AR10 7WSM?
- Thread starter Hoier
- Start date
yes, I've noticed that. Achieving it with a shorter barrel would be nice for the folks that find that beneficial, but I hunt places where I could go 6-8 miles before I see a tree, let alone need to climb or crawl under one. I love my 24" barrel and have no qualms with getting another one. I've even considered a heavier profile than I already have.
The SAUM still gives the best potential of loading 180vlds in an AR10 mag. Velocity isn't quite as important as this feature. The WSM and RCM could be superior rounds, but I just don't think they are going to be able to run 180s as well in a mag.
7mmSAUM
With the 180s at 2950 your looking at 22 min to reach 1000 yds and deliver 1090fpe
Shooting them 2800 is still only 25 minutes at 1000 delivering 955fpe.
I'd really really like to try a program called RCBS.LOAD to design my own wildcat that I've been thinking about, but haven't gotten much for reviews on how it works. It is suppose to be able to reliably predict H2O capacity by entering brass type, shoulder angle, mouth and caliber based on the parent case.
The SAUM still gives the best potential of loading 180vlds in an AR10 mag. Velocity isn't quite as important as this feature. The WSM and RCM could be superior rounds, but I just don't think they are going to be able to run 180s as well in a mag.
7mmSAUM
With the 180s at 2950 your looking at 22 min to reach 1000 yds and deliver 1090fpe
Shooting them 2800 is still only 25 minutes at 1000 delivering 955fpe.
I'd really really like to try a program called RCBS.LOAD to design my own wildcat that I've been thinking about, but haven't gotten much for reviews on how it works. It is suppose to be able to reliably predict H2O capacity by entering brass type, shoulder angle, mouth and caliber based on the parent case.
I'm pretty sure I never made the silly statement that GAP was the ONLY place to do quality work. I in fact wrote that there are plenty of people out there that could do the requested job. I guess I was hoping to impart to the OP that a GAP rifle, while expensive, is no Las Vegas crapshoot.
The guarantee you quoted might possibly be for real. It does seem however that the 3/4 MOA to GAP is worst case scenario, while to another builder 3/4 MOA may possibly be the best case scenario. I've seen a handful of his rifles, and they speak for themselves.
I'm not in the market for a new rifle, and I agree with you that they are expensive. If I were to purchase a new weapon, I would more than likely either build it myself and hope for the best, or just work a few extra shifts and give GAP a call and rest easy knowing the money was well spent. You won't ever have to wonder if you are going to get a shooter or not.
There are a handful of names in the ranks in the gun smithing business that are no-brainers when it comes to builds. GAP just happens to be the one I am most familiar with that has an unquestionably consistent reputation with builds on the AR10 platform.
C Bass, you may not believe me, but we really do see eye-to-eye on this one.
The guarantee you quoted might possibly be for real. It does seem however that the 3/4 MOA to GAP is worst case scenario, while to another builder 3/4 MOA may possibly be the best case scenario. I've seen a handful of his rifles, and they speak for themselves.
I'm not in the market for a new rifle, and I agree with you that they are expensive. If I were to purchase a new weapon, I would more than likely either build it myself and hope for the best, or just work a few extra shifts and give GAP a call and rest easy knowing the money was well spent. You won't ever have to wonder if you are going to get a shooter or not.
There are a handful of names in the ranks in the gun smithing business that are no-brainers when it comes to builds. GAP just happens to be the one I am most familiar with that has an unquestionably consistent reputation with builds on the AR10 platform.
C Bass, you may not believe me, but we really do see eye-to-eye on this one.
dzlfarmboy
New member
Yeah Im not sure where the big price tag comes with GAP rifles, I've always been a function over fashion guy myself. My rifles dont sit in the safe or range bag. Usually under my back seat and get used quite often and thats why I like the AR style rifles, just tough and rugged.
knockemdown
New member
Originally Posted By: cbass7mmSAUM
With the 180s at 2950 your looking at 22 min to reach 1000 yds and deliver 1090fpe
Shooting them 2800 is still only 25 minutes at 1000 delivering 955fpe.
