Best North American hunting caliber?

If I had to face down a Brown Bear with a 12 gauge, I'd go fishing in Ohio for my excitement. The term, "Use enough gun" doesn't come to mind until you see the size, on the paw and claw, of some of God's creatures that are intent on stomping you into the ground if they get a chance. In those situations, for a 12 Gauge to be reliably effective, it would require that the animal get far too close for everyone involved where they can close the final distances between you and them in the blink of an eye. Brown bears like I just described do exist in NA.

Maybe in a surprise situation if all I had available was a 12 gauge, fine. It beats a pocket knife any day. But for a planned hunt, no way. Magnum rifles have their place and it might not be on the prairie of Wyoming after pronghorns for everyone, but they will work there extremely well too if chosen properly.

Several friends who have shot a couple of my magnum rifles off of a bench, particularly in 7MM Mag, remarked after the experience that it was not what they expected at all. One even remarked that it wasn't as bad as shooting his 30-06.
Don't believe all the Outdoor Life keyboard comments about a guide wanting his client to be under gunned so he can shoot a rifle well. Any good guide expects you to come prepared to shoot well what it takes for the game you're after. Otherwise you probably should go fishing in Ohio too, and in reality the guide would probably welcome the fact that you did go fishing.

To be gramatically correct for those who feels its required, in terms of caliber, I'd still go .338 bore diameter for all NA game. As for a cartridge, I'd still go 338 Winchester Magnum. Hand load it appropriately and it will serve you well no matter what you might want to hunt.
 
"I don't think hunting the big bears with a shotgun would be anywhere close to "doing it well"

Tim....I'm with you in spirit and certainly you've sent more lead down range then me. But having said that I know of at least three Alaskan fishing guides that have made devastating one shot kills on grizzlies/brown bears to protect clients(BTW it's a paperwork nightmare)....

If you look at the stats for Remington's 12 gauge Core-Lokt Sabots the numbers are impressive...Granted the range of a slug is limited, but hunting big bears isn't a long range sport.....Check out these numbers from Chuck Hawks....

The 12 gauge Core-Lokt Ultra sabot bullet is a .50 caliber, 385 grain HP semi-spitzer. The catalog MV is 1900 fps and the 100 yard velocity is 1648 fps. The ME is given as 3086 ft. lbs. and the remaining energy at 100 yards is 2325 ft. lbs. The trajectory of that load looks like this: +1.8" at 50 yards, +2.4" at 100 yards, and +/- 0" at 150 yards.

Would I want to shoot a bear with a slug...? Probably not, but if I had to I'd be pretty confident with the results so long as I knew the gun and could place the slug where I wanted it....In a perfect world I'd smash his shoulder with the first slug and have two more ready to end the encounter....At the muzzle that slug has a ton and a half of energy and more than a ton at 100 yards...That's going to leave a mark!!!
 
How does the slug I cite compare to a 338 Winchester which many consider to be the best bear medicine you can carry?....At the muzzle the slug generates 3086 foot pounds while the 338 with a 225 grain Nosler partition turns 3791 foot pounds of energy...If I were specifically hunting bears a 338 would be great...(tough on quail and coyotes though) but it only has 700 more foot pounds of energy....

A 300 Winchester using 200 grain swift A frames turns 3506 foot pounds....400 more than the slug, but once again quail and dove hunting with a 300 winchester is a tough one...LOL....
 
LOL ! I still don't know where hunting birds came from in this thread.

But hey, we all know the world isn't perfect.
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"I'd still go .338 bore diameter for all NA game"....I'm not trying to be a jackass, but you've got to remember that most of the game in North America weighs less than 30 pounds and a lot of it weighs less than 2 pound....Let's see....Coyotes, bobcats, raccoons, squirrels, rabbits, turkeys, foxes, quail, dove, chukar, grouse, ducks, geese, woodcock, pheasants...Etc..

Then you add in all the stuff that weights less than 300 pounds as a rule....deer, hogs, sheep, goats, antelope, black bears....Etc
 
I've got one ? on the shotty topic,well maybe 2.

Are you running the slugs in a rifled barrel ? If so what are you shooting the rest of the stuff with(birds, rabbits etc) ?

If you're changing barrels that's cheating !
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I can't wait for the "Full" moon to go away so we can all get back to killin stuff rather than arguing about which caliber will buy you more eggs in China. I've got a wily bobcat that has given me the slip twice now and when that moon go's away, I'm gonna sing him a lulaby. By the way, he'll die at the end of a shotgun muzzle if anyone wants to know.



