Whos deer are they???

J Fynaardt

New member



In my state iowa the deer epedemic is bad. I lose easly 1000+ dollors every year because of deer damage to my crops and if I want to shoot them there the states deer i have to pay the fine to the DNR if i were to poach. If i hit one with my truck there wild animals i cant send a bill to the state for the deer getting on to the road but if my livestock were to get on the road its my fault and i get the bill. The deer eat on my property sleep on my property they sound like there mine to do with what i like. If they dont want me to take care of MY deer THEY can put a fence up and keep there animals off MY property.

I also like to hunt Deer and see both sides to the story but my property is mine and i pay taxed on it every year and buy a hunting liscenes so i payed for my property its mine not the states.


Im not condoning poaching It is wrong but if they live on my property whos are they
 
They belong to the king. Same as in Europe. You are a serf on your "own" land. Doubt it? Do a word study on the word "serf". Like it or not thats what we all are. Check it out. Have the same trouble here.
 
A lot depends on if you are in an area where deer are considered a big game animal or where deer are considered vermin.

In many eastern states the landowner can get almost unlimited "damage control permits." My father had a small farm in Maryland, not far from D.C. and he routinely was given 50 permits. He did not use them himself but gave them out to anybody who wanted to take a deer. 3 years ago one hunter took 44 deer with a bow, 9 with regular hunting tags and 35 with damage permits.

I am sure it is a lot worse now but 10 years ago the insurance industry was paying $125 million a year in deer/car collision claims just in the D.C. metropolitan area. The death toll is hard to figure because many deaths are caused by people trying to miss deer and running off the road with no evidence of the deer causing it. A good guess is 20-50 deaths a year in the metro area.

There is no question that deer kill many times more people in the US than any other animal.

Your best bet is to work with the DNR and maybe they will give you control permissions or possibly steer hunters in your direction.

Jack
 
J,
Technically its their land, the deer that is, we just happen to be the owners of said land on paper. WOrk with your DNR, i know here in TX, they offer control of deer pops just after the season closes. its controlled hunt by Tx Park and wildlife dept and their agents conducting it.
 
Getting a crop damage permit would probably be you best bet. Im just glad your a deer hunter too. I dont think its right for a farmer who wont let no one hunt their property but they go out and buy a crop damage permit and shoot the deer just to get rid of them. Where I used to deer hunt in WVa there was a farmer there who had his land posted and would try to get any tresspasser arrested but he got a crop damage permit. The summer he got the permit, I was checking on my food and and I saw him with a back hoe pushing all the deer he has killed up into a pile and that night he just set all of them on fire. Wasting all of those deer and not letting anyone hunt his farm. That never made any sense to me.
 
WTXHUNTER that is where you and i differ its not their ground i Payed for it thats like saying that the car you drive isnt yours you just have a paper to it or your house or your gun or food!!! That paper is just proof that it is mine!

nc_deerhunter Thats sad to hear of a peson wasting the deer like that. My ground isnt posted but i will have you arrested for trespassing if you step foot on it with out premission. If anyone asks they have premission I just want to know when you will be there and how long. I could have somebody else there you should know about or dangers. In Iowa all private property is that you dont have to post no trespassing or hunting signs like in some states
 
Here in Texas, the landowner owns the land, the people of Texas own the deer and the landowner sales the deer. Funny if you think about it but the system works.
 
J Fynaardt - I most areas there is no debate on this issue, the deer belong to the people or the state. You did not purchase the deer, the deer can wander where they will, they are free to do so, the deer are ant your property.

In many places there is a way around this. Put a 12' deer fence all around your property and lock the gate and amintain it and apply for the right kind of permit and the game fenced in on your property can become yours.

It sorta my belief that we don't truly own our land. We sorta lease it for a while. We all die or move on eventually. Then theres this, if you think the land is yours, stop paying taxes on it, the state will get their lease money one way or another, if not from you then from somebody else.
 
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M. McCasland - You are sure right. I am of the opinion that proprty taxes is the cruelest tax of all. Like I said, we are serfs.
 
Sounds like alot of trouble to go through for a problem that can be solved with a 22. I would try for the damage control permits. But if I couldn't get them then me and my 22 would be taking care of business. Hey someone had to say it, So I'll be the bad guy. $1000.00 is $1000.00 now you have your problem solved, free food, and no more losing money that could be put into your family. I know I'll probably catch slack for saying this. But hey my family comes before an animal any day and that fits into my, you mess with my family you die for it catagory. Yes I know I'm a FUI sometimes.

for those that don't know, that means F'd Up Individual.

t/c223encore.
 
Yea thats one way of resolving the issue, I dont know if an open forum is the appropriate place to display those feelings but.......... Do it enough and loose your rights to hunt.

I know in Texas wildlife can be taken through various means if they pose a problem to crops etc. And maybe in your state as well. You just have to find that fine print and figure out if there are any programs available. Its not in bold or everyone would be killing deer and saying they were damaging crops.

