Quote:The breeze was blowing that direction, should be
I figured a 45/70 would buck the wind a little better than that.
I figured a 45/70 would buck the wind a little better than that.
Jetman is ready for bear,45/70 range work
- Thread starter jetman
- Start date
What ? you don't think you can load a 4570 to go that fast ?
It's not your grandpas trap door 45/70.
The Marlin can and does hold 43,000 cup with out a problem.
Off the Hodgdon sight A 300 gr bullet at starting load will do 2394 fps. Off the Barnes sight with aa1680 there speed shows 2609 ...I run mine up near the max out of a 26" barrel. I have checked it several times with more then one unit AND my Magnetospeed. All tells the same story.
Ever try it ???
Just saying check it your self...
It's not your grandpas trap door 45/70.
The Marlin can and does hold 43,000 cup with out a problem.
Off the Hodgdon sight A 300 gr bullet at starting load will do 2394 fps. Off the Barnes sight with aa1680 there speed shows 2609 ...I run mine up near the max out of a 26" barrel. I have checked it several times with more then one unit AND my Magnetospeed. All tells the same story.
Ever try it ???
Just saying check it your self...
Varminterror
New member
I'm missing the joke here fellas - 300grn pills in the 1895 45-70 at 2400fps with either of the 4198's is a published "Marlin Only" load out of 22" and 24" barrels, and he's shooting a 26" tube. Where's the danger? You work up from a starting load, watch for pressure signs, and behave yourself to stay under the published max pressure - if you push up to 40kcup, you can get a LOT of performance out of the 45-70 in the Marlin action.
The big 45-70 case and big bore tends to gain quite a bit of ground with extra barrel length. Heck, he's probably a half grain UNDER MAX getting 2400fps out of a 300grn pill in his Cowboy. The published data is touching that with 2" or 4" less barrel!!
Buffalo Bore even sells a 2355fps 300grn factory load as the "45-70 Magnum" for the Marlin 1895's.
The big 45-70 case and big bore tends to gain quite a bit of ground with extra barrel length. Heck, he's probably a half grain UNDER MAX getting 2400fps out of a 300grn pill in his Cowboy. The published data is touching that with 2" or 4" less barrel!!
Buffalo Bore even sells a 2355fps 300grn factory load as the "45-70 Magnum" for the Marlin 1895's.
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Varminterror
New member
Originally Posted By: Yellowhammer Quote:The breeze was blowing that direction, should be
I figured a 45/70 would buck the wind a little better than that.
Big, fat, slow bullets, man! Lots of ToF even to 200yrds.
But - in fairness - the 100yrd group placement is about the same as the 200yrd, shoulda drifted more than twice as far.
I figured a 45/70 would buck the wind a little better than that.
Big, fat, slow bullets, man! Lots of ToF even to 200yrds.
But - in fairness - the 100yrd group placement is about the same as the 200yrd, shoulda drifted more than twice as far.
GC
Well-known member
Jetman,
I will apologize, fundamentally I think you are pushing the pressure envelope to the redline, but it is your rifle and safety and you make the decisions regarding that. Most folks keep the .45-70 Marlin to somewhere between 35,000 - 40,000 c.u.p., you are loading higher to the .450 Marlin pressures. I get it, same gun should manage the same pressure level all other things equal. I won't argue the point, rock on. I am happy with my aperture sighted 1895 pushing 400 grainers at 1,800+ fps. If I want a flat shooter I choose a different cartridge but to each his own.
I will apologize, fundamentally I think you are pushing the pressure envelope to the redline, but it is your rifle and safety and you make the decisions regarding that. Most folks keep the .45-70 Marlin to somewhere between 35,000 - 40,000 c.u.p., you are loading higher to the .450 Marlin pressures. I get it, same gun should manage the same pressure level all other things equal. I won't argue the point, rock on. I am happy with my aperture sighted 1895 pushing 400 grainers at 1,800+ fps. If I want a flat shooter I choose a different cartridge but to each his own.
Winny Fan
New member
Originally Posted By: GCJetman,
I will apologize, fundamentally I think you are pushing the pressure envelope to the redline, but it is your rifle and safety and you make the decisions regarding that. Most folks keep the .45-70 Marlin to somewhere between 35,000 - 40,000 c.u.p., you are loading higher to the .450 Marlin pressures. I get it, same gun should manage the same pressure level all other things equal. I won't argue the point, rock on. I am happy with my aperture sighted 1895 pushing 400 grainers at 1,800+ fps. If I want a flat shooter I choose a different cartridge but to each his own.
Very well stated, GC. It hits the mark in all ways.
If you want more than the 45-70 will provide in any rifle, there are other better choices. The brass is always the wink link when excessive pressure becomes a constant. If the brass gives up the ghost, the rifle often times does the same.
