Now Help with a Caliber...30.06 or .308

K

Keystone

New member
I "think" I've decided on a new gun, the Ruger Hawkeye in Staineless / Synthetic.

Now, I can't decided what Caliber I want.

This is my criteria.

1) First, keep in mind I have a .223 / .243 / .270 and 7MM.08 at home in the safe. The .270 is my go to deer rifle but is being put aside for our coming children.

2) I want one rifle to handle anything. Although I have those other calibers, I shoot and use my .270 almost exclusively.

3) Gun will be used 95% of the time for PA deer and bear but I plan to take trips in the next few years. Elk, Moose, and maybe Caribou.

Keeping with the one rifle theme, should I get an 30.06 or .308?

Thanks
 
Most guys will tell you to go with the .308 because itis generally more accurate and is a more compact package. It also is close enough to the 06 for knockdown power. There are the advantages. I am nostalgic so I like the old 06 which recquires a longer action ahd does have more energy. There are your advantages and disadvantges. You make the choice.
 
The .308 is almost the same ballistically as the '06, but that "almost" might be a determining factor when hunting elk, caribou, etc. Though the '06 has taken probably more animals than any of them over the years, nowadays the magnum chamberings are more popular for the larger big game animals.

Most would probably consider the .308 to be on the light side for really large game, since they often won't shoot heavier than about 180gr bullets (or lighter) very well.
 
Keystone,
Are you hand loading? I went through this exact same debate 6 5 years ago when I was looking for a new deer and elk gun. After looking at the balistics of both, cost of both I went with the .308. You use on average 6-10 less grains I believe on every round using a .308. If you are buying factory they are alos cheaper in the .308 for the same reason. Also brass is cheaper for the .308.

Now beyond price the only advatage I see to the o6 is the foot pounds of power when it hits the animal. I have used the 150 grain bullets in the .308 for elk and deer for many years and it works fine. A lot of guys will tell you that is not enough. But it is plenty I have never losts either s deer or an elk. My father has been using a .308 for elk and deer for the past 38 or so years and he has never lost and elk either. I will mention to with the right practice a .308 is capable of taking even elk 500+ yards. I have seen my father do it and I have done it twice.

The reason I went with the .308 is because the 06 will cost more with no extra benifits really.

I might mention for a bear you will probably want to shoot the 180 or 200 grain bullet though.
 

I have both, and the 30-06 Sprg, sleeps in the safe, while
my two 308 Win's hunt. If the 30-06 wasn't a family
heirloom, it would be sold. Taking nothing away from
30-06 Sprg, I find the 308 Win is easier to find accurate
loads for, it kills very dead, with good bullets, and I like
the short action part, for weight, and action stiffness.
With a Barnes 168 gr. TSX, loaded on a stout powder charge,
I see nothing on your list, that the 308 Win will struggle
to kill. Well you might have to shoot that moose twice /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
But I once helped packed out an Alaskan moose, that an
ex-marine sniper needed 5 round from a 270 Win to kill. But
that is more about moose, than the rifle cartridge.

If I really wanted to step up on power, in the .308 caliber,
given my fondness for short actions, I would be carrying
a 300 WSM. As for the 30-06 Sprg, handling bullets over 180
grain better than the 308 Win, I agree. But with the
development of monolithic bullets, like the Barnes TSX,
bullets in the 165-180 grain provide the deep penetration
of the heavier tougher constructed bullets, of the past.

So put my vote on the 308 Win side.

Squeeze
 
The advantage with the 06 is when you start slinging bullets from 180 grains up. Up to that point their basically ballistic ally the same.

If your looking for a light rifle the 308 comes in lighter models such as the Remington model 7. Like one of the posters said most folks that are looking for a 30 caliber for elk and moose opt for a bigger bore or a magnum caliber.

There have been lots of elk and deer killed with both since the 308 was introduced. I have one of the carbines Remington brought out in in the model 7 and it's a dandy light rifle to carry in the woods and I don't feel uncomfortable with it when I'm hunting elk, but do prefer my old 8mm Rem mag for elk.
 
Quote:
I might mention for a bear you will probably want to shoot the 180 or 200 grain bullet though.



When shooting 180 or 200 gr. bullets, the 30-06 actually has quite an advantage over the .308 (which runs out of case capacity). If I were looking for a new rifle to do what you describe, I'd get a .300 Win. Mag.
I use a .308 for both deer and elk, but it's so brushy here that 200 yards is a "long shot", and it has plenty of power at that range for elk or black bear.
The only elk I ever saw get away after being hit with a .308 was a big bull that circled back into Yellowstone park on us. It wasn't going to survive long, from the blood trail. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif
 
Your 7mm08, 270, 308 and 3006 will all handle deer, bear, elk, moose and caribou if you place the bullet correctly. I've taken deer, elk and moose with the 3006 and feel comfortable with that choice.

