Groundhogs Anyway You Like It

Man DAA, those are some fine looking rifles. That 6AI just seems to have caught my eye. That is a beautiful rifle. How difficult is the 6AI to load for?

I know exactly what you mean about a gun having a personality, and of just liking one. I have a rebarreled 700 in plain 22-250. I love it. It's super accurate and just a pleasure to shoot.

I'm probably just dreaming / hoping to hear that a #1 can be made to shoot. I know a good bolt gun would be the way to go.
 
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Dave im voting that you are banned from posting pics of your rifles /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif. After getting obsessed about your .17 predator I cant take anymore /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smiliesmack.gif. You sir have some fine looking rifles /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowingsmilie.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowingsmilie.gif.
 
David, have you considered something milder for the #1, maybe a 6BR or PPC. E.A. Brown has 6mmBRM barrels for T/C's, maybe he can do a #1. It's a fairly cool looking round. Maybe keep it as a deer rifle and go 260 or 7mm08, that would be a peach to carry around. Always wanted a #1, just never got the money at the right time.
 
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Oh - just a "by the way...", my 8T .22-250AI, shooting 75 Amax, only lasted about 700 rounds.

- DAA



Do you remember what velocity you ran the 22-250AI at?? How did the 75 grain A-Max perform on ground hogs??

Barrel wear was the main reason I did not go with the AI, and went with the standard 22-250. However if I thought I could have gotten 700 rounds with the AI-then I wish I would have chambered it for the AI.

Also I am leaning toward H-414. What do you think about that?? Tom.
 
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Do you remember what velocity you ran the 22-250AI at?? How did the 75 grain A-Max perform on ground hogs??

Barrel wear was the main reason I did not go with the AI, and went with the standard 22-250. However if I thought I could have gotten 700 rounds with the AI-then I wish I would have chambered it for the AI.

Also I am leaning toward H-414. What do you think about that?? Tom.




Well... This is kind of a difficult subject for me to get into over a keyboard. Much easier to talk about it than type about it. What makes it difficult, is there are so many variables, and shades of gray in the definitions of the terms we use. I'll give you a real short version here, but realize, there are variables involved that make it entirely likely for someone else to get quite different results.

Some pertinent info about my setup - 29", 8T, Lilja 3 groove barrel. Length, twist, grooves, they all matter.

First, velocity and terminal effect on 'chucks with the 75 Amax... They were doing about 3400 fps MV, and were very effective on the terminal end on 'chucks. VERY effective!

BUT!!! I was only able to use the 75 Amax for about 250 rounds. At that point, full house loads started going "poof" as soon as the barrel got a bit warmed up and fouled. Started backing off the velocity and it helped some but was not really the answer.

Switched to the 80 gr. Berger, at about 3250 fps. Between lower velocity and an apparently stronger jacket they got me back in business again. But... Only for about another 300 rounds. Then they too, started going "poof". Again, I backed off the velocity, and again it helped some, but not really the answer.

So... I switched to the SMK 80 gr. at about 3100 fps. Poor terminal performance, lots of pencil throughs and crawl offs. Plus, they really didn't get me away from the "poofs" for very long either. After only about 150 rounds, I gave up on the barrel.

My opinion, the difference in barrel life between the standard .22-250 and the AI version, in an 8 twist barrel used for the application I just described, would be very little. The "problem", with large capacity, fast twist .22's, is that once the throat gets just a little bit rough, jacket integrity starts to become an issue. And before you know it, you've got "poofs". The problem being, that it really does not take much gator hide in the throat to cause it. It's just that at over 300,000 RPM, it doesn't take much damage to the jacket to cause it to come apart.

But! Like I said to begin, there are some really, really significant variables that can create really significant differences in how things will turn out. I went with a 3 groove on that barrel because my experience with them has been that they resist erosion a bit better than 6 grooves. But! That barrel was rendered pretty well useless long before any really significant erosion took place. With hindsight, I suspect that more, smaller lands would have caused less stress on the jacket and perhaps allowed longer service life. But, that's just speculation on my part. Another really large variable worth mentioning, I think, is the actual twist rate. That barrel of mine was an 8. The 8 is needed to shoot the longer 80's. But, a 9 would have sufficed for the 75 Amax. And the lower RPM of a 9, I am speculating again, would likely have contributed to significantly longer service life. Yet another variable worth mentioning, shot strings. The way I used mine, it routinely shot strings until the barrel got good and hot. Towards the end of it's life, it just would not tolerate being warm or dirty. It would still kill 'chucks all day, as long as it was kept cold and clean. For my hunts, that makes it about as useful as teets on a boar. But for a guy that only takes a few snipes in an evening, it might not matter at all. So I think the manner in which the rifle actually gets used can both accelerate wear, and accentuate what wear there is, or just the opposite, depending on rate of fire and length of string.

