6.5 Grendel vs. 308
- Thread starter JustNsane
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deaddogwalkin
Active member
Do you want the gun to sit in the safe or do you want to use it for hunting. I can tell you that the ar10 that I own sits in the safe unless I am shooting from a bench and can drive right up to where I am going to be shooting. Because it is heavy. The ar15's get the call when I am out hunting. I would lean towards the Grendel. JMO
At one time I owned a 1976 Scout and a 1961 Corvette. Guess which one went to the woods/trails and which one got the high sped low drag duty.
I would prefer the lighter faster 6.5 for most applications day in day out if it met the performance envelop and I am use to packing heavy bolt guns for PD's a long way.
Greg
I would prefer the lighter faster 6.5 for most applications day in day out if it met the performance envelop and I am use to packing heavy bolt guns for PD's a long way.
Greg
Plant.One
Well-known member
let me preface to say that i'm not terribly familiar with the grendel... but a few general things to think about
do you already own another firearm in either caliber? are you a reloader? whats your intended purpose for the gun?
not having to stock components/ammo for two calibers is a big consideration for some folks. and coming out of the ammo shortage of recent history - unfortunately any of us who shoot in even moderate volume are in a situation where you almost have to have your own ammo shelf.
im a LR308 owner (the dpms version of the ar10) and i choose 308 because of commonality. its a known commodity. the list of available components for reloading, as well as factory ammo offerings is longer than a 8yr old's christmas list. there are SO many things that work, even in a pinch you could probably come up with powder/primer/bullets of a combination that'll give ya stuff to push a bullet down the bore. add to that the (relative) ease of access for getting milsurp brass to reload with & its hard to not call it a winner. the most recent batch of Lake city 7.62 brass i picked up was under $0.10/ea for raw brass. fully processed can be had for a few cents more per. the cheapest grendel brass i can see starts at about $0.60 per.
from a quick google its relatively easy to convert grendel brass from 7.62x39 brass, but that can be a trick to find too from time to time - most of the military x39 you find is steel cased.
the 6mm ar (grendel, spc, 6x45, etc) offerings have the bonus of the BC over many of its 30 caliber offerings so they have that going for them.
one other consideration - the ar15 platform is going to end up (in most instances) significantly lighter than most AR-308 platforms. You'd have to put a big heavy bull barrel on an ar15 upper to match the weight of even a 16" typical 308. so if this is going to be a walking hunting rig where weight is a significant consideration.... the grendel may come out right on top from that perspective alone. as a stationary deer blind hunter the extra pound or two doesnt bother me and a long hike with my rifle will be around ½-1 mile tops. so hiking around with a 10lb 308, or bull barrel 300blk that comes in at 9 lbs isn't an issue for me. If i were more of a stalking type hunter where i was trying to cover a lot of ground... i'd be looking to shave every ounce i could and probably be hunting with a lightweight ar15 type build.
hopefully this'll help give you a few thoughts to narrow down your decision
good luck and remember once you get one or the other
do you already own another firearm in either caliber? are you a reloader? whats your intended purpose for the gun?
not having to stock components/ammo for two calibers is a big consideration for some folks. and coming out of the ammo shortage of recent history - unfortunately any of us who shoot in even moderate volume are in a situation where you almost have to have your own ammo shelf.
im a LR308 owner (the dpms version of the ar10) and i choose 308 because of commonality. its a known commodity. the list of available components for reloading, as well as factory ammo offerings is longer than a 8yr old's christmas list. there are SO many things that work, even in a pinch you could probably come up with powder/primer/bullets of a combination that'll give ya stuff to push a bullet down the bore. add to that the (relative) ease of access for getting milsurp brass to reload with & its hard to not call it a winner. the most recent batch of Lake city 7.62 brass i picked up was under $0.10/ea for raw brass. fully processed can be had for a few cents more per. the cheapest grendel brass i can see starts at about $0.60 per.
from a quick google its relatively easy to convert grendel brass from 7.62x39 brass, but that can be a trick to find too from time to time - most of the military x39 you find is steel cased.
