1 in 8 twist .223? Isn't this too fast? Tikka

When I used to shoot F Class up here in New Brunswick, we had a lot of 223 fans who shot at long range. The most popular barrel twist was the 1 in 8 for stabilizing 75 and 80 gr bullets. The 1 in 9 found in factory Savage rifles just didn't cut the mustard for the heavy VLD bullets, it would only stabilize 69 gr pills. That limited range to 600/700 meters. The guys with the 1 in 8's could routinely shoot to 900 meters, especially with the 80's. It was said that at 900 meters, the 223 w/80gr VLD's could match the 308 w/155gr Palma. I believe it because I've seen it done. Now with all that said, why a company would market a 223 with a 1 in 8, especially in a sporter weight barrel, is beyond me. I own a Savage Hunter in 223 with the 1 in 9 and it will shoot lighter bullets fine. But I think the 1 in 8 is stretching it a bit. Some light bullets are going to come apart at such a high revolution. IMHO. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
I have never seen a light .224 bullet come apart in a 1 in 8 twist barrel. You might have some problems with those SX Hornady bullets, but have not tried them. Have shoot all the others.
 
I've never had any bullet come apart in a 1 in 7" twist AR barrel. I really doubt any will in my 1 in 8" twist Tikka either.

To me, worrying about something like that is like me worrying about getting hit by a meteorite in my lifetime. It probably ain't gonna' happen, so I'm not going to worry a whole lot about it. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

- BCB
 
First of all, gentlemen, bullets don't come apart "IN" a barrel. If there's gonna be a problem, it'll be within the first hundred yards or so. Actually, I've seen bullets "mist" within twenty yards of the muzzle.
As for an AR15 with the 1/7, I owned a Daewoo MAX-II at one time which also had a 1/7 and I shot every bullet weight under the sun with no probs. But what else would you expect from a semi with a barrel twenty inches or less? Your not getting max velocity and a 100FPS can make a huge difference. I worried more about reliable feeding.
 
These fast twist .223 bolts really interest me for 300 yard bench practice. Factory class egg shoots and more.

How is the barrel life compared to the typical. slower twist factory .223 bolts ?

Less, I suspect.
 
Oh,Gee, Mr. ballistic.....UHHH......dude.....

Sorry my syntax wasn't "up to snuff" for you. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif And I am pretty sure it was a syntax issue with Steve that confused you also. Would "shot out of and having exited...", or words like that, been better for you?

If you hang around awhile you'll find you might even learn something here, and maybe you'll quit assuming you have come here to save the masses from their own stupidity.

As soon as bullets start blowing up DOWNRANGE FROM THE MUZZLE END OF MY TIKKA 8" TWIST BARREL....you'll be the first to know. Just don't hold your breath waiting for it to happen.

Worry about what you feel you need to worry about, but don't worry needlessly about me and what I shoot.....unless you just have to for some strange reason..... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

Oh...and Mr. ballistic.....one of my 7 twist AR's was built to shoot heavy bullets and it has has a 24" 1 in 7" twist barrel and nothing bad has happened with any weight of bullet shot THROUGH AND OUT of it. Could I be doing something wrong??? Whatcha' think, huh?

_ BCB
 
I did not pay attention to that because
(1) I knew what you meant
(2) I am from AR., an area not famous for precision
grammer. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 
My apologies for opening my mouth too quick. The times that I've seen light bullets fly apart out of fast 223's were during 300m matches. Now there must have been extenuating circumstances cause I know velocities aren't high enough. But I saw this happen more than once. Wish I could snap my fingers and go back in time and ask the guys why.
 
Usually 223 velocities aren't high enough for bullets to come apart at this rpm.(1 in 8) 22-250 and up will spin em apart if you drive the light ones too hard. Not sayin it can't be done but in my limited experience I hav'nt heard of it.
 
I have heard stories about bullets coming apart in 7 twist Ar's but they had to be shot a certain way. Can't remember what the deal was but think it was barrel heat. I have shot all the .224 bullets out of my 7 twist Colt AR's and never had a problem at all. Think this could happen but it will be rare.
 
I have seen quite a few bullets come apart out of 7" ARs at highpower matches. It means the barrel is wore out. It first shows up with the barrel hot and dirty. Towards the end of the second rapid fire string is where it always happens first.

Jack
 
I doubt that anyone doesn't believe that a BAD fast twist small caliber barrel- like a 7" twist - full of alligator hide, will tear up bullets.

When that happpens you're running on borrowed time anyway, and the barrel should have been replaced. I know in my case the few times I've had bullet problems, it was't caused just because of the barrel twist rate alone, but because the fast twist barrel was fried and needed replaced.

When you get into the faster twist small caliber barrels, it's a given that barrel life will be shorter than a comparable faster twist barrel. And a bullet turning blue downrange is not the first sign you will notice that a barrel is fried. It will generally be noticed in cleaning and grouping abilty after cleaning well before bullets may start coming apart.

Still, I'm willing to take my lumps with the fast twist barrels due to the ballistic benefits they provide in the bullet selection.

- BCB
 
Getting lively here, brothers…

I’ve had bullets vaporize out of a barrel with les than 500 rounds out of it. I doubt it can happen with a 223 unless you find a very special bullet. Mine did it out of a 243, shooting those Horhady 70 grain SX’s. They’re not supposed to go faster than 3300 but nobody said anything for the first couple years they were made. That was really a drag to clean up too. I think the Sierra Blitz are just like it. Most target bullets have a thicker hide and the 223 is way slow unless you start shooting a really light Blitz or SX…

I think the 1 in 8” twist barrel is perfect for match rifles and anything where long range is in the plans, stay with the medium to heavy bullets. The 1 in 9” is perfect for most people because you can shoot all that cheap practice ammo for what it costs to buy the components and the lighter side of the mid weights too. The prize service rifle barrel is the 1 in 7.7” Kreiger that is the standard for all the seasoned High Power shooters, forget the practice ammo in these, even at 200 yards they shoot 68 and 69 grain pills. The 1 in 7” twist barrels are military standard and probably chrome lined. I have no idea in the world why a coyote hunter would want one of these. The chrome lining is a serious accuracy impediment.
 
It's just like cars, bikes, boats, airplanes, etc. how fast or far do you want to go and how much do you want to pay?

The whole discussion is not relevant to coyote hunting where you will work hard to get 100 shots a year.

Jack
 
Quote:
........The whole discussion is not relevant to coyote hunting where you will work hard to get 100 shots a year.

Jack



Exactly my thoughts when I bought my 1 in 8" twist Tikka bolt rifle. Like I said earlier, knowing I was buying a shorter barrel life was not even a concern. I bought it for the ability to shoot heavier bullets instead of possible extended barrel life.

- BCB
 
Quote:
...........The 1 in 7” twist barrels are military standard and probably chrome lined. I have no idea in the world why a coyote hunter would want one of these. The chrome lining is a serious accuracy impediment.



I wonder how many coyotes wish you had printed those words 10-15 years ago so the coyotes' lives could have been spared. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

Personally, two of my AR's have chrome lined barrels and both of them are far more accurate than "minute of coyote", and they have both accounted for a good number of dead coyotes. Maybe just luck on my part???? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused1.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

- BCB
 
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