College student putting together a do-it-all rifle

Originally Posted By: SlickerThanSnot how about a 17hmr. cheap ammo. normally very accurate. plenty good for chipmunks to cape buffalo.
Do they make a Partition in .17hmr, maybe a FMJ or Solid for buff?

To the OP, just get a 270Win and be done with it.
 
Wow...this thread died pretty quickly.

The guy is asking for info, rather excitedly, and gets blasted for it?!?!? Come on guys...I know he's jumped from 22-250 to 308 to 6.5 creedmoor and even considered the 7-08 (at least they all use the same bolt-face!), but think back to when you were green regarding center fire rifles and try to see where he's coming from.

If I were you, I'd go with the 6.5 creedmoor. You can get factory ammo for anything from gophers to elk sized game, with an even better selection of bullets once you finish college and can start reloading.

Don't let the naysayers and "armchair varminters" get you down or think you don't know what you're talking about. Keep those questions coming and hopefully the collective knowledge of this site will eventually come together to help you rather than belittle you!

I think you're on the right track...keep thinking about what you're going to use the rifle for and add those thoughts here. I'll stay tuned and provide constructive criticism when I can!

CK82
 
Thanks 'killer82. Although, after more research, I can see where the flamers are coming from. There is a series on Youtube called Sniper 101 that is an 86 part series on everything long range shooting. Over the first 4 parts (totaling in excess of an hour of video) he goes over everything from bullet shape to ballistic coefficient to sectional density, and how it all relates to a long range shot.

With this being said, after watching the first four parts of this series and looking at external ballistic tables and charts until my eyes are square, I can see why people were recommending .243. It seems to be a fantastic cartridge for what I'm doing here.

I have to see the WHY involved in all my decisions. So .22-250; the why was that it was a laser beam. Which is great for long range shooting. But now that I see the why of .243 (versatility, excellent ballistics, cost, etc...) I can see why it is a good, if not perfect, decision. So, apologies to those who took the time to recommend .243. I just blew over it in favor of a less useful cartridge due to my own inexperience and stubbornness. Hopefully I can take a chill pill and listen to what you guys have to say next time...

'killer82, I love, and I mean LOVE, the ballistics of the 6.5 Creedmoor. However, it costs nearly twice as much to shoot as the .243. So, for now, the .243 is the caliber of choice. However, I would love to build a long (1000+) range gun using this caliber and some later time.
 
Originally Posted By: coyotekiller8222-250 is plenty good enough, with the right bullet, for deer! 55gr Sierra GameKings or a 60gr partition and you're good to go!

Best advice of the whole thread. You are right on track with your original thoughts on wanting a 22-250. Either bullet will anchor any of the game you mentioned and the 55 Gameking isn't particularly hard on fur. I cannot say for the 60 Partition as I've never tried them.

Your going to shoot a lot more varmints than you are deer so in your position I'd focus on what round is going to serve you best until you can afford more rifles. My vote goes to the 22-250.

I would encourage you to get started in reloading if you haven't already. You can get going pretty inexpensively with some Lee tools and turn out excellent reloads.

Mart
 
Originally Posted By: UCChrisThanks 'killer82. Although, after more research, I can see where the flamers are coming from. There is a series on Youtube called Sniper 101 that is an 86 part series on everything long range shooting. Over the first 4 parts (totaling in excess of an hour of video) he goes over everything from bullet shape to ballistic coefficient to sectional density, and how it all relates to a long range shot.

With this being said, after watching the first four parts of this series and looking at external ballistic tables and charts until my eyes are square, I can see why people were recommending .243. It seems to be a fantastic cartridge for what I'm doing here.

I have to see the WHY involved in all my decisions. So .22-250; the why was that it was a laser beam. Which is great for long range shooting. But now that I see the why of .243 (versatility, excellent ballistics, cost, etc...) I can see why it is a good, if not perfect, decision. So, apologies to those who took the time to recommend .243. I just blew over it in favor of a less useful cartridge due to my own inexperience and stubbornness. Hopefully I can take a chill pill and listen to what you guys have to say next time...

'killer82, I love, and I mean LOVE, the ballistics of the 6.5 Creedmoor. However, it costs nearly twice as much to shoot as the .243. So, for now, the .243 is the caliber of choice. However, I would love to build a long (1000+) range gun using this caliber and some later time.

You make some excellent points and I can tell you're learning a plethora of knowledge...keep it up!!