the 6mm ar (grendel, spc, 6x45, etc) offerings have the bonus of the BC over many of its 30 caliber offerings so they have that going for them.
one other consideration - the ar15 platform is going to end up (in most instances) significantly lighter than most AR-308 platforms. You'd have to put a big heavy bull barrel on an ar15 upper to match the weight of even a 16" typical 308. so if this is going to be a walking hunting rig where weight is a significant consideration.... the grendel may come out right on top from that perspective alone. as a stationary deer blind hunter the extra pound or two doesnt bother me and a long hike with my rifle will be around ½-1 mile tops. so hiking around with a 10lb 308, or bull barrel 300blk that comes in at 9 lbs isn't an issue for me. If i were more of a stalking type hunter where i was trying to cover a lot of ground... i'd be looking to shave every ounce i could and probably be hunting with a lightweight ar15 type build.
hopefully this'll help give you a few thoughts to narrow down your decision
good luck and remember once you get one or the other
Widow maker 223
Active member
I would go with the 6.5. The AR10 will be a pig unless you go with a 16" lighter contour barrel. If you arent trying to reach 1K yds a 16-18" barrel would be fine in a .308.
Originally Posted By: Plant.One
do you already own another firearm in either caliber? are you a reloader? whats your intended purpose for the gun?
not having to stock components/ammo for two calibers is a big consideration for some folks. and coming out of the ammo shortage of recent history - unfortunately any of us who shoot in even moderate volume are in a situation where you almost have to have your own ammo shelf.
I think he hit the nail on the head. Seeing as you don't load your own the next time the crap hits the fan for ammo-and we know that could happen any day and don't forget it's election year- your are going to be out of luck for a while if you don't have a nice stash. Companies will produce 308 ammo over 6.5 so it will be much easier to find. I really like the idea of a 6.5 ar (be it a Grendel or more likely a 260 rem) but that means another cal bullet (and possibly brass) I have to have on hand to reload. Seeing as I already have a few other 308's I'm planning on a 308 ar.
do you already own another firearm in either caliber? are you a reloader? whats your intended purpose for the gun?
not having to stock components/ammo for two calibers is a big consideration for some folks. and coming out of the ammo shortage of recent history - unfortunately any of us who shoot in even moderate volume are in a situation where you almost have to have your own ammo shelf.
I think he hit the nail on the head. Seeing as you don't load your own the next time the crap hits the fan for ammo-and we know that could happen any day and don't forget it's election year- your are going to be out of luck for a while if you don't have a nice stash. Companies will produce 308 ammo over 6.5 so it will be much easier to find. I really like the idea of a 6.5 ar (be it a Grendel or more likely a 260 rem) but that means another cal bullet (and possibly brass) I have to have on hand to reload. Seeing as I already have a few other 308's I'm planning on a 308 ar.
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JoeBobOutfitters
New member
6.5Grendel is a better choice in the AR platforms. You have far more (and cheaper/lighter) options for 6.5 Grendel AR15 parts and pieces than AR10 stuff. That, to me, is worth staying with the smaller platform.
Zen Archery
New member
Depends on purpose on how you intend to use?
Stirling XD
New member
To me it would depend on what other calibers you already have. I recently built a 6.5. It filled the gap between my .223 and 30-06. If I was in need of a deer and elk rifle, I would go with the 308. If you already have an elk rifle, go with the 6.5.
One of the other reasons I went with the 6.5 was that I wanted an AR (or battle rifle) that packed a little more punch and I had a spare AR upper laying around. It will be my new deer and antelope gun.
One of the other reasons I went with the 6.5 was that I wanted an AR (or battle rifle) that packed a little more punch and I had a spare AR upper laying around. It will be my new deer and antelope gun.
Field Medic
New member
Which lower do you presently have? Ar10 compliant or AR 15 ?
Varminterror
New member
I have lots of AR-15's, I have two AR-10's... I guess that gives you an idea of which I'm going to suggest. The AR-10 is big, heavy, and unhandy. The AR-15 is less big, less heavy, and less unhandy.
