223 AI or 204
- Thread starter BWB
- Start date
It's a good thing we all have choices, because it just doesn't make any sense to me to run a 1:12 or 1:14 twist .223(AI) with today's bullets. Even if all I planned to shoot were 40 or 50 grainers, I'd take my chances with a rifle twisted 1:8 or 1:9 shooting them well as opposed to a 1:12 or 1:14 shooting heavies if you ever decided to go that route. Just my .02$
Tim Neitzke
New member
I've been told by many .223 ai guys,that 1:8" twist is the way to go.
40 -75 gr it will handle well.
40 -75 gr it will handle well.
Outlawkyote
New member
Originally Posted By: Tim NeitzkeI've been told by many .223 ai guys,that 1:8" twist is the way to go.
40 -75 gr it will handle well.
I shoot 80gr SMKs in my 8 twist too.
The problem with fast twist barrels is when the lil bullets hit pelts "splash". Another problem is after your barrel starts getting well used, the throut starts getting rough and will make small bullets come apart.
In a 223, the problem isnt much of an issue but, in my "faster cartridges" I wouldnt dream of running a 40gr bullet in my 8 twist barrels when usually a 55gr bullet can barely handle the RPM. 50gr bullets usually pop when I get them to about 4200fps in an 8 twist barrel so you know a 40gr bullet will pop long before reaching 4600fps.
Yep, the 223 is mighty forgiving but, I still prefer my 14 twist barrel over my 8 twist barrel when shooting small bullets.
40 -75 gr it will handle well.
I shoot 80gr SMKs in my 8 twist too.
The problem with fast twist barrels is when the lil bullets hit pelts "splash". Another problem is after your barrel starts getting well used, the throut starts getting rough and will make small bullets come apart.
In a 223, the problem isnt much of an issue but, in my "faster cartridges" I wouldnt dream of running a 40gr bullet in my 8 twist barrels when usually a 55gr bullet can barely handle the RPM. 50gr bullets usually pop when I get them to about 4200fps in an 8 twist barrel so you know a 40gr bullet will pop long before reaching 4600fps.
Yep, the 223 is mighty forgiving but, I still prefer my 14 twist barrel over my 8 twist barrel when shooting small bullets.
Tim Neitzke
New member
Outlawkyote,
Your speeds seam a little unreal for a .223. Since "AIing" a .223 will give 1-200 fps more at best. I dought you can push a 50 gr to 4200 fps,since a .204R can barley do it in a 32 gr.
I just don't see it.
Your speeds seam a little unreal for a .223. Since "AIing" a .223 will give 1-200 fps more at best. I dought you can push a 50 gr to 4200 fps,since a .204R can barley do it in a 32 gr.
I just don't see it.
Originally Posted By: OutlawkyoteOriginally Posted By: Tim NeitzkeI've been told by many .223 ai guys,that 1:8" twist is the way to go.
40 -75 gr it will handle well.
I shoot 80gr SMKs in my 8 twist too.
The problem with fast twist barrels is when the lil bullets hit pelts "splash". Another problem is after your barrel starts getting well used, the throut starts getting rough and will make small bullets come apart.
In a 223, the problem isnt much of an issue but in my faster cartridges I wouldnt dream of running a 40gr bullet in my 8 twist barrels when usually a 55gr bullet can barely handle the RPM. 50gr bullets usually pop when I get them to about 4200fps in an 8 twist barrel so you know a 40gr bullet will pop long before reaching 4600fps.
Yep, the 223 is mighty forgiving but, I still prefer my 14 twist barrel over my 8 twist barrel when shooting small bullets.
All I gotta say is wow!....
40 -75 gr it will handle well.
I shoot 80gr SMKs in my 8 twist too.
The problem with fast twist barrels is when the lil bullets hit pelts "splash". Another problem is after your barrel starts getting well used, the throut starts getting rough and will make small bullets come apart.
In a 223, the problem isnt much of an issue but in my faster cartridges I wouldnt dream of running a 40gr bullet in my 8 twist barrels when usually a 55gr bullet can barely handle the RPM. 50gr bullets usually pop when I get them to about 4200fps in an 8 twist barrel so you know a 40gr bullet will pop long before reaching 4600fps.