Although I've hunted my entire life, buying my own guns and reloading as well as long range target shooting started about 7 1/2 yrs ago and I try to learn something new everyday!!

The .243 is a great cartridge and will do everything you would like to do with the proper bullet and practice!!

Good luck on your purchase and be sure to post any new ?'s that may arise...there will be lots!!

CK82
 
The 243 is a great cartridge that you can do A LOT of different things with. With bullet weights ranging from 58 gr all the way to 105 gr and almost every conceivable bullet design on the market.
 
What amazed me is the viability of the .243 as an elk cartridge at 200 yards or less.

The Ruger American Predator has a 1:9 twist 22" barrel in .243. I'm thinking of Hornady 100 grain BTSP cartridges for an all around cartridge.
 
Originally Posted By: FairChase93Hornady Superformance if your buying factory ammo. That 95 gr SST is an outstanding bullet.

Are the SST's really worth the 50% increase in price?
 
No, the SST's are fun to shoot, but you stated you were on a budget and the various soft points out there will work for what you need. Trigger time with the rifle is important at this stage and the cheaper it is to shoot the more you'll be able to shoot.
 
I like the 243. People are doing amazing things with them. All the calibers you are looking at are good but have more recoil except the 22-250. I've read about guy winning 1000 yard match'a with the 243 and they were using them because they had less recoil and easy to stay on target. Mind you these aren't your run of the mill 243's. By being able to reload you can use bullets that have a great BC. Any way.. whatever you choose it's up to you. Good luck!
 
I will eventually reload. In fact, I'm planning on reloading as soon as my dollar bills can take me there. My hope is that I can get a 100 grain Berger VLD to stabilize with the right load.
 
Well, I went up to my local Sheels and talked to their reloading guy. I learned a ton! Reloading isn't so daunting now. I bought a reloading manual for .243 and I'm going to be pouring over that for the next couple days.
 
Originally Posted By: UCChrisWell, I went up to my local Sheels and talked to their reloading guy. I learned a ton! Reloading isn't so daunting now. I bought a reloading manual for .243 and I'm going to be pouring over that for the next couple days.

Read the manual like you're studying for a final exam. Twice. You'll be graded on it, and if you make a failing grade your body parts will pay the penalty. Seek assistance from people that you have evidence of competency. Counter sales guys might or might NOT know what they are doing. This place is a wealth of knowledge and you won't get false info.

Reloading is fun, safe, and rewarding. Do your research and spend your money ONCE. Don't buy stuff you don't need. Forget digital scales. Balance scales like the 505 will suit your needs well. Step into this carefully and selectively and you can get up and running without spending a bunch of funds.

Have fun!
 
I took his advice worth a grain of salt. However, we talked for almost two hours and and no point did I feel he was BS'ing his way through his answers.

There are a couple of guys in my neighborhood, that were my former BSA leaders, who reload. I am going to ask them if I can come watch them during a reloading session.

I'm thinking of this kit.

I will need dies also (obviously) and a case trimmer.

Edit: Took out the atrociously long link. It was a RCBS Rock Chucker Supreme Kit. I did some more reading though, and it seems like I would be just as well off with a Lee 50th Anniversary kit, some dies, and a chronograph for only $50 more than the RCBS kit costs alone.

Thoughts? I promise to listen this time...
 
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Originally Posted By: tugboaterI like the 243. People are doing amazing things with them. All the calibers you are looking at are good but have more recoil except the 22-250. I've read about guy winning 1000 yard match'a with the 243 and they were using them because they had less recoil and easy to stay on target. Mind you these aren't your run of the mill 243's. By being able to reload you can use bullets that have a great BC. Any way.. whatever you choose it's up to you. Good luck!

Actually, they use the 243 because the heavier bullets have great BC's AND the reason stated above. There's a post on snipershide about "what the pros use". Pretty much every single one of them is using 6mm (.243), 6.5mm, or .260. You really can't go wrong with any of them.

I wouldn't worry about ammo cost between calibers so much either. If you're launching lots and lots of rounds downrange then factor it in, but for occasional target shooting and hunting it won't make much difference especially if you get into reloading. If the caliber you choose tends to cost more for ammo...just stock up a few boxes when you find it on sale.

And if people give you a hard time for changing your mind before you buy....whatever. I'm only 30 years old but have been an avid shooter for over half my life now and have a pile of rifles. I still flip flop on caliber choice every time I swap a barrel LOL.
 
