Long range varmint & deer rifle?

I have a 17hmr and a 22 mag. I hunt ghogs out to about 200 yrds. As I get more permissions to hunt the farms around here (east central Pa) I can see the need to go more than 200 yrds.

Also, I would like to hunt coyotes, the deer thing came up when my friends shamed me into buying a doe tag so I could hunt with them quote "you'll be crying waa waa waa, when we're all out hunting doe and you're waiting for bulwinkle." It's burned into my memory.

Anyway, thank you all for the advise, I will re-look at the 243 and 6mm, and since my reloading fried may well be in Iraq next year, I'm going to forego the wssm and focus on the more traditional calibers. An older friend let me use his 243 about 40 years ago to hunt ghogs, I do have fond memories of that rifle. I have been out of hunting since and I am taking it up as "mature" adult.

thanks again for all the responses
 
The articles i read on the 325 were that it should have been a 338, b/c of the better bullet selection and the proven superiority that the 338 caliber has. I havent read what you did, so i cant comment on that, just what i have read. But if i was them i would have found a way to make it work.

Anyway, still say go with the -06! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif
 
As far as the WSM and WSSM calcalibers, not to mention the Rem SAUM calibers ... well the Cabela's in Fort Worth has a clearance rack for guns that don't sell, it's absolutely loaded with WSM, WSSM, SAUM caliber rifles.

If I bought one I'd consider it a wildcat, and plan on handloading every round I fired.
 
I would cast my vote for the .243. There is probably more different loads available for the .243 than any other Dual Purpose Cartridge (Varmint / Deer) out there. I have long been a .243 Fan and currently am restricted to .243 recoil due to health reasons.

I basically use 3 different loads in my Ruger .243, and these 3 loads cover everything I want to shoot in my home county from Gophers to Whitetail Deer. I use my .243 all year long and it is like an old friend to me when I shoulder it.

Larry
 
Welcome to the board 11 and you too 7RUM.

Since we seem to be in a healthy discussion here, I would like to share my experience/thoughts with the WSSM's as I have been shooting them from day one.

First the WSSM's. From what I have seen, there is no use for the .223 version since the 243 version will shoot 55gr bullets as well. 243 WSSM much more accurate than the .223 one. Feeding problems were early and mostly with the Winchester's. Browings that I shot had no problems at all. Barrels tend to heat up really fast, like 3 rounds and it was bad. A handloaded Swift will do anything a .223 WSSM will do and is much more accurate. I have a .223 WSSM wildcat that shoots really well but can't produce the vel of the claimed factory .223 WSSM 55gr stuff with it. It will run 40gr V-max's at 4600 with accuracy though.

243 WSSM would be the one to pick but would not recommend either one. Winchester has no guns for them anymore and don't know how long it will be before Browning phases them out as well. I am sure the ammo and rifles will be around for a long time but figure limited basis. Unless I reloaded would not even think of it. Std. 243 or 6mm will out shoot it and as with the 300 mag necks are short and you have to seat the bullets way deep into the case cutting useful powder room.

To each his own, but I just can't see a use for them. The WSM versions are not bad. Seem to be on par with normal rounds and recoil is about the same. I have .270 WSM that would only do 3" at 100 out of the box with factory ammo. After replacing the stock, working the trigger, and reloading it got down to about an 1" at 100.

It is hard to say on the deer/varmint round you are looking for. If you are gonna just use if for yotes and ground hogs for your varmints either the 25/06, 6mm, or 243 will work just fine. Any of the 3 will take deer. Colony varmints such as PD's would tax these rounds because of barrel heat and recoil. I would stay with one of them considering your use.
 
rowney,

the article is in RifleShooter Nov/Dec 2005.

Boddington wrote it and it's pretty good and explains why no 338 wsm.

For one, the velocities were slower than the 338 win mag (a little but 308 to 30-06 different)

For two, they (winchester) didn't want to compete directly against their own cartridge in an already small market.

I'm not saying its going to completely take over but it would have had a shot if winchester was still in business (and producing rifles like it did before the belt got tightened). I would think it would be a great rifle for the elk/deer combo hunts, African plains game, or Alaska.
 
Keep in mind that almost everything that is said about the .243 also applies to the 6mm Remington. Just in case the nicest one in the rack is a 6mm Remington. Advantages over each other selection of factory loads goes to .243 but advantages in reloading go to 6mm Remington. Have a nice day.
 
SteveM - What model rifle is your .270WSM? I'm planning on ordering a T3 lite in .270 WSM but have only heard good things. 90gr TNT's, 110 or 115gr. ?? V-maxes, 130gr to 150 gr. ballsitics that sound very impressive. Ryan
 
I think the 25 06 would be the best choice but....
As far as the 25 WSSM goes I do not believe they have chrome lined barrels. I recall reading on Winchesters and Browning's site that only the 223 and 243 WSSM have chrome lined barrels.
While the brass is thick on the WSSM cases it seals way before you get to overload territory.
Early feeding problems have been worked out and certainly not related to bullet seating length.
I have a custom 223 WSSM and have no problems getting 55's well over 3800 fps devoid of flattened primers or any pressure signs. Same goes for 75's at 3400+. Accuracy is superb and the equal of any .224 centerfire except perhaps the PPC and BR.
Most likely the WSSM's, particularly the 223, are doomed due to the rifles produced for them and people blaming the problem caused by such on the cartridge which is far from the truth. That would include hard bolt lift as well.
Carry on.
 
SUpermag, I will give you the fisrt, even though boddington seems to change his mind about every other issue. On the second, how do you explain the 270 and 300 wsm's? they are winchester rounds...Bigger market, but the 338 is a huge one as well, since the premeir elk round is the 338 win mag, if you got that in a light weight mountain rifle, that would sell better than anything but the 300, IMO

I think Steve has it right, good explanation from someone with a lot of trigger time behind these rounds
 
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rowney, both were Boddington's points. The 270 wsm wasn't designed to compete against the 270 win. As for the 300, I think it was a way to steal some thunder from Remington and the ultra mags (just a guess, but it worked). Remember the small % of people that hunt anything bigger than deer often, for many it's a once in a lifetime deal to elk hunt or go to Alaska. In the same article, Boddington said that the market for rifles drops dramatically after .30 cal.

Why buy a specialized caliber when the 300 win mag or 30-06 in the safe will do the job? Unless you are like many of us on this site and just want to have one.

To get back to the original question in this thread, I agree with you on the 25-06 for deer and varmints.
 
I am really enjoying this discussion!

It just seems to me that from what your telling me about the article, there are a lot of contradictions. But, I need to find it and read it first, and I am only questioning those points, not yours, dont want to come off like an a$$!

As for the 270 wsm, do you know what it was supposed to compete against? Everything i read on it compares it to the 270 win, and 270 weatherby, but thats not from winchester, its from magazines. I think the whole wsm idea was mis-marketed from the start, but thats another discusion all together.
 
This is fun.

I'm pretty sure it was supposed to go up against the weatherby but that's also from magazines. It would make sense as the 7mm wsm is against the 7mm Rem Mag, and the 300 wsm is against the 300 win mag.

What was their marketing campaign anyway? "We're short but almost as powerful and the big boys." The 243 wssm, 270 and 325 wsm at least are fairly unique and add something to the selection (how many darn 7mm's and 300's do we need?).
 
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