Knives at China Mart

O

Ozark Charlie

New member
After supper wife had to go to China-Mart (Wal-Mart) for who knows what. While she was looking I went to sporting goods to look for a new pocket knife. Looking at Gerber Knives and saw the dreaded "made in China" pox on the back. Put it back and got my hands on a Buck. Same darn thing! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smiliesmack.gif
I knew things were bad, but Buck and Gerber. Say it ain't so. Does anyone know if all of their knives are now made by slave labor or just those they market through China-Mart.
Ozark Charlie
 
I thought Buck Knives were moving to Post Falls, Idaho? And making there knives there. Hope what you saw ain't so.
 
Buck did move to Idaho and still offers their same American made knives. They also now offer a lower priced line for Wal-Mart made in China. Buck diversified their product line as so many, many, other knife companies have done for years. I actually bought one of their Wal-Mart Cutback/Hilo models so I could rip on it, and was surprised at the quality of the dang thing. I bought it because I so disliked the "China" stamping on the blade, now I dislike it because it's made so damn well I can't find fault with it.
 
To the fullest extent possible, I always look for origin of manufacture. I will always buy "Made in USA". /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif That is becoming increasingly more difficult. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif
 
Quote:
To the fullest extent possible, I always look for origin of manufacture. I will always buy "Made in USA". /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif That is becoming increasingly more difficult. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif



People vote with their wallets. And people want cheaper products, which the US is unable/unwilling to produce so countries like China will happily step in and take the money.
 
The company I work for is going chinese piece by piece and I foresee a giant warehouse full of "made in China" in the next 10 years where a factory once stood. The reason for this is the same as what BroncoGlenn has already explained quite well. Labor cost in the US are astronomical compared to china!
Luckily I work in the warehouse and even the china men need somebody to ship their stuff here in the USA. That's my only bright spot.

FM
 
About a month ago I had to replace the radiator in my '94 Z-71. After some searching around I found a replacement at Advance that was, you guessed it, MADE IN CHINA. No thanks! I searched around some more and found an American made Modine radiator and, on the advice of my mechanic, bought it.

Here's the kicker. Both had full lifetime warranties, but the Modine was a full $100 cheaper than the MADE IN CHINA brand.

Go figure that one.

My mechanic said that, based on his experience, the Modine was far superior to the Chinese option too. He had actually suggested that I search for one in the first place.
 
Quote:
Buck did move to Idaho and still offers their same American made knives. They also now offer a lower priced line for Wal-Mart made in China. Buck diversified their product line as so many, many, other knife companies have done for years. Quote:


Thanks for the info. I suspected something like that. My wife worked in one of the buyer division for 20 years. Most people don't realize, that Wal-Mart often gets manufacturers to cheapen their products to sell at a lower price. A name brand boot at Wal-Mart may NOT be the same book quality wise as an identical looking boot selling for a bit more at a sporting retailer. Even shotguns shells, their low price promotional shells, are not the same shells sold by many dealers though they appear to be the same.
When buying from Wal-Mart, let the buyer beware!
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gifOC
 
OC: A special product run for a large retailer is not unusual. The way to tell is by a slightly different model number of the item. Pretty much a necessity by the manufacturer to avoid problems with its other retailer that have price match policies. Since price match policies are restricted to the same item, and if the model # of the product is appended with an A or such, it technically isn't the same model so other retailers wouldn't be stuck with having to match a price. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
Bronco
What gets me is that while it is not dishonst, it is very shady. Because so many products, for instance a china made buck knife looks exactly like a non-china made knife at first glance. Someone not paying attention can buy a product thinking they are getting typical buck quality, when in reality they are getting somewhat less. They thought they are getting a good deal because of the low price, but they just did not get what they thought they were getting. But, hey, you don't get to the top of the food chain by using outmoded concepts like "fairness" and "ethics". At least not since Sam died.
OC
 
Quote:
Bronco
What gets me is that while it is not dishonst, it is very shady. Because so many products, for instance a china made buck knife looks exactly like a non-china made knife at first glance. Someone not paying attention can buy a product thinking they are getting typical buck quality, when in reality they are getting somewhat less. They thought they are getting a good deal because of the low price, but they just did not get what they thought they were getting. But, hey, you don't get to the top of the food chain by using outmoded concepts like "fairness" and "ethics". At least not since Sam died.
OC



You see, here's the thing, in the case of the Buck Chinese knife I bought - it's actually a great knife. That pains me to say that because I'm pretty much an "American Made" guy as much as possible. I'm also a "knife nutt" and have a large collection from about all the makers, including a couple of dozen custom knives, I moderate a knife forum on another website, and keep as up to date on knives as I possibly can. I bought the Buck to rip on the Chinese product and quite honestly can't fault the damn thing. Especially for the price, and that's an honest and fair statement. If it had been junk I'd have gleefully said so.
 

