Bullet Cross Sections

Originally Posted By: 204 ARGood work, thanks for sharing. Is the Amax tip slightly narrower inside the bullet than the vmax, or does it just appear that way? There appears to be very little difference, a little less cavity like you said.

The Amax bullets do appear to have a different tip than the Vmax, but since these are sanded by hand a small error in the depth of the sanding could make the tip look wider or thinner inside the core. However I feel I got the cross sections pretty darn close.
 
I also use a belt sander to look at bullet construction and have done so to about 50 different bullets types and sizes.
I like to do this for every gun that I use to try and understand which bullet will work the best for my intended purpose of the game I am hunting.
It does add a lot of understanding to how the bullet reacts on game.

BTW good job Dirty Hippie on one more step on reloading info.
 
I have Speer, Bergers and other 224 caliber bullets also if you want a few for your examples. Make a list of what you would like and I'll be happy to send what I might have. Very interesting, thanks for the effort. It must be tedious.
 
ive got a fair cross section of bullets on the bench that i'd be willing to donate some one-off's to science for if you need them.

mostly hornady, but i have some nosler, barnes, berry's, and other assorted bullets i could throw in.

i load 9mm, 380, 40, 45, 38/357 in pistol and 204, 223, 7mm & 30 cal in rifle.

if you're bored and want to keep cutting, as psycodog said, make a list and i'm sure between the reloaders here we can get you an exotic cross section of bullets to play with
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Here's a few .308's

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OOops, 2nd bullet from left is a 150 gr, not 125.

And a 210 gr. .338 NP alongside same bullet fired in .338 WM and recovered from a Nilgai cow.

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Tried holding in wooden block drilled to fit bullet and sanding w/8" body sander but got hot enough to melt both plastic tip and lead core. Clamped in vise, worked great w/lead core but started to melt the plastic tip, so removed and replaced tip after grinding. Finished w/file. If I planned to do a bunch, I'd try making an aluminum heat sink to hold bullets to carry off heat, or perhaps a less aggressive sander.
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Regards,
hm
 
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you guys are better at getting a cross section that I am, I am trying to remember these bullets and which ones I did. left to right, thats easy the heavy copper base is a nosler Btip, further right and with the thinnest jackets are the vmax's next to that I think is a speer and a midway dogtown bullets. far right is sierra's lineup

IMO sierra has you totally covered for coyotes in 22 caliber. use a soft point either 50 or 55 grain, both look put together the same. the sierra 1365 is a great choice. for a 22-250 or the like. the sierras have about twice the thickness of copper jacket than the other bullets.

want something a little less hard, use a 52 grain match hp, and if you want more expansion still go with a blitzking. the blitzkings have worked great for me at the 3350ish range from an AR 15. I tried the 50 grain sierra soft points in the ar 15 and thought they didn't expand and have the shock factor I was looking for. when I look for a coyote bullet I want expansion without surface splashes and decent penetration. basically for me I am done saving hides I just want an anchored coyote that isn't going to need finishing shots that might further taint the stand to other coyotes that might show up.

I have also had good luck with 50 grain btips, There is a factory load put out by federal, 50 grain tipped varmint. its actually cheap ammo that comes in a black box. Stuff shoots great in every AR 15 I have shot it in. Its been good on coyotes too. I only use it in my carbine ar 15 that I carry to dispatch a stop and pop coyote while in the truck. It runs about 300 fps slower than my full house hand load,

there is alot of mis info out there and the truth is most guys simply flat out don't shoot as many coyotes as they claim. somehow shooting 2 becomes shooting " a lot" I have not had a vmax reliably perform on any coyote at any speed unless it was fired from a 6mm something or other and was a heavier bullet like a 75 or something like that. in that case you get a coyote cut in half.
 
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Several years ago my daughter was 5, and about to start shooting deer with my CZ 223. I sectioned quite a few bullets like that, but took it one step further with the intention of finding the best bullet for her to shoot deer with out of a 12 twist.

I shot quite a few .224 bullets at 223 Rem velocities into wet newspaper. I standardized the way I did it. So many inches of newspaper in a certain size box, used a black trash bag in the box to hold the water in until it soaked into the paper. Same amount of water in each box, all that stuff. Then I shot bullets, several of each one tested. Then I would peel back the layers of newspaper, recording the depth of penetration, and also I think retained weight. I put all that data together in a chart.

I will see if I can remember to take a picture of that chart tonight and if I can I will post it up tomorrow. Pretty interesting results. The most impressive bullet was the CEB Raptor or Non Con, not sure which it was. It was bad to the bone though in a little rifle like that. I shot a couple deer with that bullet.

The bullet I ended up loading for her was the old discontinued 60 Nosler Solid Base. She killed several deer with that bullet until they were all gone. I think she will be shooting the Nosler 64 Bonded this year though.
 
Quote:The bullet I ended up loading for her was the old discontinued 60 Nosler Solid Base. She killed several deer with that bullet until they were all gone. I think she will be shooting the Nosler 64 Bonded this year though.

