attention to the creekcrossings and old road beds , anywhere there is bare ground that will hold a track.Keep an eye out for droppings at these same places. Keep notes and map it all on paper or in your mind. You'll soon see a patttern coming together on the types of places they travel.

Territories for groups are still fairly large here, 20 to 25 square miles.Roughly an area 3 miles wide by 8 miles long. the size of most feeder stream drainages.You can only hear them if they are within a mile and a half to two miles of you when they howl.The rolling terrain is the problem with hearing, sound doesn't travel well here.They only howl about once an hour during the night.You need several listening posts within several miles of road and listen at each one at diferent times of the night or use a howler to get a response.

The right places to call from need to be where the coyote will be comfortable coming to the call.Fencerows woodlots, creek banks, even a ditch running out from the woods into a field.They need the close cover as a security blanket of sorts. They know they can disapear in a second if something isn't right.

Once you call the first one you'll be hooked. Confidence comes with each one taken and knowledge comes with each one missed. They will be your best teachers. Good luck and keep asking questions. Jimmie
 
ALPHA DOG: JIMMIE IN KY is correct in his description of successful hunting techniques of the Eastern Coyote,however,the blanket statement that it is the same animal is not completely factual and I'm not trying to start an argument here or criticize him. As the Western Coyote migrated to my area (NEW ENGLAND) they came by way of Canada and Michigan interbreeding with Wolves along the way. Any state biologist in NEW HAMPSHIRE will tell you that EVERY coyote shot in our state has Wolf DNA. Thus, they are bigger,bolder,and they even tend to "pack up" rather than being two or three animals in a group. They use the juveniles as decoys to lure unsuspecting family pets into wisely set ambushes by adult coyotes. I shot a 45 pound female during Turkey season and she was no more than 2 1/2 years old. I think the state record is about 75 pounds and that was a male. Some of these things even look like Wolves. As far as what he said about habitat,techniques,etc., I have no differences with the guy's points. Believe it or not,Coyote attacks on family pets and even children playing in their own yards are not unheard of. A Coyote den was found on Cape Cod of all places with about two dozen pet collars in there. And not far from there a woman had to chase one off with a shovel that had her son trapped on a swing set. Our Fish and GAME DEPT gets calls all the time about "Wolf" sightings and the people all swear it was too big to be a Coyote. Anyway, there are some differences that ought to be noted.
 
Thats what I heard with the coyotes here in ohio. They bred with timber wolves and are bigger. A guy even says they're trying to stock wolves in ohio without the public knowing it.(just what I heard)

And thank you for the help. I'll be doin what you guys said. It sounds good to make a map and put where I find sign. Never thought about doin that.

AlphaDog
 
We have grey wolves in Upper Michigan, they may make their way down to Ohio in the near future. So make sure it's a coyote you are shooting at. It seems like every year someone shoots a grey wolf in Michigan thinking it was a coyote. Let me know how the Coyote hunting is in Ohio, i would like to take a trip down there sometime.
good luck this fall,
Nigel-
 
The coyote ,wolf ,and dog all share a common dna. This is why their offspring are fertile. The closer the gene pool the more apt they will do so. In the equine family burros and horses have a dna link but because of it's distance in the past the offspring are for the most part infertile.

I don't doubt that there are some wolf crosses around in the northeast. One thing we noticed here was that as time passed the size got smaller.Territories also shrank considerably during this time.I have killed two over fifty pounds myself back in the late eighties. The average size here today is down around forty pounds. This is one ofthe reasons I think population density has more to do with size than anything.Less population more food available.Coyote's here also have a tendancy to pack up on occassion as well. In every case of pack behavior I've found or heard of it was for the purpose of bringing down larger game such as calves or deer.This is not a dumb animal we are dealinfg with.When I see some of the things they do in order to survive I have to tip my hat to them. I even know of one that figured out how to short out an electric fence.All those sheep and goats gave her a beautiful winter coat /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif she didn't get to keep it though.

A lot of these so called studies are done by folks wishing to use them too further the animal rights movement. Some folks in Mass. are doing just that to try and stop coyote hunting claiming that because of this dna combo that they are the extinct eastern wolf that once roamed throughout the eastern woodlands.

I love this little box of wires. It has enabled me to find all these little tid bits of info scattered around here and there.Did you know that the most outstanding coyote expert in Mass is an animal rights activist and gets his name in the papers there quite often.I have quite a few of his articles here printed out somewhere.He seems to be a bit upset because some folks want to kill his Cape Cod coyote's for attacking a few kids.He happens to be touting this wolf bull quite a bit himself. Jimmie
 
Hey guys,
When is a coyote really a coyote?
This question has been hashed and rehashed for a long time. Who CARES! The only true test I know of is done using DNA samples. I've seen a few domestic dogs that look like a coyote and a few coyotes that looked like the family dog. We must always try to use good judgment.

I know for a fact most of the coyotes now around here came directly from out west. The ancestors of our areas current coyote population arrived in stock trailers pulled by big semi-trucks via I-40 at the rate of about 70 M.P.H. You see, about three decades ago, coyotes were imported in a low key joint effort between the State of Tennessee and Bowater Paper Company. At the time, our native predator population was declining due to high fur prices, the use of DDT and other factors. The idea was to release a hardy predator, with low fur value, that would help the native predators eradicate pine shrews. These small mole like rodents will eat the tender bark and roots of young pine trees, killing the trees in the process. I guess you know paper is made from mature pine trees… no trees, no paper, no Bowater . Some of the people who released stock trucks full of coyotes on Bowater property, I know.
Up until about thirty years ago there were few coyotes here then one day coyotes started showing up all over. Large migration pattern, I guess. Today, the southern pine beetle has all but wiped out our pines. The shrews have starved and the coyotes are here to stay.
 