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That's part of the reason I really liked the .243 once I looked at the external ballistics of various calibers. I can reload (super excited to do that BTW) 95 grain bullets that have excellent BC's for such a small round. I was thinking about going to 7mm-08 for the even better ballistics, but the cost and the fact that the Predator isn't offered in that caliber turned me off.

Another question. My reloading manual doesn't have Berger bullets listed in it, so can I load a 95 grain Berger VLD using the load information from a 95 grain Hornady SST? Starting lower than the max load and slowly working it up to where it performs best of course...

Also, the guy at Scheels said that if I used ball, or short-cut, powder, I'd need magnum primers? My manual seems to confirm this. The reason he was saying I should use ball/short-cut powder is because the powder dispenser tends to crush the longer powders when dispensing? Does this sound correct? I'm planning on using Remington 9 1/2 primers with IMR4350 powder (it seems like a readily available powder), unless there is a good reason to go to a ball/short-cut powder.

Thanks!
 
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Originally Posted By: UCChris

Also, the guy at Scheels said that if I used ball, or short-cut, powder, I'd need magnum primers? My manual seems to confirm this. The reason he was saying I should use ball/short-cut powder is because the powder dispenser tends to crush the longer powders when dispensing? Does this sound correct? I'm planning on using Remington 9 1/2 primers with IMR4350 powder (it seems like a readily available powder), unless there is a good reason to go to a ball/short-cut powder.

Thanks!

Well ... the "Guy at Scheels" painted a very broad picture. You need to use WHAT THE MANUAL SAYS. Substituting primers, or using a different primer because of XXXXX is something that comes with a lot of time at the trigger and reloading bench. For a guy to put that sort of thing in your head is pretty irresponsible. He (and you) would have been better off telling you to choose your load, then get the primer that the book calls for. This is the very reason I said earlier to go by the book ... not what you are told or hear. And while his info might be correct for most loads, that doesn't change the fact that he introduced a theory into your brain instead of giving you proper advice. (is all of this making sense?)

As for the powder dispenser cutting stick powders? Yeah ... that's true. But it never stopped me from loading stick powder. It can be a tiny bit aggravating at times but not to the point of avoiding it if it gives me the performance that I am looking for.

If you are getting tired of me telling you to go by the book, then please understand this: New reloaders don't usually grasp the way things work at the beginning. It's easy to get off track and cause yourself problems. Load straight by the numbers for a while, and browse these pages and ask a lot of questions. There are instances that components (I hate to say this) can be substituted safely. But until you get a thorough understanding of everything you need to play it safe. If you are considering doing something that isn't in print, or deviating from a book recipe, get on here and ask. I can assure you that there are guys here that can provide the information that you seek.

Also, don't get all wrapped around a chronograph. They're a great tool, but not the Holy Grail of load development. Remember that accuracy is what you are seeking. That paper target or animal won't know the difference between 2900 and 3100 fps.
 
Not tired of hearing you say go by the book. He was helping me flip through the book at Scheels and I asked why some powders were designated, by an asterisk, for magnum primers.

My reloading book says that the maximum load with IMR 4831 and a 95 grain Hornady SST is 42.5 grains. The same book says that the maximum load, with the same powder, for a 95 grain SMK is 42 grains. So which is right? Obviously I'm going to start 10% lower (38 grains) and build up. But should I build up in .5 grain increments?

So many questions...

I was thinking I need a chronograph for building dope sheets.

Edit: I crunched some numbers and, assuming I get the Lee 50th Anniversary kit and Lee .243 Pacetter die kit, I will need to reload 490 rounds to break even on the cost of reloading vs. buying factory Federal ammunition. However, the next 1000 rounds, after breaking even, saves me $324.39. Almost the cost of the Ruger American Predator. Assuming I reload for the rest of my life (100 rounds a month for 60 years = 72,000 rounds), I save (not accounting for inflation) $23,400. Food for thought; for those that think that the initial cost of reloading is too high.

Edit2: I realized that I crunched those numbers using the cheap Federal Whitetail as the factory baseline. When you reload, you're essentially making match ammo (very consistent). So I re-crunched the numbers using HSM Gold as my factory baseline.

Only 273 reloads to breakeven

The next 1000 rounds save me $1024.39

Over a lifetime, (72,000 cartridges) it saves me $73,800

BIG difference there. Holy smokes...
 
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