Shame that Nosler discontinued the solid base line. That was one fine bullet! I picked up several hundred of the 6mm 100 gr. SB a while back when they had an overrun for someone. These were different from original as they had a cannelure. They perform as well on game as the partitions and are more accurate in my 243 WSSM.

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Regards,
hm
 
New batch of bullets for tonight.

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Speer 50 TNT, 40 Nosler BT, 50 Nosler BT.

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75 Amax, 75 ELD-M in .224

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95 Berger Classic Hunter, 95 Hornady SST in 6mm


 
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Originally Posted By: JTPinTXSeveral years ago my daughter was 5, and about to start shooting deer with my CZ 223. I sectioned quite a few bullets like that, but took it one step further with the intention of finding the best bullet for her to shoot deer with out of a 12 twist.

I shot quite a few .224 bullets at 223 Rem velocities into wet newspaper. I standardized the way I did it. So many inches of newspaper in a certain size box, used a black trash bag in the box to hold the water in until it soaked into the paper. Same amount of water in each box, all that stuff. Then I shot bullets, several of each one tested. Then I would peel back the layers of newspaper, recording the depth of penetration, and also I think retained weight. I put all that data together in a chart.

I will see if I can remember to take a picture of that chart tonight and if I can I will post it up tomorrow. Pretty interesting results. The most impressive bullet was the CEB Raptor or Non Con, not sure which it was. It was bad to the bone though in a little rifle like that. I shot a couple deer with that bullet.

The bullet I ended up loading for her was the old discontinued 60 Nosler Solid Base. She killed several deer with that bullet until they were all gone. I think she will be shooting the Nosler 64 Bonded this year though.

That sounds like a lot of work and some serious dedication. That chart would be very cool to see.
 
Great information. Confirms my thoughts on the ballistic tip. Cant wait to see a 50-55 .224 blitz king. Wondering if it has a substantial base as the ballistic tip does?
 
OK, things weren't all just the way I remembered, imagine that. My data was not all put together the way I thought so I had to go back and re-compile it. I can't find my third test I did that had all the data from the CEB Raptors and Non-cons, plus some other bullets. I will see if I can find it and add it later. For now this is what I have.

I did the original test with just standard wet newsprint. It worked out great. On the second test I had some expanded PVC sheet that was 1/8" thick. I thought it would be good to try and add some hard resistance into the test so I added a sheet in at 1.5", 5.5" and 8.5". That PVC sheet really changed things up. The Barnes load I used as standard, it reduced penetration by about 20%. Keeping that in mind, I really think that would have placed the 63 Sierra SMP and 60 Horn HP in the same class as the 60 Nosler Solid Base and 64 Win PP from the first test.

As best I remember the penetration of the CEB bullets was on par with the Barnes 53, but the damage pattern was much wider. The deer I shot with the CEB showed that same star pattern from the detached petals that showed up in wet newsprint, and in the videos of the ballistics gel tests they used to (and may still have) up on their website.

Also note that on the second test, those little 40 NBT's actually did pretty dang good, considering. Better than some of the varmint bullets in the first test, AND they were having to bust through that PVC sheet. I had it on fairly good authority that any of the NBT's in varmint offerings actually penetrate much better than most other varmint bullets due to the solid base on them. It did prove true in this test.

FullSizeR by https://www.flickr.com/photos/156517515@N04/, on Flickr
 
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Hmmm, been a while since I had been to the CEB website. They have changed up quite a bit it seems. Most of their bullets now are copper instead of the bronze ones I was shooting. The 55 Non Con is no longer listed, but the 40 Raptor still is, and it is the original bronze petal design. They didn't dig quite as deep at the 55, but are great in the 12 twist. The 55 Non Cons were on the edge of being stabilized in my 12 twist, and that was without the tips on them.

https://cuttingedgebullets.com/224-40gr-esp-raptor

HM1996, it sure is a shame they discontinued that Solid Base line. It was a heck of a bullet for sure.

Also, I would actually like to test a few more bullets sometime, just for giggles. I will have to save up some newspaper though. Next test would have a 55 NBT, 60 NBT, and for sure the Nosler 64 Bonded, plus whatever else I could scrounge up. I bet the 64 bonded would be impressive.
 
Originally Posted By: JTPinTXI had it on fairly good authority that any of the NBT's in varmint offerings actually penetrate much better than most other varmint bullets due to the solid base on them. It did prove true in this test.

That's some good data on the penetration tests, James.

Culled a number of S. Tx. whitetail does while coyote hunting with the 55 gr. NBT's in .223. All neck shots & were DRT with the little bullet.

Originally Posted By: JTPinTXHM1996, it sure is a shame they discontinued that Solid Base line. It was a heck of a bullet for sure.


As usual, I was a day late and a dollar short in discovering the Nosler SB's after they were discontinued. Did luck out and got in on the 100 gr. 6mm overrun.

I suspect Nosler discontinued the SB's as the BT's appear to be built on the SB cup:

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Regards,
hm
 
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