The interbreeding of coyotes and wolves is the exception rather than the rule. All studies done have concluded that lone male wolves have on occasion, when a female wolf isn't available, will breed with a female coyote. No evidence has been found that male coyotes will breed with female wolves. Lake Huron/Superior has a pack of wolves that have been found to contain coyote mitochondrial DNA. Wolves in captivity will freely mate with female coyotes, but that has more to do with availability than a natural occurrence. Wolves view coyotes as competition and a threat to pups, not as a quickie. I'd like to see the study that suggests that EVERY eastern coyote possesses wolf mitochondrial DNA. I've never seen or heard of such an animal.

Red Wolves have been thought to be a hybrid of a Prairie/Gray Wolf and a Coyote, Red Wolves are of course very endangered.

DNA

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ATTN. BOB/SO CAL: My statement was that every Coyote killed in NEW HAMPSHIRE had Wolf DNA,it was not a blanket statement about all Eastern Coyotes.As far as anything south of NEW ENGLAND I can't speak about their Coyotes as I really don't know much about them.Keep in mind there are three NEW ENGLAND states that border Canada. Remember, we are way up here in the Northeast and my statement could be easily verified with one phone call to NEW HAMPSHIRE FISH & GAME WILDLIFE DIVISION. Although I've never seen an actual "study" on the subject it has been written about in just about every local outdoors publication and most newspapers in our area. And if you've ever seen the size of some of these animals you wouldn't doubt my claims.

ATTN JIMMIE IN KY: You seem to be very knowledgable about Coyotes in my part of the country, I know the stories you speak of very well concerning Cape Cod. I appreciate you confirmation of my stories about the Coyotes being a little bit different around here. Hope to see another eloquent and interesting post from you soon.
 
in indentifying wolves and coyotes.....dont wolves carry their tails higher and coyotes carry their tails lower or someting? And which would you say be smarter?
 
And one more thing. I also (heard) that wolves became instinct around here because they couldn't fit in with the small woods and all the houses. Or other words they weren't very adaptible to the changes compared to the coyote. If they start releasing wolves again, won't they go extinct again because of that?
 
The one thing that gives the coyote away is the way his body is made. It is the only north american predator built wiht shoulders higher than the hips.Wolves dogs and foxes are level along the length of the spine.This trait gives the coyote away every time.

I read some of the same studies that Bob has read.Either species during expansion will breed with the other if they cannot find a mate of their own kind.These cases are rare and where the reason for the coydogs in the early expansion here as well.There have been no coydog crosses seen here for quite some time, at least a decade.

I have no doubt that the wolf could once again thrive in the east.They are a big game hunter and the deer herd is once again at levels high enough to support them.Their only conflict would be wiht man and his cattle.

I have been keeping up wiht the animal rights movement for a long time now.The predator expert on the west coast works nine to five and lives in a city.Rarely gets out of it in fact. Peter Trull is an ornithologist , I think that is a fancy name for a bird watcher.He has the east coast wrapped up. Fellows like these are dangerous because they know how to use the media.It doesn't matter that they know enough about the animals they talk about. They sound good on paper.Trull gets himself hooked up with any study he can. Even a college kid working on a thesis.At least Trull does get out and watch and study them some.Jimmie
 
my first experience with an eastern(new york)coyote was the winter of 1980,since then i have been obsessed with hunting them and learning more about them.i have seen them do some amazing things and i deffinetly believe they are more pack oriented then there western cousins.they are more of a thinking(as a group) predator then there western couterpart.they will acualy work to gether to bring down prey.i once witnessed two coyotes(in the dead of winter)sneaking out into a open field where there were about 30 deer feeding.it struck me as unusal that they came from the road,heading towards the woods.these coyotes were about 100 yards apart and easing straight at the deer.i'm sure the deer knew they were there for they were begining to get agitated and nervous.at about 200 yards distance from the deer,they took off at a dead run striaght at them.needless to say the deer hauled but straight for the woods.when they hit the wood line they suddenly made a hard left and began to scatter.then i relized why,there were 5 more coyotes waiting in the woods for them.this tactic didn't pan out for the coyotes this time but i'm sure it did many times before.the snow was just a little to deep and the deer had the edge.this was one of those times i chose not to shoot but rather sit,watch and learn.i was about 300 yards on the down wind side and watched this whole thing go down(with no video camera)this was no dought a thinking pack of coyotes.i have seen and heard about many other amazing tactics the eastern coyote uses.are they part wolf?? as a general rule any self respecting wolf will kill a coyote on sight but i do believe at some point in there migration east that they inerbread.i have seen just about every color combonation you can imagine on the coyotes around me.many of them are the normal tan,black and brown color that is so coyote.but on the other hand i have seen many different color phases on them, black,black and white,all gray,gray and white,black gray and white and red ,white and brown all red and white like a red fox and so on. many of the odd ball colored ones have extremly long hair.now this is deffinetly not a western coyote trait.but the wolf does possess this color shifting trait in all areas where they live.but i am not a biologist so this is just an opinon and ya know what they say about opinons.
 


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