$20-vs-$80 Choke Tubes

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Weasel-UT

New member

Just an observation to share:

I've been testing choke tubes in my Remington 11-87 12 gauge. I shot 3" Federal Premium #4 buck for these particular tests. I tried all of the factory Remington tubes including the extended Turkey Choke tube. Two choke tubes were considerably better than the rest. Photos of the targets are below. Both of these patterns were shot at 40 yards.

Pattern Master $80 Choke Tube:
PatternMasterFed4buckRem11-87.jpg


Undertaker $20 Choke Tube:
UndertakerTubeFed.jpg


The Undertaker tube consistently had a higher point of impact at all ranges, but a very similar pattern as the Pattern Master at 30 yards and farther. Under 30 yards the Pattern Master ripped a tight hole through the target. The Undertaker had a relatively full pattern at ranges of 15 to 40 yards. What have I deduced from all of this? The extra $60 did little for me. Of course, your mileage may vary.
 
Great test. Another thing to consider is shot size and constriction, regardless of price. In other words, certain size shot works better in certain choke diameters as opposed to other diameters.

I have three different chokes for my Turkey gun and when I found the right diameter for the shot I wanted to use, it turned out that the best pattern came from the choke that was in the middle of the price range of the three I owned.
 
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Nice Demo Weasel, Which one is harder on hair or I mean fur! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
Hi it is nice when you live by a Custom choke shop and you can try them . He will make me 4 diff chokes up and let me try all 4 with diff loads. Before you buy one and if you dont like it you dont have to buy it and he only charges me 40.00 dollars for a choke! VM /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif
 
I have performed similar tests with #4 buck and Toungston Iron BBB shot with a pattern master choke on three browning ten guages with the old style pattern master and then the new style, all with poor patterning results! The reason I tried the new and the old style is becuse I called pattern master after my initial tested and they said to send the old one in and they would trade me out for the new style to test. They are nice folks, just have a bad product. My best pattern from all 3 guns came from a used Herters #4 choke tube I picked up in Cabelas "bargin bin" for eight dollars. Some of my factory chokes shoot tighter patterns that either pattern master! I relize that every gun shoots different but I'm pretty sure that pattern master is JUNK! I havent had a tight group with either on anything I have tested including large steel in T,BBB,BB,and 2's. My opion buy something else to try before you waste your money.
 
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Weasel,
Do you have adjustable sights on your gun? Or a scope/red dot? Otherwise it would be worth the extra scratch to have the gun shooting to point of aim/point of impact. Trying to hold low on a dodging coyote thats busting through the brush might be a hassle.

I've not been overly impressed with Pattern Masters product. I will say that pattern from them is one of the better looking targets I've seen using one of their chokes. Rich Cronk had one and it didn't do all that well.

I really like the Kick's Ind. choke tubes. They will make a recommendation for choke diameter depending upon your needs, then allow you to shoot it and see if it suits you. If you don't like it, they'll switch out chokes with you at no charge until you're satisfied.
 
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Weasel,
Do you have adjustable sights on your gun? Or a scope/red dot? Otherwise it would be worth the extra scratch to have the gun shooting to point of aim/point of impact. Trying to hold low on a dodging coyote thats busting through the brush might be a hassle.



Weazel's on the money. Shotguns for turkey and predator need a more precise adjustable aiming method than the standard bead. Many chokes give excellent patterns, but must be adjusted in with sighting devices.

Would like to see more tests like the above. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif
 
My gun has a 21" smooth bore barrel with open sights. I have a Bushnell Holo-Sight mounted on it too. I was using the Holo-Sight for these tests. I can adjust the point of aim easily enough once I settle on a barrel, choke tube and load. With this particular load the Remington Extended Turkey Choke sucked. The Remington extra full & full tubes weren't very good either. The modified tube wasn't too bad and the improved tube was about the same.
When I first started shooting this load in this gun, I had a Patternmaster tube from Cabela's. The patterns had spots where about 50% of pellets were concentrated, but about 50% of them were blown out of the pattern. I called the guy at Patternmaster and told him the gun and load I was shooting and he sent me the choke I used for the photo. It's a huge improvement over the first Pattermaster I had. The targets are 7" from back to belly, 24" long from back end to nose and 15" from bottom of feet the tips of ears. I think that both the Patternmaster and Undertaker tubes will work fine at 40 yards and maybe farther once I bring the point of aim down a little more. As it sits, the Pattermaster had 20 hits and the Undertaker had 14. I'm not counting the pellets that hit on the edge of the back. The shells have 41 pellets so many of them went over the top of the targets. I'll try my 26" barrel next and see how that compares.
I'd like to try the Kick's Ind. choke tubes. Being able to try and trade would be great. Varmint Master, you've got a great deal too! I wish I had the resources to try more tubes, barrels and ammo combinations, but for those like me I figured this post might help you get started on the right track to finding what works best for you. I hope to hear all of your experiences.

