Is a Mil-dot reticle the best for varminting?

M

marchboom

New member
Will be getting a new scope for my Savage Long Range Precision Varminter in .22-250. I have narrowed it down to a Leupold and a Burris scope. My question is; Is the Mil-dot reticle the best one for long range varmint hunting or do the dots cover up too much? Leupold has the Varmint Hunters reticle that looks like it would do the job without all the clutter of the Mil-dots.

Would like to get others opinion on this issue.

Thanks
 
I am dealing with a scope issue with one of my guns now. At one point, I had a red dot on it (3 minute size dot). No magnification. At 100 yds, the dot was 5" wide. That is not enough accuracy. If the scope had magnification, the dot would have tightened up a bit and aiming could have been done more accurately.
Otherwise, I sorta like the dot.
 
marchboom,

The mildot reticule, ballistic plex, and varmint hunter reticule appear to be similar but do not function the same. The basic explanation for all three are as follows.

The mildot is designed as a range finding reticule with the mildot spacing = to 3.6" at 100 yards both in the vertical axis and the horizontal axis.

Leupies varmint reticule and Burris balistiplex reticles are more of a range compensating reticle. The cross hairs are preset based on certain caliber bullet weight at certain velocity will impact at certain point of impact and the lower horizontal cross hairs reflect those points of impact.

I personally prefer the mildot reticule and have four of them and use them for ground squirrels (whistle pigs), rock chucks, prairie dogs, coyotes, and big game. The first one I bought Leupy 6.5 X 20 X 50 LR is mounted on my Rem 700 VSSFP in 22-250 and is my long range varmint gun (500 + yards).

I have two Nikon Buckmaster 4.5 X 14 X 40 SF mildots mounted on my ARs in 223 and 17-223 which are my calling rifles.

Last one is a Sightron I 3 X 9 X 40 on my 308.

For the money the Nikon Buckmasters are hard to beat. The glass is crystal clear, adjustment is repeatable, the side focus is great, and you can't beat the price for the quality. This got a little long winded but I hope it helps out.

BoomSplat
 
There is certainly nothing wrong with the mil-dot for varminting especially in a scope that the std. mil-dot dot diameter is calibrated for a magnification that's lower than the highest power. As u increase magnification the dot diameter stays the same but occupies a smaller measurement (subtension) on the tgt. For example if u had a Bush. 3200 7-21X mil-dot the std. milliradian is calibrated for 14X, and if u elect to use it at the scope's highest power (21) the dot diameter will be about .5 inch per hundred yds. (IPHY), instead of about .75 IPHY for the calibrated power. The dot to dot subtension would then become 2.4 IPHY also @ 21X.

The Nikon 4-16's will be similar--12X for std. .2 mil, and .54 inch per hundred yds. for 16X. The dot to dot subtension then becomes 2.7 IPHY.

I also prefer the Leup. VH reticle as well since i like a more direct system of windage reference.
 
well, I have both the mil-dot and the burris ballistic plex and for long range accuracy on yotes and other critters I will take the b-plex every time. The scope dots are calibrated to match most factory loads, and if you want to reload for your gun with a little range time you can figure out very easily what yardage the dots match for your load.

with my mil-dot I know "now" what the dots represent for different yardages... this is not what the scope was designed for... but will work the same with a little programing and testing of your loads.
 
the true aspect of the mill-dot is to find the range to the target without a rang finder.
now how you do that is fist you need to know the easement size of your target, lit say deer is 18'from back to the bally of the deer now that is the Elsey part /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
now the hart part, you put half of the dot on the bally of the deer and you cont the dot say half of the bottom to half of the next one wood be 1 mill-dot /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif
now you take 27.778 multiply by 18=500.004 now you take that and divide by 1 (1mill-dot) and you get 500yds /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif
and if its two mill 27.778*18=500.004/by 2 =250yds /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
if you want to learn more about it go to a sniper web page.

PS if you are confused don't let it bug we all are confused /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowingsmilie.gif
 
IMHO, it is a preferance thing. I don't own a mil-dot and have never felt the need for one. My personal preferance is for a fine crosshair or the target dots. For me it has been figuring out the distance and wind on the Wyoming prairy. With a spotter working with me or the .204's (don't need the spotter) you can figure out the up-down and right or left pretty quick. Try a few friends scopes and see what fits you the best. Good luck with it.
 
My old hunting partner put Burris Ballistic plex scopes on all his rifles. He shoots a 7mm Rem mag, a 308 and a 204 Ruger. After putting one on his 7mm last year he was so impressed the rest of the rifles all got one. I have a mil dot scope on my Rem VLS 243 and as soon as I can afford it the ballistic plex is going on it. I've shot all three of his and they work dandy, way better than my mil dot. Biggest thing is they work at all powers.
 
Be careful Bob-- that reticle won't work on all powers if it's located in the 2nd focal plane (all the Burris's as far as i know). It WILL change subtension as magnification is changed.
 
They show Mil Dot scopes in the movies and everyone get's the thought that it might be just the ticket for their varmint rifle. The trouble is that what most of the adds and movies don't tell someone is all the homework, both behind your rifle load combination at the range and out in the field, and class work, with the instructions in hand, that it takes to really get the most from the scope. A laser rangefinder is faster, and more accurate for range estimation, but creates more movement to use, and there is the question of another piece of gear to carry. The new scopes with preset range points are far easier to use are a lot less busy and work at any magnification setting. For the average guy shooting prairie dogs, crows, or sage rats and ground hogs the multi plex scopes are hard to beat.
 
