Online Coyote Class with Geoff Nemnich

[hunt0168]

Interesting. Would you say they, eastern coyotes, need a bit more coaxing and time to come in? I know Geoff seems like he is more wam bam on to the next stand.

I would say you are more likely to hear an eastern coyote hunter say they are willing to stay on stand longer than the majority of hunters elsewhere. We get the ones that scream in within seconds or minutes just like out west, but often there’s an element of patience needed if you really want to kill one.

Many places here you can’t just park your truck, walk 100 yards and make a call. You might need to hoof it for 20 minutes to make a stand. Or climb a steep grade to get to a high meadow. Makes you a little more willing to spend some time.

The pressured coyotes in most places need more coaxing or simply silence for extended periods of time.

I am one of the people that think a coyote is a coyote no matter where they are. Driven by coyote instincts to eat, fight and breed. They are all survival specialists as well! That said, my feelings are that the same calls and basic fundamentals work everywhere. Food is food. They protect their territory. They need coyotes to breed and make more coyotes. They’re going to use their coyote instincts to try and survive by using the terrain and wind. We just adapt as they do to the environment that they’re living in. Heavy cover and smaller tracts of land adds some challenges to that here in the east.

 

[crapshoot]

The pressured coyotes in most places need more coaxing or simply silence for extended periods of time.

That's one i struggle with. I'd rather make more stands and up my odds that way than sitting extended periods of time in silence waiting for the possible 1. But I'm a western hunter and recreational at that.

 

[hunt0168]

That's one i struggle with. I'd rather make more stands and up my odds that way than sitting extended periods of time in silence waiting for the possible 1. But I'm a western hunter and recreational at that.

Yep CS, that seems to be the general consensus with western hunters, and even a bunch of eastern hunters. There’s no wrong way. Just whatever way you’re willing to put up with. Do you make stands where you hike in 20-30 minutes, and that is the only stand on the property? It’s mostly a geography thing. Throw in the smaller properties and fewer coyotes and you might be more patient here, or give up coyote hunting altogether?

 

[crapshoot]

Yep CS, that seems to be the general consensus with western hunters, and even a bunch of eastern hunters. There’s no wrong way. Just whatever way you’re willing to put up with. Do you make stands where you hike in 20-30 minutes, and that is the only stand on the property? It’s mostly a geography thing. Throw in the smaller properties and fewer coyotes and you might be more patient here, or give up coyote hunting altogether?

I rarely hike 200 yrds.

Some pretty good calling just off the highway even. Just hide the truck in the bar ditch , pop over the hill and start calling. There is always free food along the highways and they are use to hearing vehicles.

 

[hm1996]

What DoubleLungRag said!

 

[jmeddy]

Dane, 0168 stated my thoughts/experiences like a shadow for here in SW PA.

 

[Dane G]

Thanks guys for your insights. It’s always great to hear what works for other people in different areas.

 

[ChrisLD]

Could you elaborate a little on how your calling style differs from his? I'm not disagreeing with you, I'm just hoping to pick you brain and gain a little knowledge.

While I don’t want to divulge what has been taught to me/ I have learned on my own through years of failure in Swpa on a public forum, I will just say I don’t play distress… and I don’t call like many others do.


I’m sorry, I feel like I should share more but there are SO many coyote hunters and NEW coyote hunters in my state I just can’t be going into specifics on a public forum where anyone could read …


I’m not saying there is some secret I have that anyone else doesn’t, but I literally spent hundreds of hours having no success before things started to click for me on coyotes.

We don’t have anywhere near the coyotes they do in the west, and we have more hunters per capita than anywhere else in the country. It’s as competitive as it gets or ever has been in PA in the 20 years I have been night hunting.

 

[AWS]

Is his course interactive?

If you don't have a mentor, a course can be useful.

A lot of the stuff on YouTube is just kill shots with little info on why they selected the stand, how they found it, why they're using a specific sound, where they expect a coyote to come from and every show is structured to be filmed, you don't see great stands unless they can be filmed. I would say a large percentage of the stands I kill coyotes on wouldn't be conductive to filming. You have to wade through a lot of video to pick up useful stuff.

I'm surprised that other than TT I haven't heard of a hands on coyote calling class. A few state trappers asst. Have hands on classes, PA used to put out a very nice handbook.

 

[IlliniFan]

Is his course interactive?

If you don't have a mentor, a course can be useful.

A lot of the stuff on YouTube is just kill shots with little info on why they selected the stand, how they found it, why they're using a specific sound, where they expect a coyote to come from and every show is structured to be filmed, you don't see great stands unless they can be filmed. I would say a large percentage of the stands I kill coyotes on wouldn't be conductive to filming. You have to wade through a lot of video to pick up useful stuff.

I'm surprised that other than TT I haven't heard of a hands on coyote calling class. A few state trappers asst. Have hands on classes, PA used to put out a very nice handbook.