That said, if I were buying a Hawkeye with elk and moose in mind, I'd buy a bigger caliber - 300 or 338 mag aren't too much. You've already got 2 guns that will handle everything else. I'd want a bigger jump in power.
 
Between the two, your choice is simple, .30-'06.

The 7mm-08 is so similar to .308, that you would be unneccesarily replicating a caliber already in your arsenal.

'06 will do it all.
 
I have both and use the 308. To me it is more accurate and more enjoyable to shoot. The 30-06 is probably more what you need for the larger animals that you mentioned, but only 5% of your hunts, so........... I would buy a Savage LE in 308. Oops, have I just talked myself into a new, unecessary rifle?
 
I have always read the '06 puts heavier bullets out faster than the 308, and it does, about 100fps. Not much!

I'm trying to get the info directly from Midway but the '06 data isn't coming up on mine tonight. It did before and Double Tap posts 2650fps with the same bullet.

When I run this in Point Blank software and the two come up so close it's not worth bothering. I have an '06 and an upcoming moose hunt in Sept of '09 and was looking at this ammo for the hunt.

Double Tap ammo at Midwayusa
Ballistics from the manufacturer:

100yds - 1.5" high 2428fps / 2618ft/lbs
200yds - zeroed 2310fps / 2370ft/lbs
300yds - 8.7" low 2196fps / 2141ft/lbs
400yds - 24.7" low 2084fps / 1928ft/lbs
500yds - 48.6" low 1975fps / 1732ft/lbs

Caliber : .308 Winchester
Bullet : 200gr Nosler Accubond
Ballistics : 2550fps - 2888 ft./lbs. - 22.0" bbl. Remigton 700
FN-FAL - 2500fps



Here is my Point Blank data

Load Data
~~~~~~~~~
Name: Double Tap ammo,
30-06 Cal, nosler accubond, 200 grn
Ballistic Coeff: 0.588
Bullet Weight: 200
Velocity: 2650
Target Distance: 200
Scope Height: 1.500
Temperature: 70
Altitude: 500

Ballistic Data
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

0 yds -1.50 in 2650 fps 3118 fpe
100 yds 2.01 in 2505 fps 2787 fpe
200 yds 0.00 in 2365 fps 2485 fpe
300 yds -8.31 in 2230 fps 2208 fpe
400 yds -23.63 in 2099 fps 1957 fpe
500 yds -46.69 in 1972 fps 1728 fpe


Based on what I read here, there is so little difference as not to matter. Now if you are running a 24 of 26" barrel on the '06 it might widen the gap, and I don't know if the 308 would earn as much extra FPS as the '06 would.

The 308 ammo is $2 cheaper on Midway.
 
I would go with the 308 over the 06. There is just not enough of a ballistic advantage in the 06 over the 308. That being said, if I had all of the rifles listed above I would jump up to a 300 wm for the elk deer and moose. The 300 wm would be a definate advantage over the calibers you already have. you don't want to have too much overlap or you won't know which rifle to grab when you go hunting. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Recoil from the 300wm would be the only disadvantage but its not substancially greater than the 06.
I own both a 308 win and a 300wm so Im speaking from experience with these rifles on elk and deer.
 
As stated above, you already own a 7mm-08, why get a cartridge so close to it as the .308 is? Not to knock the .308, it's a great round - but so is the '06. As Col. Townsend Whelen once said, "the .30-06 is never a mistake".

What the .308 will do with a 165/168 or 180 Barnes X or partition, the '06 will do a little better with the same bullet. Any accuracy improvements of the .308 over the '06 should hardly be noticable in actual hunting. Cost difference between the '06 and .308 will be less than between the magnums and the .308.

If the '06 just doesn't do it for ya, the .338 Federal (.338 on a .308 case), as mentioned above, is a good alternative, as is the .300 Short Mag or the .325 Win Short Mag. Don't see why you'd really need the full length magnums for normal distance hunting unless you want to either shoot long or use the 200 grain bullets. The mags will kick more and cost more than the '06 though, and you probably won't like doing much practice with them. And you can find '06 ammo from Fairbanks to probably Timbuktu.
 
I too would go for something a little more bigger. The 7-08 will do 95% of what the 308 will do. And do some of it better. Get a 35 Whelen to hammer elk/moose.....
 
Quote:
You already own the rifle you are looking for!
.270 Win!! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif



I can agree with that, the 7mm08 is also a good choice which you already have, I don't think the 7mm08 is enough different than the 308 or 30-06 to make it worth buying another rifle, here is an idea why not buy a new 338 federal, it will be a good bit different than the others. nonetheless it really just depends on bullet weights if you shoot bullets under 160 grns there is not a whole lot of difference between it and the 308, if you want stuff over 165grns the 06 will handle it better, the 308 will be on a short action which will be a slightly handier package, so would the 338 federal for that matter
 
Makes absolutely no difference with bullet weights less than 180grs. If truly big game is in its future I would pick the rifle that will handle a bullet made for them...
180-200grs. Leaves you with the -06.
 
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