hand loads vs factory for self defense

Originally Posted By: bigtommyJust use factory load for self defense and play it safe. Why even take the chance because even you if you do have to shoot someone and it is a good shoot you will be put through the ringer so why even give them something else to look at. There is a reason why law enforcement is not allowed to use reloads for duty.

Exactly!
 
OMG is that not the reason LE doesn't carry reloads. Some do. My first Sheriff dept allowed for it. Except for smaller departments we all carry the same gun, same caliber and if things go badly we don't want to worry that a tailored round won't feed in someone elses pistol and will perform consistently from pistol to pistol. It's 'safe' to use factory ammo, but for me, not for the atty after the fact.

You're going to be put through the ringer on any shooting. If you pull the trigger, you will get sued. That's all there is to it. You save your life, you're in for a nasty ride. Or you die and don't worry about it. Sucks no matter what.

Plink with the cheapest you can, carry the best you can. If that's factory, its factory. If it's your own, its your own. When what I turn out defies physics, I'll start worrying.
 
Originally Posted By: Sod FarmerThe last time I checked, there is no law on the books that makes it illegal to use handloads for self defense.

On the other hand... You can be vindicated and not charged with wrong doing in a criminal court but still can get convicted in a civil court. Probably no law against hot coffee at McDonald's but they paid three million dollars to a litigant because she got burned because of a loose lid and hot coffee. Who knows, ya know?
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As I've said before, it doesn't matter what you use.

IF you use a gun in a self defense situation, everything you did will be spin doctored. If you used factory loads, they will try to make an issue about WHICH factory loads your used. If you used hollow points, they will spin doctor it that you were trying to produce "maximum carnage". You'll be portrayed as a closet Rambo.

If you used FMJ loads, they will call them "cop killer armor piercing bullets". If you used wadcutters, they will say you were trying to wound and cause pain and prolonged suffering before death and you're a sicko with daddy issues.

This is the paradox of self defense. You MUST be prepared to go on trial if you use this right, so you'd better be [beeep] sure you used it legally.

It scares me all the time. Guys in states where I know the so-called Castle Doctrine is NOT the law, but they're talking about it like it is. Yikes. Bad things are going to happen if you don't know the law and act within it.

The ammo you use doesn't matter for squat.

Grouse.
 
Ammo type won't matter IMO. It makes no difference if I bought the most lethal Factory ammo available, or just shot them with the reloads that happened to be in My pistol of revolver.

OK I am on a hunting trip and have my revolver and my rifle loaded with My favorite hunting/plinking ammo. I stop at a local Mini Mart for gas and supplies, and get into a tussle with thugs or robbers. How could it make a difference as to what bullet would be in my gun? It's not like anyone knows when they could end up in a possible life or death struggle. Those are My thoughts anyway. YMMV
 
Originally Posted By: Orneryolfart357Ammo type won't matter IMO. It makes no difference if I bought the most lethal Factory ammo available, or just shot them with the reloads that happened to be in My pistol of revolver.

OK I am on a hunting trip and have my revolver and my rifle loaded with My favorite hunting/plinking ammo. I stop at a local Mini Mart for gas and supplies, and get into a tussle with thugs or robbers. How could it make a difference as to what bullet would be in my gun? It's not like anyone knows when they could end up in a possible life or death struggle. Those are My thoughts anyway. YMMV

Pretty good alibi IMO!
 

+1

Originally Posted By: Orneryolfart357Ammo type won't matter IMO. It makes no difference if I bought the most lethal Factory ammo available, or just shot them with the reloads that happened to be in My pistol of revolver.

OK I am on a hunting trip and have my revolver and my rifle loaded with My favorite hunting/plinking ammo. I stop at a local Mini Mart for gas and supplies, and get into a tussle with thugs or robbers. How could it make a difference as to what bullet would be in my gun? It's not like anyone knows when they could end up in a possible life or death struggle. Those are My thoughts anyway. YMMV
 
I agree with what crap shoot says. IIRC, there was a case years ago where someone used Black Talon ammo in self defense. The attorney for the dead guys survivors tried to prejudice the jury on the grounds of the evil/wicked/mean and nasty ammo. I don't remember how it turned out for the shooter but if you are using what PD uses, that angle is null and void.
 
So in other words.. you are carrying a piece with reloaded ammo... its better to let the Thugs kill you? To avoid a Civil suit? Sorry.. I ain't going for that. I will take my chances. Something tells me that the same crap will come down regardless if you shoot a piece of scum with reloaded or the latest Ultra Lethal ammo. It doesn't add up for Me. Do as you like. I am not going to be able to change ammo 2 seconds before a confrontation that I can't for see. Again.. YMMV But then I don't frequent areas that lure in scum.
 
In some States, it could make a big difference, not here in Arizona. If you were justified in using deadly force in self defense, you cannot be held civily liable, in other States you can.
ARS13-413. No civil liability for justified conduct
No person in this state shall be subject to civil liability for engaging in conduct otherwise justified pursuant to the provisions of this chapter.
 
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Originally Posted By: Orneryolfart357So in other words.. you are carrying a piece with reloaded ammo... its better to let the Thugs kill you? To avoid a Civil suit? Sorry.. I ain't going for that. I will take my chances. Something tells me that the same crap will come down regardless if you shoot a piece of scum with reloaded or the latest Ultra Lethal ammo. It doesn't add up for Me. Do as you like. I am not going to be able to change ammo 2 seconds before a confrontation that I can't for see. Again.. YMMV But then I don't frequent areas that lure in scum.

Just don't put it in your carry gun to begin with...then you won't have to reload when the thugs come after you.
 
And, when you read Ayoob note that the "cases" are about negligent discharges and unsafe "hair triggers". Seems like arguing about angels sitting on the head of a pin versus the real world.

There is nothing inherently "wrong" with handloads, keep records (you should for a lot of reasons) and you will be able to explain load development for accuracy just fine.
 
Originally Posted By: DoogerOriginally Posted By: Orneryolfart357So in other words.. you are carrying a piece with reloaded ammo... its better to let the Thugs kill you? To avoid a Civil suit? Sorry.. I ain't going for that. I will take my chances. Something tells me that the same crap will come down regardless if you shoot a piece of scum with reloaded or the latest Ultra Lethal ammo. It doesn't add up for Me. Do as you like. I am not going to be able to change ammo 2 seconds before a confrontation that I can't for see. Again.. YMMV But then I don't frequent areas that lure in scum.

Just don't put it in your carry gun to begin with...then you won't have to reload when the thugs come after you.


Sorry.. I can't go with your line of thinking. If I am hunting with reloads that are accurate in My handgun... and I run into a problem, be it out in the field or at the gas station, I am supposed to give up My right to defend Myself? Due to hand loaded ammo? I don't think so!
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