There's way more to it, of course. But like I said, it's not a subject I really like to get into over the keyboard. Too much typing, and still too much chance of not being understood.

Bottom line for me though, after messing with a few of them, large capacity fast twist .22's are more PITA than they are worth, to me. But! That 75 Amax sure has a place in the field on windy days. A 9 twist .22BR with a long barrel is what I'll build around that bullet next though. Enough capacity to get over 3000 fps, enough twist to stabilize, but not too much of either. I think it would outlast my 8T .22-250AI several fold.

Oh! Powder... H414 is worth trying. Mine liked RL-22 best though.

- DAA
 
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Man, you guys have some nice rifles, not to mention DAA's shovel.

I have tossed around the idea of a 243 Ackley Improved rebarrel for a # 1 Ruger I have. I'm not sure how much of a shooter it could become, accuracy wise. Does anyone have any experience with #1s? I like the idea of it if, and that's a big "IF," it could be made to shoot.



I have played with #1's a bit. I have had two in 220 Swift and they were good shooters but not consistent.

The best one I ever had (no longer have it and kick myself about that) was a #1V that started out as a 22.250. Bullberry rechambered the rifle to 6mmBR. They also installed a Moyers trigger and a barrel tuner under the forearm. The barrel was a varmint weight and was 24" long.

That little rifle would shoot 55's at 3800 and was very accurate!

Pictures of that rifle are over at 6mmBR.com and it is the featured gun of the week for week #2.

Mike.
 
Corey, E.A. Brown no longer does #1s. They used to and I had considered that at one time, but they got out of the #1 work. And 'yes', I have considered deer-type cartridges for the #1, as a matter of fact, I had even contemplated a 338-06 as a possible choice if I went with something other than for varmints.

Thanks Stormbringer for the info. I'll check out the photos.
 
Hey 6mm06--Shilen may put barrels on a Ruger #1??.. do some searching for gunsmiths who specialize in working on #1's.. Gre-Tan may be one...not sure though..
There is a gunsmith named John Brown in McGayheysville, VA 1-540-289-5365 who does really nice work at an affordable price.. I would definitely give him a shout.. I know he has a 243 AI reamer.. tell him Sam sent ya..
 
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Hey 6mm06--Shilen may put barrels on a Ruger #1??.. do some searching for gunsmiths who specialize in working on #1's.. Gre-Tan may be one...not sure though..
There is a gunsmith named John Brown in McGayheysville, VA 1-540-289-5365 who does really nice work at an affordable price.. I would definitely give him a shout.. I know he has a 243 AI reamer.. tell him Sam sent ya..



Shilen doesn't (neither does Gre-tan), but Shilen has a list of smiths that do. Just call them.

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I was digging around some old threads for something to read and came across this one. David started a great thread here with a lot of info in here. As we all prepare our rifles for the up and coming groundhog season, post up some pictures of last years hunt! They make for good reading while we wait for that sunny day after the fist cut of hay.

Eric
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Man am I missing the hay fields. I'll post one up of my 243. I'm missing her right now, but she is in good hands with the guys at Bartlein. Can't wait to get her back and paint the fields again
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Originally Posted By: ARCOREYMan am I missing the hay fields. I'll post one up of my 243. I'm missing her right now, but she is in good hands with the guys at Bartlein. Can't wait to get her back and paint the fields again
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Beautiful looking rifle!
 
Thanks Virginian. I can't wait to get it back then mail it off again
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. I'm getting a 28" 4 groove 1-9" twist 243 Barlein SS barrel with an extra inch on the heavy end so I can set her back after I torch the throat. The action is getting trued and bolt face re-cut, lugs lapped, and the recoil lug replaced and pinned. When it's done, I'm going to print some groups on paper then send it off for a Cerakote job on the metal and maybe Duracoat the stock to match. Then when she comes back, I'll look at attaching my Atlas Bipod to it and steal the scope back from my AR. Maybe I'll be able to afford optics for it one of these days. I'm really wanting a 6x-24x-50mm Vortex Viper PST for this rifle with MOA knobs and reticle
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Corey,

I may have that very Vortex at the cabin on one of my rifles that I was going to sell. If you like, I'll check when i get down there this weekend and PM you the details.

Eric
 
I doubt you'll have the one I'm drooling over. They are still almost impossible to get as they were the last to release and hardest to get. It is the First Focal Plane MOA 6x-24x-50mm PST. If you do have it, please don't tell me for another year or two
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. My wife still doesn't know about the action work and rebarrel. If I went into debt for the scope too she'd kill me. I've got a lot of money tied up in a gun that I only shoot groundhogs with and throw them back in the hole when done
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. I need another year or so to save for the glass.
 


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