The website says 8+ hours of instructional video, live webinars with Geoff, 10 exclusive sounds from Rick Paillet, access to exclusive Last Stand episodes, and partnership discounts (I'm assuming Swagger bipods, etc.). Again though, I believe most of the listed course content is already covered on Geoff's podcast and the other perks are of minimal value to me.

I tend to agree with everyone here. I think $399 is on the high end since there is so much free information available. I do have a mentor I hunt with often but I'm always looking to learn something new. I read about every book, watch videos, and listen to every podcast I can find on coyote hunting and precision reloading. Hands-on, in the field, experience is always best but I try to pick up a few bits of information wherever I can. Now, if this was only $99 I'm sure I would've been more likely to sign up.

 

[DoubleLungRage]

While I don’t want to divulge what has been taught to me/ I have learned on my own through years of failure in Swpa on a public forum, I will just say I don’t play distress… and I don’t call like many others do.


I’m sorry, I feel like I should share more but there are SO many coyote hunters and NEW coyote hunters in my state I just can’t be going into specifics on a public forum where anyone could read …


I’m not saying there is some secret I have that anyone else doesn’t, but I literally spent hundreds of hours having no success before things started to click for me on coyotes.

We don’t have anywhere near the coyotes they do in the west, and we have more hunters per capita than anywhere else in the country. It’s as competitive as it gets or ever has been in PA in the 20 years I have been night hunting.

I'm not trying to be a butt. But you are about 15 years behind my man. With today's forums, FB groups, CIA, FBI, the Patriot ACT.... There are no secret spots or techniques.

 

[ChrisLD]

I'm not trying to be a butt. But you are about 15 years behind my man. With today's forums, FB groups, CIA, FBI, the Patriot ACT.... There are no secret spots or techniques.

Don’t know what it’s like where you live, but I disagree completely. I know MANY guys that hunt coyotes where I live. Probably close to 30 guys personally, and out of those 30 guys there are about 5 that kill account for hundreds each year while the rest get a handful…

 

[DoubleLungRage]

That's pretty much with any kind of hunting that I know of. It's usually the small hand full of guys that are truly dedicated to their passion. It usually comes down to they are the ones in the woods the most, learning the most, putting the most work back into the properties, etc.

Example. I know this guy who usually kills at least one very nice deer every year to two years. That's pretty unheard of in SC. I was talking with him one day and asked him, "man what's your secret". His reply was something like this... "I start hunting opening day and most of the time I hunt 7 days a week". So in his words, since he was in the woods a LOT more than most hunters, he was more successful.

 

[hunt0168]

While I don’t want to divulge what has been taught to me/ I have learned on my own through years of failure in Swpa on a public forum, I will just say I don’t play distress… and I don’t call like many others do.


I’m sorry, I feel like I should share more but there are SO many coyote hunters and NEW coyote hunters in my state I just can’t be going into specifics on a public forum where anyone could read …


I’m not saying there is some secret I have that anyone else doesn’t, but I literally spent hundreds of hours having no success before things started to click for me on coyotes.

We don’t have anywhere near the coyotes they do in the west, and we have more hunters per capita than anywhere else in the country. It’s as competitive as it gets or ever has been in PA in the 20 years I have been night hunting.

ChriLD, I’m not trying to pull any specifics from you about what you’re doing to be successful. But in the nature of conversation, and to go along with Dane’s initial question…

Do you think what you’re doing in PA would work elsewhere?

If the answer is yes, it probably supports my theory that coyotes are coyotes. If it’s no, then you have come up with something special and should consider starting a $500 online course of your own! Lol…

 

[ChrisLD]

For sure doublelungrage, effort in results in more success no doubt. This is especially true in coyote hunting, and trapping. Many times, he who has the most land, spends the most time, gets the most..


On highly pressured coyotes, you have to call differently to have success. I may have a 200 acre farm to hunt and be the only guy calling it, but 9 times out of 10 around here someone is calling the same coyotes accross the street, on the neighboring property, sneaking into the same place in at from a different access, etc.


The properties in PA are tiny compared to much of the country, and often times there are multiple guys calling individual properties.

Hunt0168, I think a guy that can kill 50+ a year in the east can easily kill 200+ in the west or Texas area. A coyote is a coyote, but when they get shot at by everyone that sees them, hunted by tons of inexperienced callers that educate them, trapped for 5 months a year, they become much smarter than coyotes that are walking around in broad daylight and will come into calls during the day like our west.

The same goes for trapping, one of my best friends is upper echelon k9 trapper and known accross the country. He can catch 50 here in a couple months, then go to Kansas or Nebraska and catch 15+ a day.


Hunting coyotes in the east is a completely different ballgame than calling them in with a squealing rabbit during daylight hours in the west. Tony Tebbe sais, a good coyote hunter in the east will absolutely slaughter them in the west. We all know his reputation, and he has lived/hunted coyotes extensively in both regions.


