jeezumcrow
New member
Hey folks. I'm considering a new rifle in 17HMR. I've got a Marlin 880sq in 22lr. Very accurate. So, I'm thinking another Marlin. What are your opinions? Thanks. Oh ya, it'll be used mainly for wooschucks and crows.
17HMR
- Thread starter jeezumcrow
- Start date
jlindholm70
New member
Savage 93R17BTVS. It's one sweet little rifle. Take a look on gunbroker.com and see what your next rifle looks like. You'll love it.
If you are looking for a rifle which is built like the higher quality .22's of the pre WWII era, then look at the CZ 452, or if you are willing to pay a bit extra, you can get the CZ 453, with the set trigger. The 452 normally requires a bit of trigger work to lower the weight and remove the take up, although you can get a Brooks kit for about $16 which will take care of virtually all the deficiencies of the factory trigger. You can get a Timney trigger for it, too, if you want.
The CZ feels like a high quality rifle, at a modest cost. Or you can go top flight and get an Anshutz, Kimber or Cooper, but you will pay top dollar for very little extra, except for the aesthetics.
If you want to avoid paying more than necessary, the Marlin or Savage are accurate enough that most people couldn't shoot well enough to tell the difference between the Marlin, Savage or CZ in terms of accuracy.
BTW, I have a CZ 452 Varmint and it will put 3 shots in just over 1/4" at 50 yards with the 17 grain Hornady VMax. Haven't shot it at 100 yards yet, though.
The CZ feels like a high quality rifle, at a modest cost. Or you can go top flight and get an Anshutz, Kimber or Cooper, but you will pay top dollar for very little extra, except for the aesthetics.
If you want to avoid paying more than necessary, the Marlin or Savage are accurate enough that most people couldn't shoot well enough to tell the difference between the Marlin, Savage or CZ in terms of accuracy.
BTW, I have a CZ 452 Varmint and it will put 3 shots in just over 1/4" at 50 yards with the 17 grain Hornady VMax. Haven't shot it at 100 yards yet, though.
ARCOREY
New member
I have shot side by side with a Cooper and a CZ with my Marlin 917v. If I had scoped mine equal to theirs, the targets would be identicle. The Cooper was very nice and had a great trigger and action. With the Leupold VXIII it was impressive, but not for a $1200 rimfire. The CZ shot very well also, woodwork didn't impress me much and trigger was nice, but no Cooper. With a BSA Sweet 17 6x-18x-42mm it wasn't far from grouping like the Cooper, but replacement mags were expensive like the Cooper and for around $375 dollars for the rifle it was getting closer to what I would expect for the price. My Marlin 917V with BSA Sweet 17 3x-12x-42mm scope was the cheapest by far with a $179 rifle price and a replacement mag cost of $20 each. It shot almost identicle to the CZ for groups and not a 1/8" difference from the Cooper, the main problem being clarity from the cheap scope I had chosen. Moral of the story, with a $900 Leupold on my $179 Marlin I could shoot good groups like a Cooper, and for the $75 for a Rifle Basix trigger and some bolt lapping compound I could feel much better about myself the next day and not cry like a baby the first time the rifle fell off the 4-wheeler. The Marlin is no piece of art, and I did some work to get it the way I wanted, but it didn't cost me the $200 difference between Marlin and CZ and not even close to the $1000 difference for the Cooper. If you want an investment get the Cooper, something in the middle a CZ, a reliable truck gun that will shoot well on a budget, get a Marlin or a Savage and admire the scratches /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif.
hawkcarterCO
New member
I own a savage, and I love it.
peterjc
New member
ARCOREY,
I couldn't have said it any better than you. I have a Marlin and did trigger job on it and it shoots about 1" at 100 yds. Sometimes a little under and sometimes a little over but not much on either side. Can you see me painting a Cooper like this... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-006.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-006.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-006.gif
I couldn't have said it any better than you. I have a Marlin and did trigger job on it and it shoots about 1" at 100 yds. Sometimes a little under and sometimes a little over but not much on either side. Can you see me painting a Cooper like this... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-006.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-006.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-006.gif
Totch94
New member
I have a Ruger X17. It is a special edition Ruger 77 with a very upgraded stock and a satin stainless finish. I had the trigger worked to almost nothing and it is the most accurate rifle I own. It is capable of outshooting me at 100 yards any day of the week. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowingsmilie.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowingsmilie.gif It always gets some interesting looks at the range also. I have always liked owning something that you don't run into every day. My wife hates going to parties and having the same dress on as another lady, I hate going to the range and having the same rifle as another guy. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif Here it is.
