ARGHHHHH , POLICE RUIN 2 HUNTS FOR ME TONIGHT!!!!!!!!

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Mac,

I would've been irate too. I don't know the law to the letter and don't claim to, but doesn't that deputy need "probable cause" to search your truck? Here on the western slope of CO I've seen an alarming increase of LEO's violating people's rights. Past summer, local PD missed a meth lab by two houses, ripped an 87yr old women (couldn't walk without walker or cane) out of her rocking chair and handcuff her at gunpoint. That one was quickly swept under the rug. Check out the Glenwood Post online see what their finest did last Saturday night. Rifle PD has been in the courts several times in the past couple year for excessive use of tasers (think they lost all the cases).

I know these are isolated cases, but it's starting to feel more like a trend out here. I appreciate it's a difficult, complex job, but if we continue to turn our heads, what's next??
 
Well, you've got enough responses here. But I will second or third or whatever calling in advance. Always a good idea!
 
CALL IN ADVANCE!!!! Wait a minute fellas, Last time I checked I still live in America, The Land of the FREE and the home of the brave!!! I shouldnt have to ask anybody for permission but the land owner. When they come to get your guns, you guys should call in advance and leave them laying at your door step to avoid confrontation!!!
 
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CALL IN ADVANCE!!!! Wait a minute fellas, Last time I checked I still live in America, The Land of the FREE and the home of the brave!!! I shouldnt have to ask anybody for permission but the land owner. When they come to get your guns, you guys should call in advance and leave them laying at your door step to avoid confrontation!!!



It is that attitude right there that causes lots of landowners to NOT allow hunting. It is not the landowners obligation to allow hunting. The easist way for them to avoid problems is to stop hunting on their land.

This has nothing to do with asking, it has to do with telling! If it is legal to night hunt the best thing to do is #1 let the landowner know you are planning on night calling providing you have his permission and then #2 tell the law where you are planning to night hunt and what your hunting.
It saves lots of people lots of trouble. There is always some busy body that calls the law and often times exagerates what they've seen.

Lets see Don't call in advance:

1.Land owner is not sure really just who is out there{he may have even forgot that he said you could hunt}.
2. when he gets woke up during the night and has to go check, you may lose a hunting spot.
3.The law does their job,checking to see what's going on {granted some go over board} wasting their valuable time and tax payers money for no reason.
4.A good hunt is ruined because your either too proud or too lazy to make 2 phone calls!

Make 2 courtesy calls:
1. landowner is not bothered.
2. landowner is not upset for loosing sleep!!!
3. When someone calls the law, they already know who is there and what your doing.
4. the hunt is not ruined!

There is one other plus to building relationships with the local law. Problem animals are often reported to the law first. If they know you and your reputation they will often times tell the landowners..... Ol' so and so is a coyote caller he'd be glad to help you out..... I can't tell you how many places I have gained access to either through a law officer,game warden,local Biologist or the ag extension agent.

2 Phone calls!
 
Hey Wes,

Like Glenn said! ...and don't expect to find my guns on my front porch anytime soon... I'm a Life/Endowment NRA member and proud of it, too!

You are obviously still young and somewhat uninformed... and yes, just as our forefathers did, we have to stand up for our rights, yet we have to know the laws and have respect and understanding of how they work in given circumstances.
Night hunting is very easily mistaken for poaching and the officer had every right to look over your vehicle after receiving a complaint by that neighbor guy... regardless of who or what kind of idiot the neighbor might be and regardless of your having permission to be there. The same would hold true even if you owned the land! Sounds crazy and I don't agree with that either but that is the way the laws work. The officer's duty is to follow up on the complaint and by doing so he probably did over step his authority by searching inside your vehicle but probable cause is simple, he found your vehicle parked out in the middle of nowhere late at night and that my friend is probable enough.

