Primer interchangeability
- Thread starter newhornet
- Start date
Mark, I am not sure what your question means.
I am assuming you are looking in a manual and it says they used for example a winchester small rifle primer and you have CCi small rifle primers. can they be interchanged. Yes.
There are 4 major rifle primer categories.
Small rifle
Small rifle magnum
large rifle
large rifle magnum
If they tested with a small rifle primer, then any small rifle primer will work. I hope this answer is not too vague.
Hope this helps. Give us the background for the question. Randy
I am assuming you are looking in a manual and it says they used for example a winchester small rifle primer and you have CCi small rifle primers. can they be interchanged. Yes.
There are 4 major rifle primer categories.
Small rifle
Small rifle magnum
large rifle
large rifle magnum
If they tested with a small rifle primer, then any small rifle primer will work. I hope this answer is not too vague.
Hope this helps. Give us the background for the question. Randy
bea175
New member
If i am not mistaken you are asking if you can change brands of primers when loading the same load , bullet , powder charge and case after working a load up for your rifle. You can change brands of primer but most recommend you back off a couple of grains on the powder charge and work back up with the new primer, just to be safe. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-006.gif
Bayou City Boy
New member
newhornet:
One other thing to consider, especially with the small rifle primers. Some have thicker cups than others which aids in high pressure loads.
For example, I would not use a Winchester Small Rifle Primer to load a 17 Remington or a Tactical 20 cartridge. The WSR work great in a 223, but have a relatively thin primer cup and might burn through in the other applications.
For the two cartridges I mentioned, I would use a Rem 7 1/2 or a CCI BR4 primer which both have heavier cups and will stand more pressure.
James Calhoun used to have a pretty good "Primer on Primers" on his web site. You might check it for more info. on primer cup thickness. He has changed his web site somewhat recently, and I'm not sure its still there.
I found a link to Calhoun's information.
http://www.jamescalhoon.com/primers_and_pressure.html
- BCB
One other thing to consider, especially with the small rifle primers. Some have thicker cups than others which aids in high pressure loads.
For example, I would not use a Winchester Small Rifle Primer to load a 17 Remington or a Tactical 20 cartridge. The WSR work great in a 223, but have a relatively thin primer cup and might burn through in the other applications.
For the two cartridges I mentioned, I would use a Rem 7 1/2 or a CCI BR4 primer which both have heavier cups and will stand more pressure.
James Calhoun used to have a pretty good "Primer on Primers" on his web site. You might check it for more info. on primer cup thickness. He has changed his web site somewhat recently, and I'm not sure its still there.
I found a link to Calhoun's information.
http://www.jamescalhoon.com/primers_and_pressure.html
- BCB
Different primers do not always shoot to the same point of impact or the same group sizes with the same loads. If you change primers, you have to shoot some groups to find out for sure.
NewHornet: I like Bea175's answer. Any brand of small rifle will work where small rifle is called for, but back off a bit for starting loads to play it safe. Watch not to interchange "small rifle" with "small rifle magnum" or visa-versa. Folks do it for various reasons, but if you are just starting out, stick to the manuals. --Mykal
Bayou City Boy
New member
newhornet:
I will emphasise again NOT ALL SMALL RIFLE PRIMERS ARE EQUAL. It doesn't all have to do with magnum versus non-magnyum SR primers, either.
Using a light cupped SR primer in a cartridge like a 17 Remington or Tactical 20, EVEN WITH MILD LOADS, might result in pierced primers and blow-back. If you are only reloading standard cartridges, any primer will probably work.
However, with high pressure loads like the two I mentioned, be cautious using just any SR primer. I have also heard of primer piercing with the 204 Ruger on the part of folks using thin cupped SR primers rather than the thicker cupped ones.
In older copies of reloading manuals - Hornady for example - that had load date for the 17 Remington, they used to warn about primer choice. They don't always do that in this day and age.
Look at Calhoun's information and decide from that what is needed for your particular application. In my case, I load for several cartridges that use SR primers, but I only use the thicker cupped primers (Rem 7 1/2 and CCI BR4) for all of them.
They do provide a margin of safety that other SR primers don't. When I say "margin of safety", I'm not talking about you can "load it hotter". I'm talking about what even moderate loads in some cartridges will do to some SR primers with thin cups.
- BCB
I will emphasise again NOT ALL SMALL RIFLE PRIMERS ARE EQUAL. It doesn't all have to do with magnum versus non-magnyum SR primers, either.
Using a light cupped SR primer in a cartridge like a 17 Remington or Tactical 20, EVEN WITH MILD LOADS, might result in pierced primers and blow-back. If you are only reloading standard cartridges, any primer will probably work.
However, with high pressure loads like the two I mentioned, be cautious using just any SR primer. I have also heard of primer piercing with the 204 Ruger on the part of folks using thin cupped SR primers rather than the thicker cupped ones.
In older copies of reloading manuals - Hornady for example - that had load date for the 17 Remington, they used to warn about primer choice. They don't always do that in this day and age.
