Help with Misfires

T

TheBaron

New member
Hey Fellas,

I've been to the range a couple of times with Rem 700 BDL carbine in .222 Remington Magnum (1960's manufacture). I am very pleased that I've already found a few loads that grouped 5 shots at 100yd. under 3/4" and two that are into the low .5's. A charge of 26.5gr. BL-C(2) seems to be the clear winner in this gun (a max. load, but no signs of excessive pressure).

My problem is that the gun is misfiring occasionally - a well dented primer, but no boom. On the first trip, it did it with some older Gevelot factory ammo and with 1 of my reloads, so I thought it could be partly the fault of the ammo. I bought a replacement PIERCEision Gunworks firing pin assembly from Sinclair, thinking that would fix the trouble (I was thinking weak main spring and/or short firing fin). That improved the problem, but didn't cure it. On my last trip, I still got 2 misfires out of 40 rounds fired (1 factory, 1 reload). In the case of the reload, it fired after about the 3rd strike, but the facory load didn't fire after 1/2 doz. strikes. The primer dents are well centered and sufficiently deep, so I'm kinda stumped for ideas.

I am seating the primers with a Lee handtool, and they appear to be seating nicely. Could there be excessive headspace, allowing the case to slip forward on the hammer strike? I have no HS gauges, but I'd think if this were the problem it would happen more frequently? All the brass was new (never fired) and I have measured case stretch of up to 0.008" after 1 firing, which seems a little high (?). Maybe this will improve after the cases are just neck sized for a 2nd firing in the same gun?

Does anyone have any theories as to why I'm still getting the odd misfire? Any thoughts are welcome! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused1.gif
 
It doesn't sound like a headspace problem. If you are getting good dents in the primer , then they may not be seated flush with the bottom of the primer pocket. If you think it is a headspace problem then back off to a medium of the book load and load the next batch with the bullet seated into the rifleing and then see if you get a misfire. Sometimes handleing the primers with you hands will contaminate some off the primers and cause a misfire. Factory rounds if old will have misfire if not stored right. As far as the case stretching .008 that could be normal depending on who cut the chamber and the reamer. You can get the go and no go headspace gages from Brownell.
 
On the reloads, make sure and use a system that doesn't have you touching the primers. Oils and acids on your hands can play hell on your primers. Primer trays, pick up tubes and automatic feeders from RCBS solved the issue I had. I haven't had a misfire in years since "no touch". AS far as the factory rounds your on your own on that one. I think the quick answer would be age. You may want to try a bullet puller and look at the primer to see if they are contaminated. Good Luck.
 
Something that it might be is an accumulation of oils, solvents and crud in the internal portion of the bolt body which isn't allowing the firing pin to travel it's rquired distance and absorbing some of the enenrgy from the freing pin. A through cleaning of the inside of the bolt body cavity might solve the problem.

Good Luck

Bill
 
You didn't mention what kind of primers you are using, you may need to use a more sensitive primer!

As an example, CCI primers are considered to be the least sensitive primers, the most likely to have a problem like this, Federal Primers are considered to be the most sensitive, the least likely to have a problem like this. All the other brands are somewhere in between those two.
 
I'm with Wingman. Try different primers and use the old ammo at the range only when the shot is not so important. I have personally had cci's cave in 12ga brass and have nothing more than a mar on the primer.
 
I had a similar problem with my RCBS hand primer and suspected the problem of over pressure when I did it. I believe I applied a little too much pressure and collapsed the anvil in the primer as I had one missfire when checking the loads at the range. I was using Winchester SR primers at the time

As far as the factory loads, I'm scratching my head on that one unless, as stated, there is a small piece of crud in the firing pin shaft that is impeding the strike of the firing pin on an intermittent basis. I have a lot of older '63 & '67 military ammo that still shoots flawlessly.
 
Hmmmm... I am using CCI 450 primers. Could a primer actually be so durable that a deep, dead-center pin strike could fail to ignite it? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused1.gif

I will pull the bolt shroud again and clean everything out. That could be it, considering it is a 30+ year old gun.

Thanks fellas! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif
 
As to finger oil ruining the primers - very unlikely.

Here's a very interesting thread from someone that deliberatly tried to kill primers with oils ofd different kinds - not east to do.

http://www.predatormastersforums.com/killprimers.shtml

I (personally) have found that CCI primers are not too reliable. I stopped using them many years ago when I lost a match to a misfire with a BR-4. When I got home, I punch the primer and found that it had no pellet. So I swore off CCI.

I recently bought another brick of BR-4s to load for a Benchrest rifle that I have had since 1978, a 40-XBBR in .222 Mag.

It has NEVER misfired. The first day out I got two misfires in the first 100 rounds with the CCI primers. I can't figure it out - if they were that bad, they wouldn't be able to sell them (especaially for the 50% more price)... but misfiring IS misfiring. I have had two Rem 7-1/2 misfire - both due to missing pellets.

I have never had a Federal primer misfire, which disturbs me, cuz it's my least favorite primer /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

There is one other variable. The priming compound. Winchester has the best priming compound - it has to do with the patents on how the azide is made. Winchester has the patents on it. All the others have "go around" processes.


.
 
I would look at flash hole, powder, and try a different lot of primers.

Primers can come in bad lots. Contact the primer manufacturer and discuss the situation. They may have info on that particular lot.

good luck.
 
I picked up this batch of 1,000 CCI 450's about 8 years ago. I've run a couple hundred through my 788 in .222 with never a misfire, although I hadn't popped one in probably 5 years as life had my reloading gear stowed away for a while. Now that I'm back into reloading, this new .222 mag is misfiring on both factory rounds (old stuff though) and the CCI's. That makes me think it is more likely the gun, but who knows.

In addition to cleaning up the bolt interior, I'll pick up another brand of primer and see what happens.
 
i had a 222 that did the same thing.it was the ejector spring that was causing the problem.it was real hard to push compaired to my other 700.it has not misfired sence i replased it.i gave the gun to my nefphew.he has been shooting it for about 5 years now with no problems.
 
Quote:
I picked up this batch of 1,000 CCI 450's about 8 years ago.



I'll take a guess your firing pin strike is a bit light, and using CCI primers could definitely be troublesome, if you can find some Federal primers give those a try, they are the most sensitive and may give you the reliability you need.

I've got a custom target revolver, heavily modified and tuned for the smoothest, lightest double action trigger possible, it is set up for Federal primers only, any other brand of primer won't work, Federal works 100%, 50,000 plus rounds have proven that, but try another brand...one time I loaded some shells with Winchester primers, in that revolver I had 1 or 2 misfires in every cylinder, back to Federal primers and back to 100%!
 
It is extremely unlikely that it is bad primers. Actually you eliminated that possibility by also having the problem with factory loads. It is a rifle problem:
Not enough firing pin protrusion.
Something slowing down the firing pin fall, gunk or something out of line slowing things down.

Jack
 
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