As for busting your stand... I've even had Conservation walk out and instruct me to climb down from my deer stand on private property! Was I mad?... heck ya, but that is what the law says so I did as he asked and afterwards he appoligized and explained that a neighbor had called. Later that day I found a tree stand that wasn't supposed to be there on the same land and guess who it belonged to... that's right, the nosy neighbor. I still have that tree stand!

Hey enough anyway... let's try to get together and do some calling. I'm only twenty miles from you guys! That is if you don't mind hunting with a 55year old guy that's been calling coyotes for the last thirty years or so... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smiliesmack.gif

Nikonut/Blackdog Calls /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif
 
You do live in America deerstabber and you don't have to call. You also don't have to be surprised/upset when you get approached by an Officer in the middle of a hunt in the middle of the night. That wasn't said to start a fight but there are two sides to a situation. The average guy doesn't know anything about calling at night and most are surprised it is a legal form of hunting, Officers included, many don't hunt and I can tell you we aren't taught hunting regs. It's their job to check people running around in the middle of the night doing "strange" things. They are expected to stick their nose into situations they find. Everyone is screaming at them about doing their jobs when something happens and they weren't out doing their jobs. The calling suggestion was just a suggestion to avoid undue hassles. I can give you a number of stories of people getting my handgun pointed at them and a few tense moments before things were sorted out. Most times it is a result of some person calling in some crime or situation that turns out to be something totally different than what is dispatched to the officer. You would not believe some of the things I have been dispatched to that are no where near what is actually happening. With that said I have a total right to respond to those situations with MY safety a priority. That doesn't mean a person's rights are trampled on, but the average person doesn't understand why they were treated a certain way in many situations. It's a right that I am afforded as an officer by society and my family expects me to respond in that manner. They are first. There has been an alarming number of men in my area that have not come home at the end of the shift the last few years after walking into similar situations as the one that started this post. Just something to think about.
 
I guess you guys need to be in our shoes. WE have lived in this area all of your lives. It is a somewhat small community where everyone knows everyone. This was a new officer from god knows where. All he had to do was run the plate on the truck and Macs sister would have instantly know what was up. If it had been light out the person that called would have recignozed the vechile and that would have been that. As for putting in a call ya it might have worked this time but I just can't see calling the land owner everytime I plan on hunting, for that matter it wasnt the land owner that called us in and for calling a CPO hell there are 4 in our area alone so which one you call? Do you call all of them at 10 o'clock at night and let them know your hunting. Most of the time we go night hunting its a spur of the moment type of thing and there is no time for phone calls that late at night. I guess we will just have to deal with the aggravation.
 
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I guess you guys need to be in our shoes. WE have lived in this area all of your lives. It is a somewhat small community where everyone knows everyone. This was a new officer from god knows where. All he had to do was run the plate on the truck and Macs sister would have instantly know what was up. If it had been light out the person that called would have recignozed the vechile and that would have been that. As for putting in a call ya it might have worked this time but I just can't see calling the land owner everytime I plan on hunting, for that matter it wasnt the land owner that called us in and for calling a CPO hell there are 4 in our area alone so which one you call? Do you call all of them at 10 o'clock at night and let them know your hunting. Most of the time we go night hunting its a spur of the moment type of thing and there is no time for phone calls that late at night. I guess we will just have to deal with the aggravation.



I have the exact same situation here. If I even think there is a remote chance that I will be night hunting I call the owner. If I don't get to go all I've lost is a phone call.

I took two guys with me during the day once that both carried AR's. A nosey neighbor called the landowner {which I had already spoke with} and told him that there were 3 guys shooting fully automatic machine guns on his land. When in fact we never fired a shot, she just saw "machine guns"!
I spoke with the land owner about a week later and we had a good laugh over it.
If I hadn't called him ahead he would have had to come check it out.

Yes it's a hassel to make a few phone calls ,but not nearly as big a hassel as going through what is being discussed here.

Most landowners appreciate the phone call the one's that don't will tell you.
 
