Quality Cold bluing?

M

Michael J. McCasland

New member
I did a search for this product but got no returns on the product I'm looking for. So, I'm turning to you guys.

I've got a nice Classic Double 101 20ga. (in reality it is a Winchester 101) Over/under that is showing a LOT of bluing wear. I'd like to have it reblued but rebluing a shotgun like this is not an inexpensive proposition. Besides the origional bluing should not be wearing this quickly. I'd like to go in another direction.

Not long ago, maybe a year or so, a new cold bluing product hit the market and recieved increadably good reviews. If I remember correctly, it was not a true bluing process, it was a duplex coating of some sort, but was not paint.

The Question:
1: Do any of you guys know what the name of this product is and where I can get it.

2: Do you have any experience with this produce. If you do please let me (and others) know about your experience with it. Is it durable, is it easy to apply, are there any tips or tricks you can pass on that would be helpful?
 
Michael,

Around 5-6yrs ago. My oldest Bro, gave me one of our Grandpa's guns, an old pump .22. Well I took it took a local wanna-be "gunsmith?" To have it re-blued for my Bro for his B-Day. He "cold-dipped it" That process, didn't take to well at all.

Years ago, one of my shotguns had a bare spot. I went to a local hardware store & picked up a little bottle of "cold- dip" bluing(it had a Blue label?). It didn't work for beans.

Perhaps, an "Electro-Plating Company". Would be an option, if all else fails. Good luck
 
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44/40 instant blue from Brownells works pretty good, our local gun shop used Blue wonder but switched to 44/40. Truthfully I don't know how the 2 products compare but I think any cold blue is a temporary "fix".

Parkerizing, if it appeals to you, is a simple and economical way, Brownells has the solution for about $30.00 per gallon and you mix it with water so it will last a while. You only heat the solution to about 180 degrees (I think) if solder melting is a concern.
 
Having done the cold I find that Quality and Cold Blue are an oxymoron. At best it is OK, and that's about it. You may also want to try Van's from Brownells. They, Brownells, also carry some others.
 
It works ok usually for small touch ups. But the bluing is NOT very dark even after repeated treatments. On large areas you'll see uneven color. Some parts won't blue at all. Others turn out really well. It just depends. Overall, it's handy, might as well give it a shot. But it will NOT give you a nice deep blue like from the factory.
 
How about just biting the bullet and saving up for a proper cold rust blue? That is the way soft-soldered doubles are done. Makes for a nice deep satin blue that etches its way into the steel surface deeper than conventional hot-dip, so lasts longer.

You're right, it's not cheap, but it will look great and probably outlast its owner.
 
Thank all of you for your responces.

I've done my share of Cold Blue jobs, usually a touch up to temporarily protect the a surface before having a gun hot blued. This new stuff was supposed to be something special when it comes to cold bluing. Not perfect but serviceable.

I am amazed at the price to reblue an Over/Under Shotgun. Just the reciever and parts will beat the heck out of a $300.00 bill. I suppose there is some consideration for proper polishing over/around engraving and other parts, but still, that is a lot of money for a few parts you can hold in one hand. I'd take it apart myself and do it but for one part, the break open lever screw. Nobody wants to bugger that highly visible part up.

Colorado Pete - You are right, I should and will eventually do that, but this wouild be a temporary fix only.

This 101 is interesting. It doesn't hold bluing worth a darn. I keep it clean, wipe it down after each use (Skeet shooting), even then I can see the bluing going away right in front of my eyes. Nothing gradual about it. Some shotgun smiths have said that the 101 has extremely hard steel in their receiver and they shake off bluing like a dog in water.

But you did answer one question that I've been wondering about. What is the difference between hot bluing and rust bluing. Thanks. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif
 
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Michael,

All bluing is a "controlled rust" process. In all bluing, the polishing is the key to a quality job. In the hot blue process, temprature is critical to the quality of the job. If the wash or rinse solutions get above 180 degrees the piece will flash rust as you pull it out of the rinse and before you can put it in the bluing solution (salts). The results will be big gobs of red crap on the piece when you take it out of the salts or a cloudy look to the surface.

Before you let anybody touch your shotgun, ask to see several samples of their work. Look for crisp edges around engraving and lettering and sharp edges on screw holes. If the edges arn't sharp, look for another shop. If the edges are sharp look at the depth of the finish. A quality polish and blue will look a foot deep. If the job isn't like looking in a mirror, find another shop. A quality bluing job on a firearm that hasn't been otherwise abused should almost always look better than a factory job, provided it was done by a real craftsman.

Temprature of the salts and the type of salts used is critical for double bbls. Most double bbl. are blued with cyanide added to the salts to prevent the salts from attacking the solder. When you look at a sample of work, look between the bbls top and bottom. If you can see the solder line, the bath was too hot or the salts started to break down the solder. A couple of hot turkey loads and you might be able to shoot around corners or kill two turkeys at the same time on the opposite sides of the field with a gun like this.

If you want a temp. fix with cold blue, go with Oxpho from Brownells. Degreese the bbls and rinse off any residue with hot water and dry the surfaces. Warm up the bbls to about 100 to 120 degrees with a hair dryer. Apply 8 to 10 applications of Oxpho following the directions. Finish by lightly rubbing in a good quality gun oil with OOOO or finer steel wool to blend the cold blue into the remainder of the finish.

I has a bluing and plating shop for about 10 years. I had to quit because I came to the point where I either had to quit my real job to do it full time or hire somebody. Since I didn't want the liability of screwing up someone's gun, hiring someone wasn't an option, and I had a family to support. So, I sold the business and equipment to a local gunsmith who quickly found out it wasn't as easy as it looked.

Good luck.

Truckeedan
 
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Another option, which you may or may like, is to just leave it alone! When you've worn the blueing off of an O/U with honest use, you deserve to wear that white metal like a badge of honor.Having said that, since my O/U s have coin finished receivers I don't have that problem,so what do I know? At least everyone will know that it isn't your first round of skeet.Just a thought.
Dogleg
 
The experiance I have had is cold blueing seems to rust quickly almost before you can get it cleaned and oiled. You may not like this idea but you might check out the coatings they put on camo shotguns. I believe they make just a black coating its real durable and if I remember its a lot cheaper than rebluing. Its a film that floats in a tank of liquid and it sticks to your gun they can coat just the metal parts or the whole gun. I think one company that does it is called second skin but I`am not sure its been awhile since I read anything on it. Good luck !
 
truckeedan - Great post from one that truly knows, thank you

Dogleg - I've considered the same thing, real guns have bluing wear, a bagde to be warn with some pride. The problem with this gun is that the bluing it is wearing off much to quickly. It looked great when the gun was new, deep, dark nice and even. But I swear that you can see the bluing practicly falling off the gun. The wear ain't
honest.

MEDIC - I like those finishes alot, they are great for many applications. But this gun is a different sort of beast. While the engraving is not a work of art, it is fine line work, patterns and quail flushing scenes not great but nice enough, one of the baked on coating finishes would fill much of this work and look truly horrible. Not a bad idea for a field working gun though. .... A bit of a Ramble here: But what is a working gun, my clays guns shoot many thousands of rounds a year, many more rounds than my calling gun, they don't sit in a gun safe, they certainly work for a living. But the calling gun gets carried in rough conditions much much more often.
 
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