I have to disagree with some statements above on the the ballistic compensating reticule scopes. The two that were mentioned Burris and Leupold both do not function at any magnification you choose but only at maximum magnification in order to use the stadia lines for yardage. It is explained in detail on their websites. Also both reticules are based on certain cartridge bullet combinations at certain velocities, also stated on their websites. If your cartridge does not match their ballistics and you do not reload your own to match their spec you will only be ball park close in the scopes use. If you do not reload you will be doing your home work at the range in order to figure it out and end up making a label or chart to reflect your cartridge combination for use with the cross hairs in the scope. As I see it I don't see any advantage of of a trajectory compensating scope over a standard mildot, you still are going through the same steps. Just my .02.
 
check out the mueller line of scopes.the price is cheap compared to the leupold and burris.i just got one and the dot is the tiniest dot i ever seen.i have swift,tasco,leupold,simmons,and nikon scopes.i think i am gonna love this scope.its on my nitehunting rifle now and it is a small dot
http://www.muelleroptics.com/
 
Quote:
check out the mueller line of scopes.the price is cheap compared to the leupold and burris. Quote:
if you buy cheap you'll get cheap /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smiliesmack.gif

 
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You could always cheat with a mil-dot scope and use it for hold-over on a target where you can use a rangefinder for distance, or even guess the distance. Just shoot the rifle with the crosshairs zeroed at 100 yards and start shooting targets at 200, 300, and so on. use the different dots at different distances to see where they group versus point of aim. My .223 is 1" high at 100 with the crosshairs, 1.5" low at 200 with the crosshairs, and dead on at 300 with the first mildot down.
I realize that this leaves the shooter with many more mildots than he needs, but you can practice learning to use them to measure distance by getting a feel for how a particular game species looks in the scope (but only by knowing the given range accurately). Lets say for instance that your neighbors dog fits right between the crosshairs and the first mildot nose to tail at 100 yards. Now you can approximate what that coyote will look like in the scope if he is 100 yards away. Its kind of like using Kentucky windage, but it will work if you put some time in looking through your glass.

-BANDIT
 
I have a burris b;lack diamond on my savage with the balliatic plex. I have a leapold varx-III lr m1 with the mil-dots my cz. I like mild dots because I just use the dots for hold over and wind. But if I had the choice I would probably get the varmint hunters reticle. All three would serve you well.
 
A mil dot is nothiing other than a range estimation tool, and for making offset shots. It all depends if you are using them for actual range estimation, or just the cool looks. In that case, the scope that you are using doesnt have the dots on the 1st focal plane, there for the dot size wouldn't hold true when you switch your magnification. I suggest that you get a straight ten power, (once agian, for range est)this way it never comprimises the integrity of the mil dot. Then you can obtain data with your 250 at different ranges.
 
Any reticle that has more than one stadia point in it can be used for rangefinding by using this formula (inches to yds.)--

tgt size (inches) X range of reticle subtension measurement (usually 100 yds.) / reticle subtension (inches) / quantity of reticle gap tgt. occupies (tenths of the total gap between stadia) = range (yds.)

Here's how it is applied referring to Call-em-all's example above (18" deer, and 3.6 inch per hundred yd. mil-dot subtension, where deer fills the dot to dot subtension perfectly @ 1.0 "subtension unit")--

18 x 100 / 3.6 / 1.0 = 500

If the 18" deer occupies .9 of the dot to dot subtension (bottom of most mil-dots to center of next dot)--

18 x 100 / 3.6 / 0.9 = 555

If it occupies 1.5 mil-dots it is 333 yds. away--

18 x 100 / 3.6 / 1.5 = 333

In CEA's example he uses a factor of 27.8 (100/3.6 above). That is the "subtension unit" which is a factor any reticle subtension has at a given magnification. If someone has the 7-21X Bushnell MD (at 21X instead of the 14X where it's "calibrated") in my post above, and the dot to dot subtension is as i stated above then the new subtension unit becomes 100/2.4= 41.7, so now here's how the 18" deer would work with the 14X mil-dot std., that's recalibrated to the scope's highest power--

18 x 41.7 / 1.0 = 750.6

Now recognizing that 750.6 is the tgt. size to reticle subtension factor itself it can then be put into the calculator's memory to finish the ranging chart using a more usable system of reference--

750.6 / 2.5 (2.5 mil-dots) = 300
750.6/2.4= 310
2.3=325

etc. to as far as u want to go. The exact same system can be applied with a plex reticle if one wishes. The mil-ranging formula is not specific to the mil-dot reticle. Any reticle can be used with the "modified mil-ranging" formula once it's subtension is known with varying degrees of accuracy.

I always apply my reticles at the scope's highest power since the smaller the subtension the more accurate reticle-rangefinding becomes.
 
my leupold in varix-lll 6-24x shoots not quite 5" low at 300 yards.with the mueller it is the same.when i put the dot on it isnt consistent in any groupings at this distance.i just use the dot at nite and never beyond 150 yards i would say.i have no need for a big dollar nite scope that will only see the woods at best 50 times a year.
i think either way you will be spliting dots
 
Second and third opinion:

If you have target turrets on your scope and a good dope sheet, you can just dial in your bullet drop and hold on target. No ranging reticle needed.

Also, some of the varmint reticles also have wind drift markers that you don't get with mil-dots.

One way or the other, you'll want to learn how to use what you have to its fullest extent.
 
I have both on my 204's. A bushnell elite 4200 with mil-dots
and a leupy VXL long range varminter with the varminter reticle. I prefer the leupy varmint reticle over the mil-dot.
 


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