60 Grain V-Max-Ogive wrong or short throated rifle?

Originally Posted By: pyscodogI have Hornady OAL gauges but I also have a resized fired case with slots cut in the neck. I then insert a bullet and chamber the dummy round, then slowly open the bolt and extract the dummy round. This will give you the OAL also. Cheap and easy.

I think my guages will be here before the parts to replace my extractor will, so I will use the guages first and then once I get my bolt working again I will try tour suggestion and compare data. Thanks for the idea!
 
Ok the verdict is in. I measured and I hit the lands with the 60 grain Vmax at 2.232. I am going to back off .010 and drop the charge to 25 grains of Varget and give that a try.

Any thoughts or recommendations?
 
Bluedog, start at the start.

1. order the Hornady OAL gauge-they last your life time and your children's life time
I use the split neck method as it is easier for me to work with than that giz mo
where you screw on a threaded case and insert a bullet pushing the bullet up into the
lands.

2. order the Forster drop tube powder funnel, which is about 6-8" long, really nice. Powder level
will drop, and I have seen this drop pressures with N133 and N135 powders.

3. You are seeing extreme pressures at the primer, what exactly. Cratered primers, flat?

4. I would recommend that you back off to 25g and work up in .3 increments, AFTER you get the
Hornady Ogive gauge to measure the exact seating depth.

Varget with the 60g V max can exhibit extreme accuracy and is a monster of coyote killing combo, but you have to due your part.

Again, use thick cup primers to help eliminating piercing:
CCI 41
cci BR-4
Rem 7 1/2
CCI 450

Be careful of blown primers, they can eat the point off the firing pin and make it look like a wore out chisel which will leade to more blown primers.

Tough brass with thick cup primers...life is good!

I learned this lesson well on a hunt where a blown primer ruined my trigger, I sat and called, watched my buddies miss the coyotes that were called in.
 
Just looked up your load in the latest Hornady manual, and it list's an OAL of 2.250, and a max charge of 24.9 grs of Varget. If you are touching the lands at 2.232, and have to seat them down to 2.225 or so, I would think that the max charge would then actually be less than 24.9. I have loaded 60 gr Vmax's for my Rock River AR at the OAL of 2.250, and they have chambered fine, but as you have found out every rifle is different. I have three 223's, two Remington bolts, and one AR, and they all require different case sizing, OAL's, and powder charges.
 
I own two savage axis 223rem rifles one heavy barrel and another normal barrel and the heavy barrel has a short throat on it. Hornady book calls for 2.250 for the 55gr v max and anything over 2.232 I'm into the lands so I used the hornady tool with modified case and the ogive tool and have no more issues. I would suggest if your seating deeper to back of a grain or two and watch for pressure signs.
 
I always always always use a comparator when measuring my lengths. I personally could give a crap less what my COAL is in a bolt gun. What I want to know is what is my length from the base of the cartridge to the Ogive of the bullet. Differences in bullet casts can make rather large differences when comparing COAL to base-Ogive measurements. If you use the Hornady OAL gauge, and use a comparator you will be getting the most accurate measure of your chamber- the measure from the base of the cartridge, to the Ogive (aka the point that engages the rifling of your barrel). Base all your reloads off of this measurement method, and you will never have another stuck bullet in the barrel again.
 
Caution on the Hornady gauge.
You must have the case length gauges as well, from Hornady. Measure a fired, in your chamber case. Then measure the one from Hornady. Your fired case will likely be longer than the Hornady case. Subtract the difference then ADD that difference number back to your OAL with the Hornady piece. The difference could be .010 or more. It can matter.
The Hornady case is NOT the same length as YOUR fired case datum of shoulder.
 
Ok, so I backed off to an OAL of 2.222 and 25 grains of varget. Loaded up a few and went to the range. I shot a few at 100 yards and accuracy was one jagged hole. No pressure signs on the primers and the bolt closes easily as it should. I shot a 4 round group at 200 yards and the first 3 bullets were touching and the 4th was a 1/4 inch away from the first three. I am not a bench rest shooter, I am a hunter. This is good enough accuracy for hunting in my experience. I appreciate everyones input on this. It was a real learning experience for me after 30 years of reloading and thinking I knew a little bit...I have tasted humble pie.

The pressures I saw with the initial load were extreme, bolt was hard to close etc. It blew the primers out of a few cases and actually blew the extractor apart...which I have since replaced...a $17 lesson that could have been much worse. I now have the ogive measuring set from hornady as well as the coal guage. I will use this for each different bullet I shoot in each caliber from now on.

I have a clean dimple and round edges on my primers now and have not had any issues with 25 rounds fired. All is well again, and I want to say thank you again for all of the input...you guys are great!

Bluedog
 
Originally Posted By: BluedogOk, so I backed off to an OAL of 2.222 and 25 grains of varget. Loaded up a few and went to the range. I shot a few at 100 yards and accuracy was one jagged hole. No pressure signs on the primers and the bolt closes easily as it should. I shot a 4 round group at 200 yards and the first 3 bullets were touching and the 4th was a 1/4 inch away from the first three. I am not a bench rest shooter, I am a hunter. This is good enough accuracy for hunting in my experience. I appreciate everyones input on this. It was a real learning experience for me after 30 years of reloading and thinking I knew a little bit...I have tasted humble pie.

The pressures I saw with the initial load were extreme, bolt was hard to close etc. It blew the primers out of a few cases and actually blew the extractor apart...which I have since replaced...a $17 lesson that could have been much worse. I now have the ogive measuring set from hornady as well as the coal guage. I will use this for each different bullet I shoot in each caliber from now on.

I have a clean dimple and round edges on my primers now and have not had any issues with 25 rounds fired. All is well again, and I want to say thank you again for all of the input...you guys are great!

Bluedog

Good stuff ...This site can be the bomb !
fyi ,,, humble pie is good with lots of cool whip
wink.gif
 
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