As for calling them, a lot of silence, a lot of getting into their bubble, a little vocals. I am in no way some master k9 killer, just a dude trying to learn as much as I can and be successful… oh yeah, did I mention having LAND. Between myself and a couple other pa friends/hunters I hunt with we have hundreds of permissions accross much of the western region of our state.


There’s a lot to be learned if your willing to ask the guys local to you that are the best… if they will teach you

 

[hunt0168]

ChrisLD, I’m with you buddy. Not much difference between what you’ve said and what I deal with here in NY. Well outside of the LAND access. I do not have hundreds of properties. There’s certainly pressure on the properties I have and surrounding properties of the ones I do have. I know full well that oftentimes less calling is more, and silence does kill. But time and time again you hear about turn and burn tactics to up the odds of success. For me that just doesn’t add up the way the proximity of each property is, and the how I have to setup on those properties. It isn’t a quick ordeal in most cases. That’s hard for big county hunters to understand I think.

I think one advantage I may have over PA hunters, if you want to call it an advantage, is that our coyotes get a 6 month break in the action. Our season just opened and if a guy has ground, right now can be the best calling of the year. 90% of my ground is covered in agriculture crops right now.

 

[DoubleUp]

That's pretty much with any kind of hunting that I know of. It's usually the small hand full of guys that are truly dedicated to their passion. It usually comes down to they are the ones in the woods the most, learning the most, putting the most work back into the properties, etc.

Example. I know this guy who usually kills at least one very nice deer every year to two years. That's pretty unheard of in SC. I was talking with him one day and asked him, "man what's your secret". His reply was something like this... "I start hunting opening day and most of the time I hunt 7 days a week". So in his words, since he was in the woods a LOT more than most hunters, he was more successful.

There isn't a substitute for time on task. Yes, you can pick up some pointers from the internet, books, dvd's, etc. But the hunter who is in the woods day after day (night after night) is always going to have the advantage. Trial and lots of error can be your best friend. Enjoy the successes and learn from the mistakes and forget that you can shortcut this process on the internet. If it was easy everybody could do it, and while many try, most fall by the wayside over time.

 

[jmeddy]

There isn't a substitute for time on task. Yes, you can pick up some pointers from the internet, books, dvd's, etc. But the hunter who is in the woods day after day (night after night) is always going to have the advantage. Trial and lots of error can be your best friend. Enjoy the successes and learn from the mistakes and forget that you can shortcut this process on the internet. If it was easy everybody could do it, and while many try, most fall by the wayside over time.

Perfectly said Owen! I am wondering if in couple years there will be a lot of $6000 scopes for sale.

 

[IlliniFan]

Perfectly said Owen! I am wondering if in couple years there will be a lot of $6000 scopes for sale.

For night hunting with thermal, I think there is such an increase in the number of new hunters because the advancements in technology have allowed for more and better thermal devices at significantly lower prices. This is good and bad. There isn’t as much of a barrier to entry. For serious nighttime predator hunters it would’ve probably been better if thermal scope prices stayed at $5-6K and up. Same for daytime hunters as there would be fewer hunters calling overall.

However, since there are so many more new hunters, there is a demand for training. And I’d rather have new hunters be interested enough to get some type of training even before they jump right into the field. That way they will be more successful while also not making as many mistakes and creating more of a challenge for everyone else.

 

[hm1996]

If the answer is yes, it probably supports my theory that coyotes are coyotes. If it’s no, then you have come up with something special and should consider starting a $500 online course of your own! Lol…

Great question.

On highly pressured coyotes, you have to call differently to have success.

Hunting coyotes in the east is a completely different ballgame than calling them in with a squealing rabbit during daylight hours in the west. Tony Tebbe sais, a good coyote hunter in the east will absolutely slaughter them in the west. We all know his reputation, and he has lived/hunted coyotes extensively in both regions.

This is a great continuation of the recent thread and another on differences between east and west hunting. Having never hunted the east, I still believe that a coyote is a coyote, but, and that is a big but, I also believe that the coyotes do adapt to their physical environment and also by pressure; different methods bring different results. For instance, on the larger properties I hunt year around, deer hunter pressure has a definite effect on coyotes behavior as compared to off season.

There’s certainly pressure on the properties I have and surrounding properties of the ones I do have. I know full well that oftentimes less calling is more, and silence does kill. But time and time again you hear about turn and burn tactics to up the odds of success. For me that just doesn’t add up the way the proximity of each property is, and the how I have to setup on those properties. It isn’t a quick ordeal in most cases. That’s hard for big county hunters to understand I think.

I've tried both short and longer stands and have found that, while some come in before 15 minutes, a lot more respond between 15 to 30 minutes where I hunt.

There isn't a substitute for time on task. Yes, you can pick up some pointers from the internet, books, dvd's, etc. But the hunter who is in the woods day after day (night after night) is always going to have the advantage. Trial and lots of error can be your best friend. Enjoy the successes and learn from the mistakes and forget that you can shortcut this process on the internet. If it was easy everybody could do it, and while many try, most fall by the wayside over time.

Bingo!