Gas gun vs bolt

Widow maker 223

Widow maker 223

Active member
What makes a gas gun harder to drive than a bolt gun?? Iv only shot a few bolt guns for accuracy and they werent mine. Bolt guns seem to be more comfy for me to shoot, might be the length of pull or stock design. But i still cant put down my gasser.
 
Gas guns typically have all kinds of attachments on the barrel that tend to make them less accurate than a comparable bolt gun. Operating rods, gas cylinders, flash suppressors all effect barrel harmonics. Sometimes you get lucky, like the case of your basic direct impingement AR-15, and they're accurate out of the box. Then you get cases like the M1 Garand and M14, where they have to be tweaked to make them anywhere near as accurate as a bolt gun. Let's not even talk about FALs.
 
So you are saying its harder to make a gas gun as accurate as a bolt gun. Wich i can agree with. Very few will shoot consistant 1/4" groups. But to me the part about being harder to drive has to do with how easy they are to shoot accuratly, wich shouldnt be any different. I just never understood this saying.
 
I think it is because of the purpose built into an AR. They were not designed to be bench guns. Bolt guns are, to an extent.

At the same time, I find off hand shooting much easier with a service rifle over a typical bolt gun.
 
Just how they are designed causes issues. The bolt gun is slender and everything is in one line or plane. The AR is very tall and you have your hands in different planes. Not well lined up for consistent grip or suport.

The sighting system is taller on the AR and higher from the center of the bore which can be an issue.

Historically the bolt guns have better triggers with less work than the AR's and that helps a great deal. Not feeding the gas system will also enhance the consistency and accuracy of the bolt gun.

Greg
 
Originally Posted By: Widow maker 223 So you are saying its harder to make a gas gun as accurate as a bolt gun. Wich i can agree with. Very few will shoot consistant 1/4" groups. But to me the part about being harder to drive has to do with how easy they are to shoot accuratly, wich shouldnt be any different. I just never understood this saying.


How would it be easier to make a bolt gun more accurate? Lets see here what it takes.

AR
Good barrel
Free float tube
Trigger

Bolt
Good barrel
bedding
Good stock
Trigger
Truing the action (if your that type)

Looks like the AR wins to me. I love how people think Bolt guns are more accurate then AR's.
 
Originally Posted By: GLShooterJust how they are designed causes issues. The bolt gun is slender and everything is in one line or plane. The AR is very tall and you have your hands in different planes. Not well lined up for consistent grip or suport.

Lets stop and think about all the name brand stocks and all the new bolt action rifles that are coming out. Which design do they look like???? They sure don't look like Grandpa's old 30-06 to me!

Originally Posted By: GLShooterThe sighting system is taller on the AR and higher from the center of the bore which can be an issue.
Has NO effect on accuracy! And with a good setup is mute just like in a bolt gun.

Originally Posted By: GLShooterHistorically the bolt guns have better triggers with less work than the AR's and that helps a great deal. Not feeding the gas system will also enhance the consistency and accuracy of the bolt gun.

Greg
AR triggers are easier to replace then any bolt gun trigger IMO. Historically! That's funny guess you can put the blame on Clinton for that one. And that bullet is already out of the barrel before the bolt even moves back so the gas has nothing to do with accuracy again!

This is about the about the most uniformed post I have seen in awhile!
 
A friend of mine who is a long time great wood/deep blue steel bolt gun guy finally took the plunge with a RR PP and shot a sweet 100yd 3/8" group with 55gr ZMAX. Now he is ready to load up lots of 223! Welcome to the Dark Side! Regards
 
most of the time a gas gun can shoot just as good as a bolt gun but it takes way more money...due to alot of the things that dmpowder says we are uninformed about.
 
I must be in the minority, My 2 Rock River AR's both shoot better than my Rem 700 BDL 22-250 could muster. At 100 yards I can cover 5 shots with a dime, the BDL could get right on 1", I sold that 22-250 to a buddy who said he would be happy with the way that gun shot. I still have a 700 VSSF II 22-250 that will shoot 1/2" groups but it had some help from the gunsmith to do that. I just like the AR for multi shots or multi misses.----Good Luck----Riflemann
 
Im not saying gas guns dont shoot worth a hoot, mine shoots great. Both bolt guns i shot were box stock remington varmint contours. They must of been an exception as both shot with great accuracy. The whole point is why do people say gassers are harder to drive than a bolt gun. It has never made any sence to me.
 
I've got good ones in both platforms. In fact I have SUPER ones in both platforms. I was not arguing the fact that an AR can't shoot I was pointing out why it HARDER to shoot as well.

High positioned sights most assuredly will effect how easy it is to shoot the rifle if your normal cheek weld is low. Triggers? It takes me about 15 minutes and a couple of screwdrivers to get many bolts down where they are very nice. With the AR it only takes me two Ben Franklins or so to get what I want. I've spent more than a few of those on my AR triggers.