Yep, the 223 is mighty forgiving but, I still prefer my 14 twist barrel over my 8 twist barrel when shooting small bullets.
All I gotta say is wow!....
Outlawkyote
New member
Originally Posted By: Tim NeitzkeOutlawkyote,
Your speeds seam a little unreal for a .223. Since "AIing" a .223 will give 1-200 fps more at best. I dought you can push a 50 gr to 4200 fps,since a .204R can barley do it in a 32 gr.
I just don't see it.
No, I was refering to my "faster cartridges". I am talking about my 22-243 but I spose thats irrelivant in this thread since its a 223AI thread. I can on the other hand get the 50gr .204 going 4000fps in my 204 Apache with a 9 twist shilen.
My point was that a 1in8 twist is not always the best solution and after throat wear, small bullets might not handle the 8 twist anymore.
Your speeds seam a little unreal for a .223. Since "AIing" a .223 will give 1-200 fps more at best. I dought you can push a 50 gr to 4200 fps,since a .204R can barley do it in a 32 gr.
I just don't see it.
No, I was refering to my "faster cartridges". I am talking about my 22-243 but I spose thats irrelivant in this thread since its a 223AI thread. I can on the other hand get the 50gr .204 going 4000fps in my 204 Apache with a 9 twist shilen.
My point was that a 1in8 twist is not always the best solution and after throat wear, small bullets might not handle the 8 twist anymore.
Last edited:
Outlawkyote
New member
For me, it seems as though going from 9 twist to 8 twist is a big step. If I was going to shoot small bullets mostly I would choose the 9 twist over an 8 twist and give up only the largest of the bullets. The 75gr A-max will stabalize in a 9 twist barrel so your only giving up the 80 gr bullets. In fact Ive been shooting the 77gr SMKs in my 9 twist barrels but your results may vary.
The 75gr A-max is just about the same in BCs as the 80gr SMKs so in all actuality your really not giving up much if anything by going to a slightly slower twist. When shooting the smallest of the .224 bullets (40-55gr), the slightly slower twist will be a much better choice I think.
Even in my 224clark, the 9 twist barrel will pop 75gr A-max at only 3600fps so, once again, my point is that bullets can pop even at slower velocities.
Choices are great though and with a 223AI, your really not going to have much trouble with small bullet in fast twist until the barrel becomes very worn.
The 75gr A-max is just about the same in BCs as the 80gr SMKs so in all actuality your really not giving up much if anything by going to a slightly slower twist. When shooting the smallest of the .224 bullets (40-55gr), the slightly slower twist will be a much better choice I think.
Even in my 224clark, the 9 twist barrel will pop 75gr A-max at only 3600fps so, once again, my point is that bullets can pop even at slower velocities.
Choices are great though and with a 223AI, your really not going to have much trouble with small bullet in fast twist until the barrel becomes very worn.
That's why I chose a Kimber Montana .223 with 1:9 twist for my latest venture. Gonna have it punched AI sometime down the road. It shoots 40gr and 50gr Vmax's good, but I like having the option of shooting 75gr Amax's if I ever decide to go that route. Might take some tweaking of the mag box, etc. to do so though.
Outlawkyote
New member
I recently built an 8 twist 223AI and its VERY accurate. The thing Im optomistic about is that its seems so slow and sluggish when shooting the heavy bullets. Going from 200-500yds makes a large difference in dope. I was zeroed at 200yds and moving to 500yds my bullet dropped 40" which seems like so much after shooting my larger .224's.
The 50gr bullet however only has about 3' of drop between the same distances so its gotta be +600yds before the larger bullets have much of anything to offer (except bucking the wind potential)
Maybe that will be the fun part though? I'll shoot it until i get tired of it and prolly just punch it out to another 22-243 while going back to the slow twist barrels for the 223AI's. Choice is good though...
The 50gr bullet however only has about 3' of drop between the same distances so its gotta be +600yds before the larger bullets have much of anything to offer (except bucking the wind potential)
Maybe that will be the fun part though? I'll shoot it until i get tired of it and prolly just punch it out to another 22-243 while going back to the slow twist barrels for the 223AI's. Choice is good though...