Do you know of any shooters getting even close to that velocity pushing 180s from a 22" tube? 2800 is even hard to digest, especially from a mag fed AR-10.
Heck, I can run 180s from my 24" 7Wizzer (WSM) at close to 3K. To think that a 7 "Shamu" (nickname for SAUM) can match that, using 2" less tube is hard to believe. IF anything, you're gonna need more barrel to have a chance of even coming close. A 28" tube on an AR-10? NO thanks...
Not to mention that fact that a 180VLD is gonna crowd the 7Shamu's powder capacity at mag length, thereby decreasing how much horsepower ya make & increasing pressure, at the same time...
Just trying to prevent someone from spending $$$ on a build that likely won't reproduce those rather optimistic performance #s.
The thing that makes the .284 caliber shine are those sleek, high b.c. boolits. The dilemma is attempting to realize their potential from an AR. IMHO, stick with a bolt gun...
With the 180s at 2950 your looking at 22 min to reach 1000 yds and deliver 1090fpe
Shooting them 2800 is still only 25 minutes at 1000 delivering 955fpe.
Do you know of any shooters getting even close to that velocity pushing 180s from a 22" tube? 2800 is even hard to digest, especially from a mag fed AR-10.
Heck, I can run 180s from my 24" 7Wizzer (WSM) at close to 3K. To think that a 7 "Shamu" (nickname for SAUM) can match that, using 2" less tube is hard to believe. IF anything, you're gonna need more barrel to have a chance of even coming close. A 28" tube on an AR-10? NO thanks...
Not to mention that fact that a 180VLD is gonna crowd the 7Shamu's powder capacity at mag length, thereby decreasing how much horsepower ya make & increasing pressure, at the same time...
Just trying to prevent someone from spending $$$ on a build that likely won't reproduce those rather optimistic performance #s.
The thing that makes the .284 caliber shine are those sleek, high b.c. boolits. The dilemma is attempting to realize their potential from an AR. IMHO, stick with a bolt gun...
WSMBUCK
New member
knockemdown
New member
When I can get to (and beyond) 1K with a vanilla .243 burning 47 grains of powder, I'll stick with that pea shooter and you can keep the anti-vehicle disabler, LOL!
The 7Wizzer does it on 64 grains, best bang for your long range buck, out to maybe 1500yds. If there is such a thing??? I've only take mine a tad past 1100 though...
The 7Wizzer does it on 64 grains, best bang for your long range buck, out to maybe 1500yds. If there is such a thing??? I've only take mine a tad past 1100 though...
Originally Posted By: knockemdown ] Do you know of any shooters getting even close to that velocity pushing 180s from a 22" tube? 2800 is even hard to digest, especially from a mag fed AR-10.
Nope, don't know one single person, but I never said anything about a 22" barrel either. I have no problem running a 24 or 26" barrel. I wouldn't want it to be a 100yd coyote hiking rifle and you're right, it would be a waste of potential to try shooting 180s out of a short barrel.
This would be built specifically for semi-auto, prone, shooting/hunting beyond 800.
Originally Posted By: WSMBUCKHere is a good choice if yall wanting horse power at 1000 yds
http://www.50bmg.net/
I used to be addicted to the .50s, thought they were the greatest thing since smokeless powder. I've grown out of that phase...now a .338LM or .375CT will be plenty of gun for me. I've been talking with Tactilite for over a year about different calibers their willing to do and what the capabilities are.
Nope, don't know one single person, but I never said anything about a 22" barrel either. I have no problem running a 24 or 26" barrel. I wouldn't want it to be a 100yd coyote hiking rifle and you're right, it would be a waste of potential to try shooting 180s out of a short barrel.
This would be built specifically for semi-auto, prone, shooting/hunting beyond 800.
Originally Posted By: WSMBUCKHere is a good choice if yall wanting horse power at 1000 yds
http://www.50bmg.net/
I made a 7WSM for myself on a 700 LA. I wanted to be able to take full advantage of the case capacity and the long action. I bought some brass, dies, and the bullets I was likely to use, and seated them to the desired OAL. I sent these dummy cartridges to PTG, and had Dave make me a reamer. I shoot 180 VLD's to 3K with my almost 30" Rock barrel, with accuracy that is pretty impressive for someone who is not a competitive shooter or a gunsmith.