jeezumcrow
New member
Thanks everyone for your input. ARCOREY, I couldn't agree with you more. I'm not a real big Marlin fan although the one I've got shoots greats so why not another. I'm a Browning man. Problem is Browning doesn't chamber anything in 17HMR. Oh well. Thanks again to all.
kyotekiller25
Well-known member
Totch94
Very nice Ruger. I wasn't even aware they made that rifle. Pretty slick looking! I see its mated with a Leupold scope, excellent choice as well!!
Very nice Ruger. I wasn't even aware they made that rifle. Pretty slick looking! I see its mated with a Leupold scope, excellent choice as well!!
utahheadgear
New member
My Marlin 917VS rarely shoots a 5-shot group over 5/8" @ 100 yds from a bench rest on a calm day, and often prints even better than that. It is awesome! The more I shoot it the better it shoots.
That said, I do hear good things about the Savage. The trigger is definately better. I put a Rifle Basix trigger in my Marlin.
That said, I do hear good things about the Savage. The trigger is definately better. I put a Rifle Basix trigger in my Marlin.
kyotekiller25
Well-known member
My experience with the 17 HMR is pretty limited, but I"ll throw in my 2 cents.
I bought a savage, cant even remember exactly what model #, but its got a synthetic stock and a sporter weight blued barrel. First 3 shots at 50 yards were all touching. 100 yards it will hold 3/4" for 3 shots. This was off a bench as well. Pretty accurate rifle. Took it down to central Oregon and wacked a good number of sage rats at 200 yards.
My dad bought a Marlin, laminated stock, stainless heavy barrel. The thing shoots groups 2x bigger then the cheaper savage does. And its got the heavy barrel. I dont think its shot a group under 1" at 100 yards in its life. Dont really know whats up with that. 1 rifle dont tell the whole story, but the little Savage I have outshoots the heavy barreled Marlin by a considerable amount.
I bought a savage, cant even remember exactly what model #, but its got a synthetic stock and a sporter weight blued barrel. First 3 shots at 50 yards were all touching. 100 yards it will hold 3/4" for 3 shots. This was off a bench as well. Pretty accurate rifle. Took it down to central Oregon and wacked a good number of sage rats at 200 yards.
My dad bought a Marlin, laminated stock, stainless heavy barrel. The thing shoots groups 2x bigger then the cheaper savage does. And its got the heavy barrel. I dont think its shot a group under 1" at 100 yards in its life. Dont really know whats up with that. 1 rifle dont tell the whole story, but the little Savage I have outshoots the heavy barreled Marlin by a considerable amount.
Here's some additional information from a test of a small number of .17 HMR guns.
17 Rimfire Rifle Accuracy Test Results
By the Guns and Shooting Online Staff
Here at Guns and Shooting Online we have had the opportunity to review a number of .17 caliber rimfire rifles, and we are continuing to do so. We believe that the .17 HMR cartridge is the best thing that has come along for the recreational shooter in about 50 years, and we review .17 HMR rifles whenever possible.
In the course of our rifle reviews we ordinarily test for accuracy using at least four brands of ammunition and tabulate the results. This concludes with an average overall group size for all types of ammunition. Typically, groups with each rifle are fired for record by three or four Guns and Shooting Online staffers.
The 17 HMR loads we use include ammunition from CCI with 17 grain TNT bullet, Federal Premium with 17 grain TNT bullet, Federal Premium with 17 grain V-MAX bullet, Hornady with 17 grain V-MAX bullet, Remington Premier with 17 grain AccuTip-V bullet, and Winchester Supreme with 17 grain V-MAX bullet. All brands claim a muzzle velocity (MV) of 2525-2550 fps and in our chronograph testing actually delivered average MVs of 2550-2650 fps, depending on the load. (See the article "Compared: .17 HMR Varmint Ammunition" for more details about .17 HMR ammo.) Our .17 M2 ammunition is limited to Hornady brand using the 17 grain V-MAX bullet at an advertised MV of 2100 fps.