Every time I think about building another AR-10, I find myself quickly drift to building another M1a. If you're going big, go big.
Every time I think about building another AR-10, I find myself quickly drift to building another M1a. If you're going big, go big.
Squeeze
New member
Originally Posted By: Varminterror
Every time I think about building another AR-10, I find myself quickly drift to building another M1a. If you're going big, go big.
I can relate! I have an LR-308, that now wears an X-Caliber barrel, and a bunch of other nice parts, that I wish would shoot as well as my M1A! I have some thrown together 308 Win ammo, as in a 7.62x51 LC case, Win LP primer, 44.0 grains of IMR-4064, under a cheap Hornady 150gr SP, and the M1A, with battle sights, shoots 1.5" groups off the bench. The LR-308 with a 2.5x10 Vortex Viper, and development loads, target at the LR-308 barely get into 1 MOA. I think I should move the optics over to the M1A, and sell the LR-308.
Squeeze
P.S. My recommendation would be to stick with the AR-15 platform, and if you want more thump, make it a 6.8 SPC. You can shoot 90gr. HPs, or 95 gr. Barnes TTSX, bullets and cover both predators(not fur friendly), or medium sized high speed food. Unless you want to shoot long range(>500 yards), then the AR-10/LR308 would get the nod...Provided you get one that shoots.
Every time I think about building another AR-10, I find myself quickly drift to building another M1a. If you're going big, go big.
I can relate! I have an LR-308, that now wears an X-Caliber barrel, and a bunch of other nice parts, that I wish would shoot as well as my M1A! I have some thrown together 308 Win ammo, as in a 7.62x51 LC case, Win LP primer, 44.0 grains of IMR-4064, under a cheap Hornady 150gr SP, and the M1A, with battle sights, shoots 1.5" groups off the bench. The LR-308 with a 2.5x10 Vortex Viper, and development loads, target at the LR-308 barely get into 1 MOA. I think I should move the optics over to the M1A, and sell the LR-308.
Squeeze
P.S. My recommendation would be to stick with the AR-15 platform, and if you want more thump, make it a 6.8 SPC. You can shoot 90gr. HPs, or 95 gr. Barnes TTSX, bullets and cover both predators(not fur friendly), or medium sized high speed food. Unless you want to shoot long range(>500 yards), then the AR-10/LR308 would get the nod...Provided you get one that shoots.
Plant.One
Well-known member
i guess my LR 308 experience isn't very typical then.
FGGM shoots ~ moa with the factory 16" barrel, and 165 SST and 168 AMAX both will perform just under 3/4" 3 shot groups @ 100 yds with handloads. quite frustrated i couldn't get it under half an inch though. i did some goofing around a couple summers ago at 565 yds, and managed this group on a factory 16" barrel w/ hornady match 168 amax. this was the very first day i ever tried to shoot that gun at those distances, and probably only the 3rd time in my life i'd even attempted to shoot that distance. for the most part my shooting has been limited to 200 yds.
now i openly own the flyer(shot 4), called it before i even saw the target as i left my spotting scope @ home. would have loved another go at it but ran out of daylight.
measured without the flyer, the 4 shot group measures 2.016" - or 0.341 MOA.
i have since assembled a new 20" MEGA barreled upper for that lower, but haven't had a chance to get out and put it through the paces yet. I got super busy late last summer and just ran out of outdoor trigger time - i dont do any load development/testing in the winter. I've got varget and 4895 under 168 amax test ladders waiting for it, and plan to load up another batch with some 178's and see if its happier with some heavier stuff.
i'm excited for spring to get here, i've got my cousin all excited to get out and play with his 7mm mag at long distance as well. It'll be nice to have a shooting buddy to post up on the spotting scope and call shots.