Calling before you hunt is not giving up a right but showing courtsey to the land owner and the local LEO/Game Warden. It shows respect all way around and the one thing I have found is if you aren't willing to give respect you aint going to get it in return.
 
Here are my thoughts and experiences:

1.) I don't blame the guy's sister for being pissed. She is the jailer, not the dispatcher, if I read things correctly. She was probably wondering what the hell he was calling her for, possibly putting her in a tough spot.

2.) Common courtesy says you call the owner beforehand any time you make the trip, unless prior understanding and agreement has been reached. I can assure you that he will not be very receptive to unplanned disturbances in the middle of the night.

3.) What did you guys do to garner all of the attention from the CPO's? The part of the state where I hunt has no more than one per county, sometimes less.

4.) When the night regulations changed in 1999 I contacted the local CPO and was told in no uncertain terms that it was not worth my effort for me to call him before an evening of hunting, unless I also called everyone in the county. If some concerned citizen called concerning suspicious activity he had to check it out. Previous call or no, he or the sheriff's department would be on scene. Makes sense.

5.) The thing to do is not get too mouthy when the inevitable happens and an officer comes around doing his job. Build up a bit of a positive reputation and relationship and I'll bet that the next time that officer will just cruise right on by when or if he passes by where you're hunting.

6.) Walking in on foot to an area for 600 yards sounds like the waste of some stand opportunities considering typical IL. geography. Any way you can work around the edges of this place, possibly getting to make more stands, without traipsing right in to the middle of the area?
 
JOE, we live right in the middle of about a dozen public hunting areas. Not counting The great tourist attraction Lake Shelbyville.
 
Hey I didnt mean to get an argument started . I few of the departments finest has left a bad impression on this community , to many of them hide behind that tin star and think it gives them all the rights to do whatever they feel . I dont like it and when they step over the bounds i call them on it . We just lost a deputy last year because of child abuse, His girlfriends 5 year old daughter was at a birthday party and did something to aggrevate the deputy . The man beat a 5 year old girl bad enough to send her to the hospital covered in bruises and bleeding. Another local had been caught several times cheating on his wife with another woman , well girl i should say , the officer was welll into his 40's and he was having an affair with a 17 year old , well once she turned 18 he divorced his wife , got the girl pregnant and married her , he know has a wife the same age as his young son. so right there was one of our finest committing statutory rape , but everyone turned thier heads. When you let this type of behavior run long enough it turns into the above. sure he wasnt out of line until he got into my truck without permission . there was no probable cause i was parked 20 yards off the hard road on the ground i was suppose to be on . It may start with illeagle searching but it can get bigger. Heck i can remember growing up , a buddy drove the local wrecker, one of the city cops had busted a guy for something and had his car towed , my brother was up at the shop when they towed the car in for a search and the cop was pissed that he couldnt find anything in the car , so he told everybody there " You didnt see this" and he threw a bunch of marijauna seeds and a hitter in the guys back seat. Im not saying everyone is bad , ive got several friends on the force that are really close buddies. But i wont put up with someone violating my rights .

as for calling in advance , i wont do that everytime , i got permission to be there , i will not hound the landowner and ring his phone 5 times a week telling him i am hunting , before to long thats gonna get annoying and i probably wont be alowed back . I call at the begining of season each year and thats how it will stay , i will not drive to every pole light in eye sight before i hunt and tell them i will be hunting on ground that they dont even own . And as far as my sister goes , i did not have the police phone number in my phone , and i didnt have a phone book on me , just something i tend to leave out of my pack . When i call her and i can hear the dispatcher talking right beside her and she wont even pass the phone over then that is a problem . doesnt matter if she is in a squad car or a jailer , she is a public servant and should act accordingly.
 