Chupa
 
What do you know Jay ! You're one of those gun counter guys !
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jk

I'm pizzin around on here while I get stuff ready for deer opener in the morn !

I'll expect a good photo of the kitty and shotty . Good luck!
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Originally Posted By: Cal Kellogg"I'd still go .338 bore diameter for all NA game"....I'm not trying to be a jackass, but you've got to remember that most of the game in North America weighs less than 30 pounds and a lot of it weighs less than 2 pound....Let's see....Coyotes, bobcats, raccoons, squirrels, rabbits, turkeys, foxes, quail, dove, chukar, grouse, ducks, geese, woodcock, pheasants...Etc..

Then you add in all the stuff that weights less than 300 pounds as a rule....deer, hogs, sheep, goats, antelope, black bears....Etc

I agree that a .223 or 22-250, or whatever - pick one - would be better for most applications, and if Brown Bear was not on the possible NA menu, I'd not say 338... No caliber or cartridge is ideal. That's why they make gun safes.

On the other hand, Like Tim mentioned, no guide is going to take you Brown Bear hunting with a 12 gauge as the first option. A 12 gauge in the situations where it might save a life is a weapon of last choice - a last option used by the guide to hopefully restore order in an other-wise totally FUBAR, fast paced, and extremely up-close world at that moment. At that point the hunt is over and you and the guide are now the hunted, for whatever reason.

A planned guided hunt is not designed to be a life or death survival experience. Ask any guide to take you bear hunting with a 12 gauge and you'll probably find his slate is full. Yet he very well may carry one regularly loaded with slugs where he knows the last response from him might mean life and death to both of you. But it won't be done at the same range he first suggests that you shoot whatever you are toting at whatever you are hunting. Two totally different situations requiring different tools.
 
i think the problem is the original question was too open ended. it should have said Survival VS sport, big game VS small game, Rifle VS Shotgun.

Too me, when it says all game in NA, i am more concerned about the small percentage of BIG animals that can kill you, than small game that you might be overkill for.
 
The question is extremely broad in scope. If you take the question for what it is-all North American hunting-then you cannot be over-gunned. Dead is dead and a .338 will do everything that you need from coyotes to bears. I doubt that anyone who has the money to hunt big bears is going to have ONE gun, though. Keeping it on a more realistic level, I would say if a guy wanted one gun for coyotes to caribou, moose, elk, black bear etc. etc., then it is hard to beat a 30-06, .280, 7mm-08 or even a .308.
 
Originally Posted By: bigsky_songdogsi think the problem is the original question was too open ended. it should have said Survival VS sport, big game VS small game, Rifle VS Shotgun.

Too me, when it says all game in NA, i am more concerned about the small percentage of BIG animals that can kill you, than small game that you might be overkill for.

Me too. Well said. I've never seen one of those roughly 30 pound animals that caused me to even wonder about my safety as I pulled the trigger.
 
I been out hunting for the last 4 days. This thread has sure taken some interesting turns.

I don't plan on ever shooting grizzly. But I do hunt in grizzly country. When I do, I carry enough gun for grizzly no matter what I am hunting.

Better to have one and not need it than to need it and and not have it
 
Are you running the slugs in a rifled barrel....Tim have you ever felt how heavy a 12 gauge slug shell it? I'm not going to shoot them, I'm just going to throw them at that dang bear.....LOL
 
These sort of discussions are fun!...So long as no one gets all bent out of shape....

I'm also thinking about those gold miners, eskimos and trappers from back in the early 1900's that would be laughing at us...They took their grizzlies down with a lever action Winchester, when the 30/30 round was considered pretty darn powerful....What a bunch of little girls we've become with our stainless steel 338s....Ha
 
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Looking at this thread I would think it was July.

Magnums yes One for me please. Mine shoots flatter. There are much larger calibers that don't have the Magnum attached to the caliber.

Don't have to go to Alaska for grizzly.

Quote:Hunter shoots charging griz in Badger-Two Medicine area

http://www.greatfallstribune.com/article/20111111/NEWS01/111110327/1002/rss

Quote:Victim in Mont. grizzly attack was shot by friend

http://news.yahoo.com/victim-mont-grizzly-attack-shot-friend-232212127.html

Quote:Elk Hunters Face Off With Grizzly in Montana

http://www.biggamehunt.net/blogs/bghjournal/elk-hunters-face-grizzly-montana
 
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