Look at Calhoun's information and decide from that what is needed for your particular application. In my case, I load for several cartridges that use SR primers, but I only use the thicker cupped primers (Rem 7 1/2 and CCI BR4) for all of them.
They do provide a margin of safety that other SR primers don't. When I say "margin of safety", I'm not talking about you can "load it hotter". I'm talking about what even moderate loads in some cartridges will do to some SR primers with thin cups.
- BCB
Bayou City Boy
New member
DogBegone;
I'm not a fan of CCI either from an accuracy point of view.
However, I'm not a fan of seeing someone get a face full of hot gases either because of the use of a too thin cupped primer for the application. It has happened with several of the high pressure small bolt face cartridges.
As I mentioned, if you're loading any normal cartridge in the 223 bolt face group, including the 223 Remington, you'll probably be fine with any SR primer of your choice. Not so with a couple of cartridges, however. - BCB
I'm not a fan of CCI either from an accuracy point of view.
However, I'm not a fan of seeing someone get a face full of hot gases either because of the use of a too thin cupped primer for the application. It has happened with several of the high pressure small bolt face cartridges.
As I mentioned, if you're loading any normal cartridge in the 223 bolt face group, including the 223 Remington, you'll probably be fine with any SR primer of your choice. Not so with a couple of cartridges, however. - BCB
In at least 2 rifles, I have conducted tests. I've found CCI and Winchester primers to produce the same group sizes & same points of impact with otherwise identical loads. I get better results with Federal 210 Gold Match than either. Tighter groups by a small but measurable amout, and a different point of impact.
Bayou City Boy
New member
2MG:
I've never been too much into the larger rifle stuff, and have no knowledge what-so-ever as to which primer might be best in the application you described.
If its much bigger than a 22 caliber, I haven't really thought too much about it other than in findng a load that is accurate.
Granted, primers make a difference in accuracy with the big stuff too, but I have accurate loads for big calibers using several different LR primers. Part of it is the fact I have never tried to get a 6.5 caliber hunting rifle to shoot to the same accuracy level that I might try to get with a Tac 20 for example.
Take care. - BCB
I've never been too much into the larger rifle stuff, and have no knowledge what-so-ever as to which primer might be best in the application you described.
If its much bigger than a 22 caliber, I haven't really thought too much about it other than in findng a load that is accurate.
Granted, primers make a difference in accuracy with the big stuff too, but I have accurate loads for big calibers using several different LR primers. Part of it is the fact I have never tried to get a 6.5 caliber hunting rifle to shoot to the same accuracy level that I might try to get with a Tac 20 for example.
Take care. - BCB
2muchgun
New member
BCB--I'm almost the opposite. I don't really reload a lot of smaller stuff because most of it costs half as much as what you pay for a premium box of ammo for big game rifles. I buy a lot of the Win white box stuff in 223 and 22-250 and it shoots great. $16 for 50 rounds doesn't bother me nearly as much as spending $20-$30 for 20 rounds. Or much more for my 300 Weatherby or 348Win. The loads I shoot out of my 444 would cost $40 from Buffalo Bore. I do have everything needed to load 22-250 though, and eventually will. Thanks, take it easy--2MG
Bayou City Boy
New member
I don't shoot much of the 223 or 22-250 either except in my AR's (223). Seems like the past 10 years the odd-ball wildcat small caliber stuff has gathered most of my attention.
I stil have a couple of 223's (not counting my AR's) and several 22-250's, but they collect a lot of dust. What I do shoot in my AR's is WW White Box stuff and like you, I can buy it cheaper than loading it when you consider your time. - BCB
I stil have a couple of 223's (not counting my AR's) and several 22-250's, but they collect a lot of dust. What I do shoot in my AR's is WW White Box stuff and like you, I can buy it cheaper than loading it when you consider your time. - BCB
bea175
New member
Quote:
BCB-In your opinion, what are the hottest burning primers out there for igniting large amounts of powder in high capacity cases? Fed215's maybe?
Winchester is in my opinion the hottest primer in both standard and magnum. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif This chart will give you an idea of the differences in brands of primers.
BCB-In your opinion, what are the hottest burning primers out there for igniting large amounts of powder in high capacity cases? Fed215's maybe?
Winchester is in my opinion the hottest primer in both standard and magnum. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif This chart will give you an idea of the differences in brands of primers.
Bayou City Boy
New member
2muchgun
New member
Thanks for the info, fellas. The reason I mentioned Fed215's is because if you look at any of the reloading info from companies that do not manufacture their own primers, Hornady, Nosler, Sierra, and Barnes, for example. In all 4 manuals they use Fed215's on all the Weatherby cartridges, and also on all of the other "over-bore" stuff like the 7STW for example. I read somewhere before that the Fed215 was specifically designed for these types of cartridges, and after looking at all of these manuals, it must work well. I use Winchester primers far more than any of the others myself--2MG
Not all primers are created equal is a good statement. Rem. 7 1/2's will take loads that will blow other small primers out of the case. If you have a max load using a 7 1/2 don't sub that load with any of the others without reworking. Generally, Win, Fed, CCI will work together.