I will apologize, fundamentally I think you are pushing the pressure envelope to the redline, but it is your rifle and safety and you make the decisions regarding that. Most folks keep the .45-70 Marlin to somewhere between 35,000 - 40,000 c.u.p., you are loading higher to the .450 Marlin pressures. I get it, same gun should manage the same pressure level all other things equal. I won't argue the point, rock on. I am happy with my aperture sighted 1895 pushing 400 grainers at 1,800+ fps. If I want a flat shooter I choose a different cartridge but to each his own.
Very well stated, GC. It hits the mark in all ways.
If you want more than the 45-70 will provide in any rifle, there are other better choices. The brass is always the wink link when excessive pressure becomes a constant. If the brass gives up the ghost, the rifle often times does the same.
The Jest of the post was suppose to have been about the rifle shooting high on the first shot.
I've shot 1000's of this round in the gun, have had it for years. I don't clean the rifle during the season so the barrel is always fouled . The first shot with a full magazine, fouled barrel, and cold will shoot 2 to 3 inches high. That's the money shot so I have to sight it to that . I was wondering if any one else had a similar condition? Pain in the but to sight it with a cold barrel, lots of wait around time.
I've shot 1000's of this round in the gun, have had it for years. I don't clean the rifle during the season so the barrel is always fouled . The first shot with a full magazine, fouled barrel, and cold will shoot 2 to 3 inches high. That's the money shot so I have to sight it to that . I was wondering if any one else had a similar condition? Pain in the but to sight it with a cold barrel, lots of wait around time.
Widow maker 223
Active member
Its probably nust a weird characteristic of that long barrel, it has to be wipling like a [beeep]. Does it hit high on a cold bore with slower loads?
calling4life
New member
I'm about to build a 26" 500s&w, I'm hoping to get 1700fps from the 700 grain t rex killers, ambitious, but I've read of 1550-1600 in a 22" handi rifle.
Should shoot doubletaps 400gr round about 2300-2400fps seeing as how they run a little over 2200 out of a 22" barrel.
There is also a 630gr super deep hollow point that's called grand canyon I will try.
Maybe we'll cross paths and we can show some coyotes what it feels like to get hit by a freight train.
Should shoot doubletaps 400gr round about 2300-2400fps seeing as how they run a little over 2200 out of a 22" barrel.
There is also a 630gr super deep hollow point that's called grand canyon I will try.
Maybe we'll cross paths and we can show some coyotes what it feels like to get hit by a freight train.
calling4life
New member
Oh, and my 1895 22" didn't have that issue, ran federal fusions through it and they shot very well.
Originally Posted By: Widow maker 223Its probably nust a weird characteristic of that long barrel, it has to be wipling like a [beeep]. Does it hit high on a cold bore with slower loads?
Don't remember
I only shot factory a few boxes many years ago
That makes no difference I will only be shooting my reloads
Don't remember
I only shot factory a few boxes many years ago
That makes no difference I will only be shooting my reloads
sweatybetty
New member
Originally Posted By: jetman I don't clean the rifle during the season so the barrel is always fouled .
ever try shooting with a clean barrel?
ever try shooting with a clean barrel?
Varminterror
New member
Originally Posted By: GCMost folks keep the .45-70 Marlin to somewhere between 35,000 - 40,000 c.u.p., you are loading higher to the .450 Marlin pressures.
We're saying the same thing, but not... 40kcup is safe in the 1895, well documented and supported by several reloading manuals. The 300grn pill at 2400fps with H4198 in a 26" 1895 is at, or slightly under 40kcup.
Hodgdon lists a 24" barrel 45-70 "levergun only" load of 60.0grn H4198 under a 300grn pill at 2,424fps at 40,000CUP. Easy 40-50fps faster for the 26" Cowboy, in my experience. They also have the 250grn pill at 2487fps load over 56.5grns H4198 at 38.7kpsi (recognizing that 40kcup = 40kpsi, per the 30carbine correlation). Add 50fps for barrel length and his 2600fps load isn't really unreasonable.
You said it yourself - 40k is safe, and he's loading to 40k. The fact that you're loading 400grn pills at 1800fps, coming in at 30k or less is "safer," but he's/we're still within the proven tolerance of 40k.
We're saying the same thing, but not... 40kcup is safe in the 1895, well documented and supported by several reloading manuals. The 300grn pill at 2400fps with H4198 in a 26" 1895 is at, or slightly under 40kcup.
Hodgdon lists a 24" barrel 45-70 "levergun only" load of 60.0grn H4198 under a 300grn pill at 2,424fps at 40,000CUP. Easy 40-50fps faster for the 26" Cowboy, in my experience. They also have the 250grn pill at 2487fps load over 56.5grns H4198 at 38.7kpsi (recognizing that 40kcup = 40kpsi, per the 30carbine correlation). Add 50fps for barrel length and his 2600fps load isn't really unreasonable.
You said it yourself - 40k is safe, and he's loading to 40k. The fact that you're loading 400grn pills at 1800fps, coming in at 30k or less is "safer," but he's/we're still within the proven tolerance of 40k.
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