If I were to build a SAUM on an AR10 platform, I would look real hard at the 162 AMAX, 168 VLD's and possibly a couple of others. The SAUM case is optimized for a short action, especially an AR, whereas the WSM case favors capacity at the sacrifice of seating depth. The WSM case is really better suited for a bolt gun, although not impossible to use in a gas gun. I'm betting you could do rather well with these bullets, mag fed to 1K even with a shorter barrel.
I favor longer barrels and heavier guns. I don't have anything shorter than 24" except for my wife's 16" AR she uses for comp and patrol. Again if I were looking for such a build, and looking at weight, I would more than likely get an ABS/ Rock barrel at least 24" in length, that would weigh less than a 20" barrel. Barrel length is like almost free horsepower.
By the way, the friends that I know who shoot GAP rifles (bolt guns topped with S&B no less) treat them worse than a framing hammer. Dirt, sand, dings, falls, you name it. If I spent that much, I would seriously consider bubble wrap camo. To them, they are simply tools that had better put the bullets into the same hole until the barrel wears out and it goes back to GAP for a new one; which to these guys is just like getting a haircut. That is the type of performance they are willing to drop coin on. I'm not there yet though.
If I were to build a SAUM on an AR10 platform, I would look real hard at the 162 AMAX, 168 VLD's and possibly a couple of others. The SAUM case is optimized for a short action, especially an AR, whereas the WSM case favors capacity at the sacrifice of seating depth. The WSM case is really better suited for a bolt gun, although not impossible to use in a gas gun. I'm betting you could do rather well with these bullets, mag fed to 1K even with a shorter barrel.
I favor longer barrels and heavier guns. I don't have anything shorter than 24" except for my wife's 16" AR she uses for comp and patrol. Again if I were looking for such a build, and looking at weight, I would more than likely get an ABS/ Rock barrel at least 24" in length, that would weigh less than a 20" barrel. Barrel length is like almost free horsepower.
By the way, the friends that I know who shoot GAP rifles (bolt guns topped with S&B no less) treat them worse than a framing hammer. Dirt, sand, dings, falls, you name it. If I spent that much, I would seriously consider bubble wrap camo. To them, they are simply tools that had better put the bullets into the same hole until the barrel wears out and it goes back to GAP for a new one; which to these guys is just like getting a haircut. That is the type of performance they are willing to drop coin on. I'm not there yet though.
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knockemdown
New member
Sounds like you've got yourself a fine stick there, E!
Haven't shot my GAP 7Wizzer since the warmer weather...
I'm thinkin' maybe it's about time to belly up in a snow drift & get after it again!
f.w.i.w...
I can run 162 Amaxs or 180VLDS from a short action Surgeon to touch the lands, thanks to GAP's expert chambering work & a Wyatt's extended mag box in the A5's gut...
I actually prefer the 162s from my fluted 24" Broughton truck axle. They fly as good, or better than the 180s out to as far as I can shoot. 'Specially so from my "short" barrel, a compromise I'm quite happy with given the overall weight & length of the stick. Plus, those 162Amaxs are readily available & the price is right.
If that rifle don't shoot in the same hole, something is very, very wrong...
Haven't shot my GAP 7Wizzer since the warmer weather...
I'm thinkin' maybe it's about time to belly up in a snow drift & get after it again!
f.w.i.w...
I can run 162 Amaxs or 180VLDS from a short action Surgeon to touch the lands, thanks to GAP's expert chambering work & a Wyatt's extended mag box in the A5's gut...
I actually prefer the 162s from my fluted 24" Broughton truck axle. They fly as good, or better than the 180s out to as far as I can shoot. 'Specially so from my "short" barrel, a compromise I'm quite happy with given the overall weight & length of the stick. Plus, those 162Amaxs are readily available & the price is right.
If that rifle don't shoot in the same hole, something is very, very wrong...