The super thing about a bolt gun is you aren't fighting gas operating pressures as in the AR. An adjustable gas block on the AR goes a long way to handle that but none the less it is a factor. I've got a 20 Tactical that shoots great with some powders but until I change that GB I can't use three or four of them.

The AR is far superior for being a platform that can easily be swapped/changed to fit the shooter or task at hand. Stocks, uppers, extra operating surfaces are easy on the AR as long as you have few tools and a kitchen table, and the table is optional.

One are that I do like about the bolt guns is you can easily pull the barrel and re-cut a chamber if the old one is shot out.

I'm informed enough to use both platforms in the game field and in matches with some little bit of success. I always respect another's opinion and while I may disagree I, many times, can learn from the other posters. We don't do this for a living and I'll continue on with my level of blissful lack of knowledge.

Greg
 
Last edited:
I enjoy the way everyone shares information on here, and I enjoy sharing my experience also. I like my 30-06 bolt, and my 444 Marlin lever for deer hunting, it is fun to shoot all 3 actions (AR, Bolt, Lever) I go with the bolt 22-250 for the long shots on yotes, but most of the time go with the AR when calling them in. Enjoy your guns guys and shoot often,----Riflemann
 
Originally Posted By: RiflemannI enjoy the way everyone shares information on here, and I enjoy sharing my experience also. I like my 30-06 bolt, and my 444 Marlin lever for deer hunting, it is fun to shoot all 3 actions (AR, Bolt, Lever) I go with the bolt 22-250 for the long shots on yotes, but most of the time go with the AR when calling them in. Enjoy your guns guys and shoot often,----Riflemann

I agree. I grew up up there. I've almost gone back for deer season more than once.

Greg

PS: I'll use a 25 WSSM AR for the dead when I do if it is a rifle area. If not a Benelli M1 Super 90.

Greg
 
Some of the newer AR's can fire single shot when you turn the regulator off, I hear they are more accurate that way, but then why not just get a bolt gun. I prefer an ar for coyotes anyway for the follow up shots.
 
We can turn the adjustable gas block off and shoot it like a single shot. However, this messes with the harmonics of the round slightly. Your POI may or may not vary.

I know it sure bit me on a a 500 yard practice match one day when I tried it for grins. I know I won't do that again.

Greg
 
Originally Posted By: dmpowderOriginally Posted By: Widow maker 223 So you are saying its harder to make a gas gun as accurate as a bolt gun. Wich i can agree with. Very few will shoot consistant 1/4" groups. But to me the part about being harder to drive has to do with how easy they are to shoot accuratly, wich shouldnt be any different. I just never understood this saying.


How would it be easier to make a bolt gun more accurate? Lets see here what it takes.

AR
Good barrel
Free float tube
Trigger

Bolt
Good barrel
bedding
Good stock
Trigger
Truing the action (if your that type)

Looks like the AR wins to me. I love how people think Bolt guns are more accurate then AR's.

I'll throw in the "bolt" on an AR makes a difference as well!
 
Both drive well, and handle like they were on rails.

Assuming we are comparing Peaches with Nectarines.

We can't take a low end Ar and compare with a top end bolt gun or versa vise.

My AR [varmint style] off the shelf shoots .500-.600 with no work or add on's.

My Rem 700's [varmint style] off the shelf shoot the same. All with reloads.

Sign and drive. It's all good.
 
Originally Posted By: dmpowder I love how people think Bolt guns are more accurate then AR's.


Because they are
w00t.gif



Maybe not an off the shelf remchersterage, shooting against a good off the shelf AR. I'll agree an average AR will shoot with an average boltgun. But if you ring out all the accuracy possible from the gun (I'm talking the best of the best). A bolt action has a better platform, it's undisputable. How many world records (pertinent to shooting tiny groups) do gas guns hold v/s bolt guns?
 
If the AR's egonomics were so terrible, it makes one wonder what David Tubb was thinking when he designed his bolt gun?
RifleTAC.jpg

Personally, I like both and have good accuracy out of both style rifles. The only disadvantage I see in my AR is weight. At 24" bull barrel and 14.5lbs it is heavy. Still not as bad as my 15.5lb varmint contoured bolt gun with 28" barrel though, but heavy for length. As for scope height, I use to run mine like everybody else, setting high. Now my optics are slammed down near the forearm like most peoples bolt guns. Most people can't get sight picture with it like that, but I love it that way. You have to bury the stock in your cheek, but it is solid. The main advantage to my AR is that it is a semi-auto and shoots great and all I did was pin my upper to the lower and do load development. This makes them DIY rifles like the Savage/Stevens nut jobs.
wink.gif
My AR setup, notice the scope height.
PICT0202-1.jpg
 


Write your reply...
Back
Top