FGGM shoots ~ moa with the factory 16" barrel, and 165 SST and 168 AMAX both will perform just under 3/4" 3 shot groups @ 100 yds with handloads. quite frustrated i couldn't get it under half an inch though. i did some goofing around a couple summers ago at 565 yds, and managed this group on a factory 16" barrel w/ hornady match 168 amax. this was the very first day i ever tried to shoot that gun at those distances, and probably only the 3rd time in my life i'd even attempted to shoot that distance. for the most part my shooting has been limited to 200 yds.
now i openly own the flyer(shot 4), called it before i even saw the target as i left my spotting scope @ home. would have loved another go at it but ran out of daylight.
measured without the flyer, the 4 shot group measures 2.016" - or 0.341 MOA.
i have since assembled a new 20" MEGA barreled upper for that lower, but haven't had a chance to get out and put it through the paces yet. I got super busy late last summer and just ran out of outdoor trigger time - i dont do any load development/testing in the winter. I've got varget and 4895 under 168 amax test ladders waiting for it, and plan to load up another batch with some 178's and see if its happier with some heavier stuff.
i'm excited for spring to get here, i've got my cousin all excited to get out and play with his 7mm mag at long distance as well. It'll be nice to have a shooting buddy to post up on the spotting scope and call shots.
Campower
New member
Both are great calibers. Can't go wrong with either. A 16" Grendel at my altitude (660 ft) shooting 123 amax at 2450 fps will stay supersonic until 1050 yards.. that's the same range as my 308 20" bolt gun shooting 175 VLD hunting handloads with 44gr varget (warm load) at 2600 fps. I'm sentimental towards the 308, but [beeep] the 6.5 grendel is efficient up the [beeep].
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Nightvisionary
New member
The DPMS G2 Hunter in .308 solves the bulk and weight problem with AR10 rifles. I replaced the rifle buffer tube and fixed stock with a carbine tube, buffer, and Magpul STR stock which saved about 4 ounces. The weight unloaded with a 20 inch barrel is just a hair over 7lbs.
Currently magazine sources for the 6.5 Grendel are Elander, ASC and C-Products. I have not shot the Elander but I have the other two. I have had no issues running capacities as noted with most of mine being done with the ten rounders and some 15's. I sue mostly the ASC’s and have never had to touch a feed lip. I use them on four 6.5’s and variants. I also use the same 6.5 magazines for my 6.8’s and variants. I have seen many 308 rifles that required magazine massage so it is not universally reliable. No magic there.
Barrel weights on a Grendel vs. a 556 will always favor the Grendel on a same size profile simply because the bore is bigger as is the chamber material loss. The only place, normally, that the 223 would be smaller than the Grendel would be in the ½” long muzzle thread area as the G. uses the 5/8 diameter vs the ½ for the 223.
For ease of shooting the G. is more controllable for follow up shots and given a decent usable shooting range on game will perform quite nicely. For smaller statured shooters humping that big gun and shooting it are a bit of a challenge.
The ammunition offerings for the Grendel are more common and the prices have dropped dramatically recently. The biggest failure on the Grendel is poor bolts that do not have the extractor and ejector set up correctly. The bolt catch on the AR10 is can be problematic in many cases as it’s weak point IMHO. The part choices for an AR15 based rifle are huge compared to the big platform and Mil-spec commonality is prevalent on the AR15 and it is nothing even close to that in t he AR10 style guns.
Greg
Barrel weights on a Grendel vs. a 556 will always favor the Grendel on a same size profile simply because the bore is bigger as is the chamber material loss. The only place, normally, that the 223 would be smaller than the Grendel would be in the ½” long muzzle thread area as the G. uses the 5/8 diameter vs the ½ for the 223.
For ease of shooting the G. is more controllable for follow up shots and given a decent usable shooting range on game will perform quite nicely. For smaller statured shooters humping that big gun and shooting it are a bit of a challenge.
The ammunition offerings for the Grendel are more common and the prices have dropped dramatically recently. The biggest failure on the Grendel is poor bolts that do not have the extractor and ejector set up correctly. The bolt catch on the AR10 is can be problematic in many cases as it’s weak point IMHO. The part choices for an AR15 based rifle are huge compared to the big platform and Mil-spec commonality is prevalent on the AR15 and it is nothing even close to that in t he AR10 style guns.
Greg