 
This is a question that has been dealt with for many years. About 600, to be exact. You see, deer and other wildlife are considered under the law to be a public trust - owned by the public, and managed by the government for the benefit of the resource and the public. This philosophy goes back to the Magna Carta , prior to which the King owned all wildlife and the peasantry was forbidden to take any of those animals or risk death for doing so. The Magna Cart, amongst other things, stripped away the legal standing that royalty owned all wildlife. This was such an important resolution to the problem that our own founding father's included it in the formation of the United States Constitution as well as most all state constitutions.

In short, you own the land, but the state and the people own the wildlife. This is why it is elligal to sell wildlife in the states - it's not yours to sell or to profit from. It's allso the rub that many people have for fur harvesting because it's the only way that we can make money directly off of wildlife.

Now, as a landowner you can believe in your heart that you "own" those deer, and if that's the way you want to look at it, then don't be surprised when our government implements laws here like most European countries 'enjoy'. There, landowners own the wildlife that is on their ground. At specified times of the year, each estate is required to submit an accurate count of all the various animals, by species, that reside on their land. Then, the state assesses a tax to the estate for those animals, i.e. $8 per deer. To defray the costs of those taxes, game animals are taken at the discretion of the estate owner and the meat/ products from the animal are sold in open markets with the hope that the revenue generated will offset the costs of the taxes. Unfortunately, these estates invite only the upper echelons to hunt on their ground and there is no such thing as just going up, asking, and going hunting. Most of us on this board would never get to hunt under these circumstances because we simply don't have the clout or the cash.

Not to be too hard on you, but IMHO, you knew that deer ate your hay and aflalfa when you started farming, so why do you act so bent out of shape now simply because someone or a law stands between you and the chance to make money off a natural resource that is as much mine as it is yours? This is a real trigger point here since Kansas is now seeing a huge decline in access for tax payer sportsmen because our federal tax dollars are being used to underwrite habitat development for whitetail deer (CRP) on acres that are being leased and locked by the highest bidder. Hunting as we've known it up to now is dying a slow death and the federal government is forcing us to fund its demise through CRP dollars. I know a lot of people that believe that CRP ground should be open to public hunting since the habitat on that acreage was paid for with our tax dollars. Something to think about. Just my .02.
 
You all make some good points, but everyone must keep in mind that deer are now a big problem in Iowa. In many areas, we have so many that hunting probably won't even slightly decrease the population. If you can't legally harvest them - I think you should have the right to protect your property at the very least.

Cdog - I don't know Fynaardt, but I imagine when he starting farming the deer population was about half of what it is now.
 
Quote:
The deer eat on my property sleep on my property they sound like there mine to do with what i like. If they dont want me to take care of MY deer THEY can put a fence up and keep there animals off MY property



How much land do you have? Unless you have an awful lot of land, you are sharing those deer with your neighbors. Deer can easily roam over several thousands of acres.

Tommy said: Quote:
Here in Texas, the landowner owns the land, the people of Texas own the deer and the landowner sales the deer.



Technically, that is not exactly true. It is illegal to sale wild deer. What the landowner is actually selling is tresspass rights to that property or the "right" to kill that deer. That maybe splitting hairs, but is technically correct.

Privatization of wildlife does not benefit the hunting public, or the hunting tradition.
 
I meant sale as in kill. I have no use as a hunter for a live one. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Pen raised whitetail are still considered whitetail in Texas and are sold all the time. Correct me if Im wrong.
 
"Pen raised" is a loaded term. Deer held in "scientific breeding pen" and covered under a "scientific breeding permit" can and are sold. Once that deer has been "liberated" or turned loose even if it is in a high-fenced property, it cannot be recaptured and returned to the pens or sold.

You cannot trap deer in a high fenced ranch is south Texas say and sell them. They can be transported to other properties, if you have the proper permits, but they cannot be sold. The receiving property may have to pay the trap and transport cost, but they cannot be sold.
 
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In my state iowa the deer epedemic is bad. I lose easly 1000+ dollors every year because of deer damage to my crops and if I want to shoot them there the states deer i have to pay the fine to the DNR if i were to poach. If i hit one with my truck there wild animals i cant send a bill to the state for the deer getting on to the road but if my livestock were to get on the road its my fault and i get the bill. The deer eat on my property sleep on my property they sound like there mine to do with what i like. If they dont want me to take care of MY deer THEY can put a fence up and keep there animals off MY property.

I also like to hunt Deer and see both sides to the story but my property is mine and i pay taxed on it every year and buy a hunting liscenes so i payed for my property its mine not the states.


Im not condoning poaching It is wrong but if they live on my property whos are they



A quick search provided the following site Iowa Department of Natural Resources wildlife depredation program. Although it might not be the perfect solution for you, it does provide something workable.
 
I guess a 190" South Texas buck costs more to trepsass for then a 150". Oh and each inch after 140" well that just requires more trespass money. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

And the transportation, well see they take up more room in my horse trailer so I gotsta charge you more. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

So another words dont say SOLD and DEER in the same sentence in Texas. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
Only in Texas.... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

It's an ultimately evil system you folks have got but it sure works good for growing up big deer...

pmdb10pt2.jpg
 
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