.17 rimfire rifles are normally tested with a good quality telescopic sight set at a magnification of 9 power or higher. All recorded groups are fired from a Caldwell Lead Sled rifle rest sitting on a solid bench rest at an outdoor rifle range. These are 5-shot groups fired at 100 yard targets.
This steadily mounting accumulation of data makes the following list possible. We will continue to update this list as new rifles are reviewed and additional data becomes available. Following are the Average Overall Group Size test results for the various .17 caliber rimfire rifles reviewed by Guns and Shooting Online (measured in inches).
AVERAGE OVERALL GROUP SIZE TEST RESULTS
Anschutz Model 1717 D Classic - 0.92"
(TIE) CZ Model 452-2E American - 1.06"
Anschutz Model 1502 D HB - 1.06"
Anschutz Model 1717 D KL - 1.08"
Marlin Model 917VS ("A")* - 1.13"
(TIE) Remington Model 504-T LS HB - 1.16"
Remington Model 597 LS HB - 1.16"
Savage Model 93R17-BVSS - 1.19"
Thompson/Center Contender G2 - 1.21"
Marlin Model 917VS ("B")* - 1.25"
Savage Model 93R17 Classic - 1.31"
Ruger Model 77/17VMBBZ ("A")* - 1.44"
Stevens Favorite Model 30R17 - 1.46"
Ruger Model 77/17VMBBZ ("B")* - 1.54"
Savage Model 93R17-BTVS - 1.56"
Henry Golden Boy - 1.75"
Winchester 1885 Low Wall - 2.05"
Remember, the above accuracy results are averages with all brands of ammunition tested. If the rifles are compared based on the average group size achieved with their favored brand of ammo the results are as follows.
AVERAGE GROUP SIZE WITH MOST ACCURATE BRAND OF AMMUNITION
Anschutz Model 1717 D Classic - 0.73" (CCI)
Thompson/Center Contender G2 - 0.80" (Remington)
Remington Model 597 LS HB - 0.84" (CCI)
Anschutz Model 1717 D KL - 0.93" (Remington)
CZ Model 452-2E American - 0.96" (CCI)
Remington Model 504-T LS HB - 0.98" (Federal)
Marlin Model 917VS ("A")* - 1.0" (Hornady)
Savage Model 93R17-BVSS - 1.0" (Remington)
Anschutz Model 1502 D HB - 1.06" (Hornady - M2)
Marlin Model 917VS ("B")* - 1.13" (Hornady)
(TIE) Savage Model 93R17-BTVS - 1.17" (CCI)
Savage Model 93R17 Classic - 1.17" (Winchester)
Ruger Model 77/17VMBBZ ("A")* - 1.25" (Hornady)
Stevens Favorite Model 30R17 - 1.27" (Hornady & Remington - tie)
Henry Golden Boy - 1.40" (Remington)
Ruger Model 77/17VMBBZ ("B")* - 1.47" (CCI)
Winchester 1885 Low Wall - 1.5" (Remington)
* We tested two different Marlin Model 917VS and Ruger K77/17VMBBZ rifles.
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17 Rimfire Rifle Accuracy Test Results
By the Guns and Shooting Online Staff
Here at Guns and Shooting Online we have had the opportunity to review a number of .17 caliber rimfire rifles, and we are continuing to do so. We believe that the .17 HMR cartridge is the best thing that has come along for the recreational shooter in about 50 years, and we review .17 HMR rifles whenever possible.
In the course of our rifle reviews we ordinarily test for accuracy using at least four brands of ammunition and tabulate the results. This concludes with an average overall group size for all types of ammunition. Typically, groups with each rifle are fired for record by three or four Guns and Shooting Online staffers.
The 17 HMR loads we use include ammunition from CCI with 17 grain TNT bullet, Federal Premium with 17 grain TNT bullet, Federal Premium with 17 grain V-MAX bullet, Hornady with 17 grain V-MAX bullet, Remington Premier with 17 grain AccuTip-V bullet, and Winchester Supreme with 17 grain V-MAX bullet. All brands claim a muzzle velocity (MV) of 2525-2550 fps and in our chronograph testing actually delivered average MVs of 2550-2650 fps, depending on the load. (See the article "Compared: .17 HMR Varmint Ammunition" for more details about .17 HMR ammo.) Our .17 M2 ammunition is limited to Hornady brand using the 17 grain V-MAX bullet at an advertised MV of 2100 fps.
