Check this video clip out

I agree with jrbhunter, now days you have to pay to play and sometimes pay a hole crap load. As was stated before, here in Texas 90+% of land is privately owned so if you want to hunt you will have to pay usually a substaintly amount of money. Example: For the last seven years my Father and I along with six other great guys have been on a high fenced game managed ranch year around. For the last 5 years we (all together) payed $40,000.00 for the hunting rights. The land owner passed away in June and his son took over the ranch, and he raised the lease up to $8,000.00 per gun per deer season ONLY!!! Of course we could not pay this so we now have no lease for this year until we can find another next year. The son did in fact lease the ranch out for what he was asking to an oil company out of Houston. Some of the ranches here do sell customers certain classes of whitetail or exotics (depends on how deep your wallet goes...if you want a silver or gold exotic, no problem, if you want a 140 class or a 190 class whitetail no problem...you just have to pay to play). Two of my best friends use to guide on a major big name ranch (wont give the name of the ranch out), and when they would have a big paying client fly in for a hunt, they would know exactly where the animal was he was to kill. They would drive him around all day on parts of the ranch "hunting" for the particular animal, wine and dine him, do the same the next day, then on the last day take him to the section where the animal was point it out to him and let him take it. Wow, three days of hard hunting finally payed off on the last day!! For there expert guide services the client would normally give a huge tip say several hundred bucks up to a grand for their hunting ability to "track and find this particular animal".
 
Being "priced out of hunting" is no excuse... if you want to play with the big boys you pay the big money.
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Spoken like someone with plenty of money in the bank.

Why do you think the number of hunters is going down? They can't afford it.

In Europe only royalty can afford to hunt.
I don't have a problem with landowners making a living, but greed will be their undoing.

If you think these places are run by poor farmers or ranchers just trying make ends meet, you are kidding yourself.

These hunters want to increase their odds of taking a trophy animal, weather it be a mediocre 140" deer (That are hard to find on public land) or a monster 180" that rarely exist on public land.
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No, they want instant gratification. They want to go out and spend a day or 2 in a stand and kill that type of buck. They don't want to put in the time and energy that it should take to get a chance at such an animal. They want to put there money down and kill a trophy.

Not only that, they want to kill a "once in a lifetime trophy" every year or sometimes even a couple of times a year.
 
When I was deer hunting, I did not really put much thought into getting a "trophy" buck. I love the taste of deer meat and I was hunting for just that. Sure it would have been nice to get a nice, big racked out buck, but it was not my priority.

I supposed if you have the money and want to go after a trophy every time you hunt, then that is your buisiness. I personally would rather spend $70 on a good butcher job and get some nice venison vs. however many hundreds of dollars that it would take to mount a rack. I wonder if these guys that go after these trophy deer time after time are always getting them mounted too? that has got to be expensive.
 
I'm with you Yellowhammer. If dropping ten grand is what it takes to "play with the big boys" they can keep their trophy bucks. I'd much rather take a 130-140" whitetail here on public land and actually have to hunt for it, then one of those over priced hand fed deer. It's all about ego, getting your name in "The Book", big dollars, and instant gratification.

Actually I find the whole clip pretty funny. The shooter was lying from the start. He freaked out and shot without thinking. Stuff like that happens every year in places like Yellowstone, some idiot driving through the park see's the biggest bull elk he has ever laid eyes on and can't control himself. I don't feel sorry for the guide/outfitter either. He should have known that something like this could happen when dealing with people who may not know what they are doing. If he was so concerned about his $10,000 deer he should have hired somebody to sit with the shooter.
 
I 100% agree with Yellowhammer and Lonny,

$12,000 dollars for that buck was absolutely ridiculous and high fence and corporate ranches will be the death nail of hunting for the average man.

My question never got answered though: What if the moron that shot this deer in the first place said, “I ain’t got $12,000”. Legally does the ranch owner have any legal recourse?

Think about it, this guy is screwed.