And to the fella that said he cant count the number of people that have had HIS handgun pointed at them . We are not NY down here . we dont have those problems apparently , but let me say this , if an officer gets jumpy around me and pulls a gun on me when i am doing nothing wrong then he better be prepared to use it . I had a cop pull a gun on me once along with my brother , it was about 10 years ago , we were cruising town and some girls hollered at us from the school lot on mainstreet, so we pulled around back , it was about 10 at night. we pulled up along mainstreet and were talking to them and then did a burnout as we left, we were driving all of 4 mph out of the lot when some blithering idiot in a blue uniform comes running from behind the school , weve got a 45 pointed at us and this retard screaming to get out of the truck . after we got it all sorted out he said he was just having a nervous night and the tires spooked him !! we went straight to his supperior and he was not allowed to carry a gun for a month after that. He is the statutory rape cop now. I was a kid back then but let me tell you , i have alot more to look forward to know , my kids growing up and a family to provide for . If i ever have a cop pull a gun on me for spinning my tires like i did back then or something else as trivial as that you can garuntee im gonna give him a beating if i am not shot first. No man and I mean NO MAN is going to put a bead on my chest with an itchy trigger finger that is just having a bad day and put me and my family at risk like that.Im not saying that i hate cops yadda yadda yadda , like i said before some of my closest friends put the badge on and go to work . But when they start stepping out line and doing things theyr way instead of the right way then it needs to be stopped which is what i did . There is a state trooper that still runs around here , he has been removed from a couple of his posts and transferred because he has a bit of a womanizing problem along with several others. There is a small town just south of us a ways , maybe 500 people , the kids down there for years and years and years have hung out in an old abandoned rock parking lot for years on main street , one night the state patrolman went through this little town and thought these kids hanging out would be gang activity ? give me a break . he got out , kids refused to leave , if my memory serves me correct he hit one kid in the face with pepper spray . The trooper ended up getting his rear end handed to him , he climbed under his car and radioed for help . that was an example of a bad cop thinking he can do whatever he wants and noone will stop him . He was one that people let go to far. IMO that sister of mine should be removed from her position , a different deputy was on duty one night . again i dont know what the jails number is but she works nights so i know i can just call her. anyways i am heading home following a little black car that is weaving all over the place , he avoided a few near head ons and was clear past the white line on several occasions , i followed him for miles , had the lic number etc. i called her and she said yeah i am standing right here with the dep and the disp whats wrong , told her that i was following a bad drunk driver and he was gonna kill someone . she told the deputy who was right there and he said " im sitting down to eat supper and im not gonna let my spaghetti get cold" i was furious and blew up on the phone then to , what if that guy would have struck a car with kids head on ? that piece of crap deputy would have had a full belly and some small boddies to scrape off the road. his suggestion was to go ahead acnd call the next county over " 17 miles away " and ask them if they want to intercept , but he wasnt going to do it because he had spaghetti to eat.
 
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Hey Mac, we don't pull our guns here for no reason either. Upstate NY is pretty much like IL if you have never been here. Semi Rural. The thought that you can't get hurt in PoDunk USA is exactly what does get guys killed every year. The fact that I have pointed my weapon at a number of people does not in any way imply that I am jumpy, and trust me I am more than ready to use it depending on where things go from there. Reread my post, that was exactly my point. I have pointed my gun at people that weren't doing anything wrong and didn't deserve it. I was sent to deal with something that I was led to beleive was a totally different situation than it turned out to be. Either from a person calling that thought it was a crime being committed or from information being screwed up between dispatcher and officer. No fault of mine given the information I had at the time and usually not the fault of the person that had a gun pointed at them. I'm sorry you had your experience, many here gave you some tips to avoid simliar encounters in the future, use them or don't. I spend alot of time here because I don't read the paper or watch the news much. The cop bashing gets a little old, but I guess it is what it is. Good luck to you.
 
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The fact that I have pointed my weapon at a number of people does not in any way imply that I am jumpy, and trust me I am more than ready to use it depending on where things go from there. Reread my post, that was exactly my point. I have pointed my gun at people that weren't doing anything wrong and didn't deserve it. I was sent to deal with something that I was led to beleive was a totally different situation than it turned out to be. Either from a person calling that thought it was a crime being committed or from information being screwed up between dispatcher and officer. No fault of mine given the information I had at the time and usually not the fault of the person that had a gun pointed at them.