.17 rimfire rifles are normally tested with a good quality telescopic sight set at a magnification of 9 power or higher. All recorded groups are fired from a Caldwell Lead Sled rifle rest sitting on a solid bench rest at an outdoor rifle range. These are 5-shot groups fired at 100 yard targets.
This steadily mounting accumulation of data makes the following list possible. We will continue to update this list as new rifles are reviewed and additional data becomes available. Following are the Average Overall Group Size test results for the various .17 caliber rimfire rifles reviewed by Guns and Shooting Online (measured in inches).
AVERAGE OVERALL GROUP SIZE TEST RESULTS
Anschutz Model 1717 D Classic - 0.92"
(TIE) CZ Model 452-2E American - 1.06"
Anschutz Model 1502 D HB - 1.06"
Anschutz Model 1717 D KL - 1.08"
Marlin Model 917VS ("A")* - 1.13"
(TIE) Remington Model 504-T LS HB - 1.16"
Remington Model 597 LS HB - 1.16"
Savage Model 93R17-BVSS - 1.19"
Thompson/Center Contender G2 - 1.21"
Marlin Model 917VS ("B")* - 1.25"
Savage Model 93R17 Classic - 1.31"
Ruger Model 77/17VMBBZ ("A")* - 1.44"
Stevens Favorite Model 30R17 - 1.46"
Ruger Model 77/17VMBBZ ("B")* - 1.54"
Savage Model 93R17-BTVS - 1.56"
Henry Golden Boy - 1.75"
Winchester 1885 Low Wall - 2.05"
Remember, the above accuracy results are averages with all brands of ammunition tested. If the rifles are compared based on the average group size achieved with their favored brand of ammo the results are as follows.
AVERAGE GROUP SIZE WITH MOST ACCURATE BRAND OF AMMUNITION
Anschutz Model 1717 D Classic - 0.73" (CCI)
Thompson/Center Contender G2 - 0.80" (Remington)
Remington Model 597 LS HB - 0.84" (CCI)
Anschutz Model 1717 D KL - 0.93" (Remington)
CZ Model 452-2E American - 0.96" (CCI)
Remington Model 504-T LS HB - 0.98" (Federal)
Marlin Model 917VS ("A")* - 1.0" (Hornady)
Savage Model 93R17-BVSS - 1.0" (Remington)
Anschutz Model 1502 D HB - 1.06" (Hornady - M2)
Marlin Model 917VS ("B")* - 1.13" (Hornady)
(TIE) Savage Model 93R17-BTVS - 1.17" (CCI)
Savage Model 93R17 Classic - 1.17" (Winchester)
Ruger Model 77/17VMBBZ ("A")* - 1.25" (Hornady)
Stevens Favorite Model 30R17 - 1.27" (Hornady & Remington - tie)
Henry Golden Boy - 1.40" (Remington)
Ruger Model 77/17VMBBZ ("B")* - 1.47" (CCI)
Winchester 1885 Low Wall - 1.5" (Remington)
* We tested two different Marlin Model 917VS and Ruger K77/17VMBBZ rifles.
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Quote:
Funny thing about my 17HMR was it shot the 17 gr stuff into what I thought was respectable groups until I tried the 20 gr gamepoints. Groups cut in half after that. It's a shame they didn't show test results for the 20's.
They did indicate that their tests were to be on going. So, it may behoove one to keep a check on their website for more recent testing results.
Funny thing about my 17HMR was it shot the 17 gr stuff into what I thought was respectable groups until I tried the 20 gr gamepoints. Groups cut in half after that. It's a shame they didn't show test results for the 20's.
They did indicate that their tests were to be on going. So, it may behoove one to keep a check on their website for more recent testing results.
jeezumcrow
New member
Holycow CDR. Thanks a million for the info. I can't even imagine the time and effort involved in gathering those numbers. The only question I have is the difference between the Marlin 917VS "A" and "B". Once again, thank you.