Add Browning and CKRT to the list of manufacturers that source some of their knives in China. The Chinese knives may look similar but there are significant differences in tempering with most Chinese knives being very brittle. At our store we have had numerous CKRT & Browning and Bucks brought back with snapped or chipped blades. The warranties were honored eventually, however, we have sold all Chinese sourced knives at cost and refuse to stock more.

Those that are price motivated may wish to consider the long term vs short term. It makes little sense, IMO, to pay the money needed to acquire a big game tag, set aside the time to hunt, outfit the hunt and, then, to skimp of the quality of the knife.

Given the plethora of high grade custom knives that are available that perform superbly, why risk the joy of a hunt on an inferior blade? One of the finest moderately priced custom knives available is from Gene Ingram who offers a range of models, custom features and choice of steels. His customer service is as good as his knives.

During season I guide elk, deer and bear hunters and the knives get a good workout not only for game prep but for all the other menial chores a good blade provides. Few mass produced knives that I have experienced can match the fit and service of a good custom knife.
 
Like so many products ... "made in the USA " doesn't really mean much anymore .... I make automotive parts "In the USA"....made of Japanese parts shipped over .
Could the knife companies be doing the reverse and shipping the componets over seas for the cheap assembly cost and shipping them back ?
This is all fair in the manufacturing world now-a-days ...it's called free trade ...and sucks that American Jobs are lost to it all !!!
 
Handloader,
I find the brittle blade comment significant. I know that Paul Bos is in charge of Buck's heat treatment on their blades. If that holds true for the Chineses knives then I'd doubt their brittleness. Bos is THE MAN regarding heat treatment! Now, if the Chinese are doing the heat treatment, then it could well be true. I sorta wonder if DmDuck has it right, the blades are shipped over to be assembled on the Chinese frames, ect... At this point I couldn't say regarding the China made Buck. It's 440C blade is reported to be heat treated to 58-60RC and seems to be holding it's edge well.

I totally agree about a quality knife. In fact, the best Buck's I have come from the Buck Custom Shop. I have three 110 folders from there with Stag, Elk, and Buffalo handles, Nickle bolsters and BG-42 blade steel. Ingram makes a nice enough fixed blade. I prefer my Bob Dozier knives with D2 and Dozier's world renown heat treatment. Best working knives around IMHO. Remember why I bought the Chinese Buck? To nitpick it apart. Surprisingly enough, I really can't find much to fault it. Will it replace my Microtech LCC or better grade Benchmades? Are my Custom Shop Buck's in jeopardy? Am I going to sell the dozen plus Bob Dozier knives for this China made knife? Nope... however, I am going to carry it fishing this week so when my wife ask to cut something I don't have to worry about her dropping it overboard. Or leaving some condiment on the blade when she slices her sandwich. Maybe it does have a place? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused1.gif I'm not argueing for it or against it, just an observation.
 
To each his own, but I really prefer a custom over any factory knife. Why? It is the edge holding, I've never seen a cheap knife that could hold with a custom..though there may be exceptions I'm not aware of. I've seen many guys struggle over keeping their knives sharp just to skin out a deer. I can skin out three knives with a custom knife, either stock removal or forged.
Gene Ingram was mentioned and he makes on hell of a custom for the money and he uses D-2, which is an excellent steel. I have two of his blades.
I currently carry a forged W-2 hunter that Craig Camerer made for me that is only 6 1/2" long and I wouldn't take anything for it. I carry the knife on a daily basis.
You can get those Chinese knives sharp but they just won't hold it. Just my two cents.
 
I decided to give a custom knife a try. Ordered from www.hideawayknife.com Can't comment on it though since I have yet to see it. It's been about three months I believe and probably another two or three at least remaining. The order status says it completed the water jet process and is awaiting a surface grind. Then it still needs to be edge ground, heat treated, ground again, sharpened, and have a sheath molded.

I can see how if you can't wait 6 months a knife fom wallyworld might fit the bill for the interm.
 
On the subject of knives, is there any way to sharpen a Gerber Ceramic. That is the worst knife I have ever owned. it held a factory edge for a while. but i can not sharpen it. I have tried diamond and stone. i have tried the lansky system. Nothing I have willput an edge on it. What should I do. Randy
 
Contact the maker and see if they offer a resharpening service. Those ceramic blades are nearly impossible to resharpen using the common methods other blade steels respond to. Ceramic will chip easily too so be careful around hard surfaces such as bone, ect...
 


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