This is the gun with the 26" barrel installed:

11-87.jpg
 
Very good thread! Trulock makes a very good choke and will trade out to a different size if your not satisfied....their cs is hard to beat! I had been wanting to try out a Pattern Master choke, but may not now.
I use a .660 turkey choke with #4 Buckshot and I love the pattern in my Beretta 686!
I have found that patterning a shotgun is a little more subjective than a rifle imo.
 
QuarterRound....for the aiming devise on my shotgun I use a a Red Dot scope. Sure do like that little hummer.
 
Hi Weasel the guy that owns the shop will help me any way he can. He as spent alot of time helping me on my turkey guns. And i think you will find out that your 26 inch barrel should put a few more pellets in the target. The man that owns the places will take each gun. Shoot it @ 30 yrds and see where the point of impact is. And alot of guns is off. I had a New M1 Super 90 camo 12ga Benelli with a 21 inch barrel it was shooting 10 ins to the right. That is where the point of impact was with it and that was using factory chokes. I sent it back to Benelli and they kept it a few months didnt fix a think sent it back to me. Like it was in the first place . I loaded the gun up in the truck and went looking for a new shotgun. I came home with a New Win Super X 2 NWTF shotgun with sights. I have owned MY last Benelli. Back to the point of impacts on guns Some people mite need sights to move the best of the pattern around to get it to hit where you want it to.And the custom chokes i buy is worth 40.00 dollars. Where can you go and try all the chokes you want and dont have to buy one if you dont like it for free and when i do find one it just cost me 40.00 dollars and they are worth it. VM
 
I had a SBE a few years ago and mine a least a foot off center and since I had the barrel ported before I even shot it Benelli said that the warranty was void because the porting caused the problem....I will NEVER buy or even consider buying a Benelli!
I have a Beretta 686 that shoots perfectly to poa and am very satisfied!
 
I think some folks that have never patterned their shotguns would be surprised. An internet friend bought a Franchi and found out (after turkey hunting with it) that it too shot way to the left. I think that patterning your shotgun is every bit as important as sighting in your rifle. So far all of the barrels I've tried on my 11-87 hit to point of aim with the factory bead sights.
I've found some barrels will shoot a certain load much better or much worse than an otherwise identical barrel. I have 2, 30" fixed full choke barrels for Rem 870's. My son also has one. All three barrels are slightly different in their load preference.
 
For me this is a very good read. I have never been seriously interested in shotgunning until recently when hunting coyotes in some heavy brush. When I buy my new 12 any day now, my next step will be a target as opposed to taking it straight into the field.

Thanks Guys,

Biker
 
Weasel, you're right on with the comparison about patterning the shotgun and sighting in a rifle. I'd venture to say that as unpredictable as shotguns, chokes, and loads can be, shotgunners should give more attention to varience or changes in shot size, chokes, buffering material, loads, ect... We've discussed this often here before this thread.
 
The NRA does reviews on lots of shotguns in the "American Rifleman" and almost none of them put the center of pattern at center of aim. Even very expensive shotguns will rarely exactly center their patterns. Shooting high is no problem and actually desireable so you can see your target over the barrel rather than being obscured by it. Shooting low or to a side are definitely not good things.

Jack
 
Hi Weasel Benelli owns Franchi . And i am with you Berrettaman 686 is a good shotgun. Now if it had been a Beretta shotgun. The guy that helps me with my custom chokes knows a gunsmith that works at Beretta. he said if it would have been one of there guns he would have fix it. But Benelli's wants to keep them a few months and send them back to you NOT FIXED. I had owned 3 or 4 other Benelli's beside that one . That one was my LAST ONE. I got a new Win SX2 3 1/2 NWTF 24 inch barrel with Mossy Oak Break UP camo with sights and should have only come with the turkey choke. I got it home and open the box and it had mod. imp cy. chokes and the wrench in the box too. Plus Winchester gave me a 100.00 mail in rebate with it . VM
 
A good friend of mine who is a state trooper went turkey hunting a few years ago and missed two turkeys up close. He is a excellent hunter and very good marksman, I just don't think they he knew you have to pattern a shotgun....but he does now!
I have found patterning a shotgun to be fun with all the differnt chokes and load combo's, just as much fun as it is with working up a load for a rifle.
Good thread btw!
 
Interesting thread. I was puzzled at first on how much higher one choke shot then the other.
Recently I picked up a 1300 and had a hastings choke that was suposably a 'universal fit' for the m88/500/1300. I don't belive all there is to read on the package anymore. When properly installed the hastings does not fit 'square' in the Winchester. You can feel an edge where the choke end in the barrel, on one side. Not so if it's on the Mossberg. Fluke? Perhaps, but the tru-glow and the winchokes fit like a glove.
Still working on a good buckshot load.
 


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