No , it was your fault you pointed the gun at them . You relied to much on other people to make a conclusion of the situation for you. you defeated your own purpose in the post . You said you are not jumpy at one point and in the same breath you said you pointed a loaded gun at several people before you even knew what the situation was. If you , or the dispatcher screwed up information bad enough to put another mans life in the balance for something that he didnt even do then you and the dispatcher need to be removed from your positions , maybe mcdonalds is more suitable seeing as how if you screw up there someone has bacon on thier bigmac , not a hollow point in the brain bucket. if it happened once ok it was a mistake but you have already stated that you couldnt count the number of people that you have done it to . Your jumpy and one of these days it sounds like your gonna screw up and shoot a guy for 5 fingering a snickers . I dont see how you can get information screwed up enough between a crime that might call for the taking of a mans life and one that doesnt.
 
If I had screwed up you could bet I would have a new job. Trust me there is no good ol boy system here. You do the job or your gone. When you screw up you are disciplined. The dispatcher who screwed one of these up does have a new job, I was the reason for him losing his job. Happened a few times with him. Trust me, I am not jumpy but I am going home at the end of the day. I teach use of force/tactics/firearms and know a little bit about when you should be drawing your weapon and when you shouldn't. I don't take it lightly, and I have to do a detailed report of why I did it, every time I point my weapon at someone. When I am sent to a call of a man with a gun and he sticks his hands in his coat when I roll up, what should I do? wait and see what happens? Like I said I am given the right to point a gun at someone in certain situations where I feel I may be in danger and it has happened MANY times. Sometimes it is a guy with a gun, sometimes it is someone calling in a bogus complaint to screw with someone they don't like. Many times the person calling 911 "thought" they saw a gun or it turns out they "heard" someone say the person had a gun. I get "a man with a gun" over the radio and a description, many times nothing more. Lots and lots of scenario's where these things happen. Especially considering I do it all day every day and have for 15 years. I do work in a small city of 35,000 with big city problems but live in a rural area and most of it is semi rural here. Most of the people here are good people, cops included. I think we are on seperate pages here. I don't intend to debate any further on this. If you are ever in my neck of the woods give me a shout and we can call some fox or coyotes. Maybe after a few stands you won't think I need to be flipping burgers. I meant what I said, good luck to you.
 
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I was sent to deal with something that I was led to beleive was a totally different situation than it turned out to be. Either from a person calling that thought it was a crime being committed or from information being screwed up between dispatcher and officer. No fault of mine given the information I had at the time and usually not the fault of the person that had a gun pointed at them.



I've been on both sides of this and could not agree more. So many things affect your preception of what you are responding to. You have to go in prepared to treat it as a possibly dangerous event until it is proved otherwise. It much like EMS. If you call EMS because your chest hurts we are going to respond to it like it is a true emergency until we know it isn't.
 
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Career firefighter here, and let me say again that you have no idea most of the time what you are rolling up on. I protect my partners first, me second then john q. public. I want to go home to my wife and little boy as does everyone else in uniform. You have to treat every situation as the real deal until you can confirm its not.
 
Goodness. Dude just registered a week or so ago and is already spouting off craziness.
Maybe he needs to flip burgers instead of hunting.
Law Enforcement Officers have a dangerous job and deal with situations that could potentially kill them on a daily basis. They certainly have my respect.
 
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Goodness. Dude just registered a week or so ago and is already spouting off craziness.
Maybe he needs to flip burgers instead of hunting.
Law Enforcement Officers have a dangerous job and deal with situations that could potentially kill them on a daily basis. They certainly have my respect.



I should not even dignify this post with a responce ,but i will. I never said i dont respect them , the reason this post was started was on the night in question they did not respect me or my rights. .
 
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