1. Obviously by the reaction of the rancher this guy isn’t getting an invite back…ever.
2. He was trying to help the rancher by culling his ranch of lesser bucks. Once again I’m not defending this moron but accidents happen and he was trying to help. His “buck fever” got the best of him but the cure for that is not a $12,000 fine.

A fine should have been negotiated between the shooter and the landowner. But then again maybe they did just that and agreed on $12,000.

Regardless I wouldn’t pay $12,000 for one of those monster mule deer in the King’s Calendars.

Steve
 
Spoken like someone with plenty of money in the bank.
Why do you think the number of hunters is going down? They can't afford it.
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Yup, but like I said, never paid for a hunt in my life. I hunt my deer my way and I help other people do it their way. The largest shooter bucks I can get for myself range from 120-160" and I have been lucky enough to take them several years in a row. The people that I take on guided hunts are in a way out for "instant satisfaction" because they often don't have the opportunities that you and I enjoy.

I spend over 150 days a year in the woods... some people are lucky to get away from work and family for a three day weekend a year.

The number of people hunting in America has much less to do with ranches than you imply. The prices of tags have gone up dramatically. The prices of gear has gone up dramatically. The biggest threat to hunting, besides the fact it's supplemental necessity is disappearing from the American dinner table, is the liberal agenda that Disney and others are pushing on our children and making the practice unpopular. You can't blame the demise of hunting on a man that owns 10,000 acres and allows selected people to hunt it... well you can, but it just sounds rediculous. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
Yes 22-250, the hunter most likely violated the contract of his hunting lease. He killed something he didn't pay for.

Go to a nice steak house and pay for a salad bar. Sit down and eat 5 prime ribs and see what the manager says. This guy commited a crime, knowingly. Like I said, I'm not sure why he wasn't personally guided but I'm betting the rancher regretted that and changed some practices afterwards. :rolleyes:

And yes, the guy probably knew the price of that deer when he pulled the trigger... they'd be posted on a brochure or something. I'm guessing it is far beyond that though, if it were just a matter of collecting more money the rancher would've laughed it off and taken his money. I think this was a breeder buck he was working does with and intended to harvest late in the season. It looked like a 5-6 year old buck so I'm sure he would've taken it soon anyways... but probably not until AFTER the rut. Just my guess though, he had a lot of frustration built up for sure!
 
He was trying to help the rancher by culling his ranch of lesser bucks.
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22-250- he was only going to be charged $3500 for the 130 he was "just trying to help" him cull. Or at least that is the story I've heard.

The number of people hunting in America has much less to do with ranches than you imply. The prices of tags have gone up dramatically. The prices of gear has gone up dramatically. The biggest threat to hunting, besides the fact it's supplemental necessity is disappearing from the American dinner table, is the liberal agenda that Disney and others are pushing on our children and making the practice unpopular. You can't blame the demise of hunting on a man that owns 10,000 acres and allows selected people to hunt it
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Just keep on telling yourself that. It doesn't sound nearly as rediculus to as many people as you think it does.

In Texas I get 5 deer tags (3 buck and 2 doe) for the price of a hunting license ($23.00).

Now those tags don't mean much if I don't have access to a place to hunt. The cost of the tags and "equipment" isn't the limiting factor.

Maybe you have the wrong impression on how much Public land there is. In texas, its right at 2%.
 
i'm from texas and have a friend that hunts the perlitz every year. he found out the tape was staged to stir up a bunch of talk on the net.
 
jrbhunter

Hey bud; like I think I’ve said in all my posts, the guy was a moron.

This is all an education to me. Don’t get me wrong though, I’m all for private property rights and the right for a guy to make a buck or two! After all the market will dictate the price.

You mentioned a “lease”. Do they sign an agreement prior to hunting? Say a 4x4 is so many dollars and a 5x5 is so many more? If so that changes everything. If not and the landowner said hand over $12K that would be a different story again.

Not trying to be confrontational just learning.

