Barrel fluting scientifically bad...anyone agree?

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roky0702

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I'm trying not to beat a dead horse as barrel fluting has previously been debated, but I have not read any scientific claims from manufacturers before. The article is Rifle Barrels: What The Pros Use on the home page of http://precisionrifleblog.com/ . Towards the bottom of the post is the topic of barrel fluting in which only 1 out of the top 50 shooters had a fluted barrel. One shooter stated that he goes through barrels so quickly that it's a waste of money and that is reason enough to not flute every barrel. Then there are two claims by Shilen and Accuracy International with scientific testing pointing towards fluting negatively affecting a barrel. No data was provided upon request, but the arguments seem pretty legitimate. Most custom builders offer barrel fluting so is it another case of he said good/she said bad? Does it influence your opinions after reading it? Do you think it doesn't affect the majority of shooters and to not worry about it? I like the look/weight savings of fluting, but now I'm starting to rethink my stance on it and may pocket the cash instead. I'm hoping this will be an active discussion to help persuade me one way or another and to help others with the same dilemma. Thanks for any replies.
 
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I noticed that and Lilja says the exact opposite. It seems like the consensus from the article is that barrel fluting is beneficial on hunting rifles where minimizing weight is important. However, on match/varmint/high volume shooting rifles, it sounds like it is a negative. I always thought fluted bull barrels were good for high volume shooting to dissipate heat quicker, but perhaps not?
 
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There is not one reason in the world why a competitive BR shooter would flute a barrel. It just isn't feasible.

As for fluting a hunting rifle, there is no reason to not. If that is what you want for either saving weight or just looking cool.

As for cooling/stiffness. LOTS of misconceptions out there.

Given same weight barrels, fluted will be stiffer. However, a plain barrel is stiffer than a fluted barrel of same diameter.

Given 2 of same barrel, 1 fluted, 1 not, the fluted barrel WILL cool faster.......
 
Originally Posted By: ninehorsesShilen will void your warranty if you flute one of their barrels.

Shilen FAQ

This is simply because they don't want to warranty somebody elses work. Which makes a whole lotta sense to me..........
 
I picked up an unchambered Lilja fluted stainless in 25 caliber for a switch barrel 25-06 that I was putting together. After finding the right bushing for the reamer, I pushed the bushing through the bore from breach to muzzle. As soon as the bushing hit the flutes, it got noticeably easier to push. When the bushing passed the area where the fluting stopped near the muzzle, it got harder to push. Obviously, the bore was a little larger in diameter under the fluting. I was not happy with this discovery and thought of peddling the barrel as is.

Luckily I decided against it and chambered the barrel. It took me two rounds to get the barrel on target. The next two rounds were touching at 185 yards.

That was last year. This year after putting the barrel back on the action I sighted it in again. At the same distance with a lower power scope, I had no problem keeping it in a half inch.

My point, a barrel that “opens up” under the fluting may not affect accuracy. And just because there is some “stress” in a barrel blank does not automatically doom the barrel. You have to chamber it and shoot it. Until then, you can only guess at the outcome.
 
99% cosmetic. The last test I read said the cooling and stiffness increase was negligible. It was almost as stiff as the standard bull barrel but not as stiff as the same barrel before fluting. It's kind of a 1/2 way point for both. I think the biggest benefit to the bull as a whole is it takes longer to heat up, but it also takes longer to cool down. In that aspect a barrel is nothing more than a big heat sink. The bull has more material so it can absorb more heat without damage. A thin barrel may get hot in a 1/2 dozen shots, and will reach the point of damage sooner, but with the thinner material it will shed the heat faster.

So 6 of 1 half a dozen of the other kind of thing.

And fluting after it's been rifled is a no-no according to everything I've read.
 
It was years ago while I was building up my first F-class rifles and still in college, but I did run the numbers on the cooling effect and the stiffness of a fluted barrel.

A fluted barrel does cool faster and is stiffer than a non-fluted barrel of the same WEIGHT. It is NOT stiffer, nor does it significantly cool faster than a barrel of the same DIAMETER. So it's basically a mid-weight barrel that shoots more like a heavy barrel.

The biggest difference is the investment and the weight. If you're going through a barrel every season, then you can get the 4th or 5th one free if you skip the fluting. For a bench rest rifle, weight only matters if you're in certain classes, whereas fluting on a hunting rifle can help shed a lot of unwanted weight - better than trimming inches off of the end for velocity and accuracy too.

Having played a bit with metallurgy and machining effects on grain integrity, I'd easily agree that fluting does have negative effects on barrel quality, but how much that affects resonance/harmonics and overall accuracy is probably negligible.

So it's kinda like the whole "lapped bore vs. rough bore" debate. Fluted barrels are like rough bores, it's clear to see the increase in grain dislocations in the barrel after fluting - but does it REALLY make the barrel shoot any worse? Does it REALLY make the barrel wear out any faster? Eh, not REALLY...
 
Benchrest shooters have nothing to gain from flutes really. On a hunting rifle it saves weight as long as they are deep flutes. A lot of barrels have very shallow flutes, I think they are purely cosmetic.
 
Originally Posted By: 2muchgunThere is not one reason in the world why a competitive BR shooter would flute a barrel

Originally Posted By: kpkieferBenchrest shooters have nothing to gain from flutes really

Yep, those carbon fiber stocks, aluminum actions, light scopes & all that are just for fun. Nothing at all for a bench shooter to gain from a lighter peice of equipment that would be better... No reason at all to have a bigger "stiffer barrel of same weight" trying to make 10.5, 13.5 or even a 17 pound class rifle....


If it was better, I'm pretty they would be using it. Truth be told, specifically shortrange benchrest; they save all the weight they can to put the biggest barrel possible on the rig. And no, none of them are fluted. Make your own conclusion from here.

Yes one of the reasons is the SR boys run through barrels like crazy & it's just extra expense. But don't kid yourself that they wouldn't spend an extra $100 on 600-1000 shots if they thought they could win more.
 
Originally Posted By: lyotehuntera good way to waste money,nothing benifical

I pretty much agree,, ^^^^

If I want a light rifle I buy a light contour.

Just another fad that happens to look stupid as far as I'm concerned.
 
Flutes are definitely nothing that is needed, or can't be lived without.

That said, they have their place, but only at times.

About the only personal example I can cite, would be concerning my Rem 7 and my Sako Finnlight.

The 7 is unfluted "pencil barrel". The Finnlight has a larger diameter barrel, but fairly deeply fluted. What this does, is gives me a better balancing, lighter rifle, but with a larger diameter, and stiffer barrel, of approximately the same weight, as compared to the Rem 7.

This is about the only example I can come up with out of my personal rifles where I think the fluting actually serves a function as compared to a similar, unfluted rifle.....
 
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I can like a fluted bolt. Shaves a bit of weight. Makes the bolt cycle a tad smoother due to less surface/contact area. May aid in getting less gunk in the action. But mostly just looks cool...

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Done correctly there is nothing wrong with fluting. Done wrong and it can ruin a barrel.

There is really some good information exchange in this thread. I agree that the big benefit is weight reduction. IF fluting was so good for accuracy then EVERY manufacturer would do it. I have shot bull barrels, modified heavy barrels, tapered barrels and pencil barrels. All have their benefits and drawbacks. It really boils down to the base material and the machining processes involved. Good metal and good machining=years of good shooting. Bad materials or bad machining=bad results.

It is good to see so many of our members using good science to make educated decisions. I have worked with metal my entire career and many people do not understand it. Then there are way too many debates about firearms that involve emotion. Good science and physics produce results, not emotion.

Great job guys.
 


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