Steve
 
Not a problem VT, you know me... I'm always confrontational! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

Now, this lease issue is a little different than you are thinking but the premise is the same. The lease is a short term lease, ours says you hunt here but you don't own the place. You can walk but you can't burn our house down, yadda yadda yadda. Also you can't suit us if you get hurt.. like a waiver. It's a legal document that binds the hunter and the ranch together for the duration of their hunt. Be it 7 days or 3 days. Hunting is a risky business for anyone, hunting with strangers is often even worse. These documents cover all kinds of avenues up to and including the harvesting of deer outside the perameters of the hunt.

Now, a cull is not a sized buck from my experience. A cull may be a 8 year old buck that is way past his prime but still holds a nice rack. He may have 12 points.. who knows. That's not how they are gaugeed. Injured animals or genetically inferior animals are tacked on to this age structure as well.

A cull is not always a scorable deer. It may score really well but be odd such as one horned or deformed in some way. A cull hunt is your bottom dollar hunt on most ranches... that or a doe hunt when the guys need to get the buck/doe ratio back in place. ANYWAYS... with that understanding...

You move onto the pricing structure. Different places have different pricing procedures. Texas and the southwest in general is MUCH different than ours but I'll try to explain.

Deer are scored in inches, not necessarily by number of actual points.

Let's say a 140" deer costs $2,000
Then a 160" deer would costs around $3,500
A 180" costs $6,000

Okay, now all these are fake numbers and stuff but you get my point. NOW, knowing this, you must realize this dude paid for a CULL HUNT. A cull hunt is the bare minimum hunt required to even stay in the lodge with your buddies... Probably $600-800 or something like that if you're comparing it to the prices above. Point is, this dude tried to skate by on coat tails then poaches a high dollar deer knowing he hadn't signed up for that.
 
If it's so important that a hunter shoot a certain sized deer , than the guide should be leading the hunter by the hand . Should the hunter have shot ? NO . Should the guide have left the hunter alone ? NO . Both parties have taken a wonderful thing and pissed all over it . Instead of being a magnifecent buck , it has turned into a magnifecent nightmare .
 
Cll, that is a valid point but I think there is more to the story. What this hunter shot and what he should've shot are NIGHT and DAY. I would venture to guess that he begged and pleaded to sit alone... this happens from time to time and THIS is why we never allow it. He probably wanted to sit alone and vowed to only shoot the deer he saw the day before or NO deer. I'm just working off the way hunters sometimes pressure guides to sit alone and by the shadiness this character showed in the video... I'd say he sweettalked and promised til' the cows came home just to get to sit there alone.

They probably use this video on every new hunter that asks to sit alone. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
Hello,

I'm with thelawwon, on this. Three of the guys on the video has a picture in the trophy room on the perlitz ranch website. Besides, the video has the name of the ranch on it. Why would you advertize a trophy killing that went wrong.

Just something to think about.

JA in SD

[spelling]
 
the whole thing is stupid, this is the type of video that PETA would love to get there hads on good old boys driking beer, it makes us look very bad and then they put there name on it, i personally would never hunt there because of the video, they look like smacked a@@es
 
I need more proof myself... if an internet thread was concrete evidence we'd have a verdict already! LOL!

Someone should call the Perlitz and get the real story!
 
I think it's a sad state of affairs the we as hunters allow people to charge us to hunt, F**k em, let the animals eat their crops until they lower the fee or quit charging at all.
 
Utahdogger - I probably would have left out the swearing, but in the middle of it all you are correct. Here in Arizona the Indian Nations charge ten's of thousands of dollars for some of their hunts. While I am glad that the tribes have been as successful in their game management practices as they are, they could not charge what they do for a hunt if people weren't willing to pay. And thats where the rub is for lots of us. Wealthy people seem to be all to happy to pay stupid money to hunt or probably more likely to shoot a trophy animal. But at the same time, can you blame the tribe or as in Texas, ranch for trying to make some serious money?
 
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