I am befuddled by some post I see regarding parallax. The most common meaning is error due to the eye placement (inconsistent ).Sometimes the shooter will say that by adjusting the objective that it focuses the target better.Is it both ? I do not have good scopes and am considering this issue. If you are a serious coyote hunter and usually shoot under 300 yds do you need adjustable objective on a 4-12 x42 scope ? Lodgepole
Parallax for Dummies
- Thread starter Lodgepole
- Start date
when you mount your gun to look through the scope & there are no black edges around what your eye sees I think you will be all right. i have a real old weaver 6x it has a steel tube, brass rings as long as there is no black on the edges of the field of view I always hit what I shoot at. if there are black edges, not so much. an a.o. will sometimes clear up the f.o.v.
Any scope above 10X should have parallax adjustment.
As I understand parallax, it is this. The human eye/brain can only process one focal point at a time. So you really can't see the x-hair and the target clearly at the same time, unless they are focused to the same plane. Adjusting the parallax puts them at the same plane...Now, the corrections are not noticed as easily with lower power optics. That's why the higher power stuff needs AO or SF.
For 300 yards and in, a staight 6 or 2-7X or 3-9X should be plenty sufficient.
As I understand parallax, it is this. The human eye/brain can only process one focal point at a time. So you really can't see the x-hair and the target clearly at the same time, unless they are focused to the same plane. Adjusting the parallax puts them at the same plane...Now, the corrections are not noticed as easily with lower power optics. That's why the higher power stuff needs AO or SF.
For 300 yards and in, a staight 6 or 2-7X or 3-9X should be plenty sufficient.
Tim Neitzke
New member
Originally Posted By: old catwhen you mount your gun to look through the scope & there are no black edges around what your eye sees I think you will be all right. i have a real old weaver 6x it has a steel tube, brass rings as long as there is no black on the edges of the field of view I always hit what I shoot at. if there are black edges, not so much. an a.o. will sometimes clear up the f.o.v.
Not sure I understand this....
Not sure I understand this....
Cast
New member
Parallax error is looking at something that is relative to something else and not approaching it squarely. Think of an old Simpson 260 meter with a mirrored scale. The needle stands about a quarter inch from the scale so you have to be squared up to get an accurate reading. If you are not square you will see the needle reflection in the mirror.
A scope's crosshairs are relative to the target. To see the error in a scope, get the rifle on bags at the range so you don't have to hold it. Now look through the scope and move your head slightly left to right and up and down. The crosshairs will move on the target. Now slowly adjust the AO while testing for parallax error again. It will disappear with adjustment. AO will also help with focus at different ranges.
A scope's crosshairs are relative to the target. To see the error in a scope, get the rifle on bags at the range so you don't have to hold it. Now look through the scope and move your head slightly left to right and up and down. The crosshairs will move on the target. Now slowly adjust the AO while testing for parallax error again. It will disappear with adjustment. AO will also help with focus at different ranges.
NcWhitetail
New member
Lodgepole: If I recall correctly parallax of fixed power Leupold scopes for centerfire cartridges is factory set at 150yds. I leave mine set at 100yds but, most of my shots (95%) are under 200yds so its not going to matter enough to cause me to miss on a groudhog and larger game.
I haven't found a really GOOD, short, not too technical article on scope focus and parallax. These links might cause a little "information overload". But, they should help.
Remember this: Properly adjust your focus FIRST! Now, leave it alone!!! Unless... you get glasses, new glasses, or reach about age 40 when our eyes start to change.
Parallax matters. But, is not as important/critical for normal range hunters as it is for long range hunters and target shooters.
This may help.
Read this first: http://www.snipercountry.com/Articles/Parallax.asp#Parallax
Read this second. http://www.6mmbr.com/parallax.html
There's some good info here. http://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=496141
I haven't found a really GOOD, short, not too technical article on scope focus and parallax. These links might cause a little "information overload". But, they should help.
Remember this: Properly adjust your focus FIRST! Now, leave it alone!!! Unless... you get glasses, new glasses, or reach about age 40 when our eyes start to change.
Parallax matters. But, is not as important/critical for normal range hunters as it is for long range hunters and target shooters.
This may help.
Read this first: http://www.snipercountry.com/Articles/Parallax.asp#Parallax
Read this second. http://www.6mmbr.com/parallax.html
There's some good info here. http://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=496141
Whitetail,as I investigate this more it seems like a sweet stock fit would eliminate a good share of the issue. That is unless you are shooting from some very uncomfortable position in order to touch off a shot quick.Where I could see a advantage to AO scopes would be in load development so you could get most of the mistakes out and then if the shot was off IT WAS MY ERROR not the rifle. As most folks that hunt know the rifles and scopes shoot better than we can hold under normal hunting field conditions. Thank you Lodgepole Tally HO
Coyotehunter_
New member
Originally Posted By: LodgepoleWhitetail,as I investigate this more it seems like a sweet stock fit would eliminate a good share of the issue. That is unless you are shooting from some very uncomfortable position in order to touch off a shot quick.Where I could see a advantage to AO scopes would be in load development so you could get most of the mistakes out and then if the shot was off IT WAS MY ERROR not the rifle. As most folks that hunt know the rifles and scopes shoot better than we can hold under normal hunting field conditions. Thank you Lodgepole Tally HO
Exactly correct. If you put your cheek on the stock where it falls naturally and then build up the stock at that point so that your eye is exactly inline with the scope and the length of pull is set correctly then you have won half the battle in defeating parallax and a lot of other issues. In fact one should do this before even mounting the scope on the rifle.
while holding the gun and getting ready to bring it up into shooting position close your eyes and then put your cheek onto the gun's stock where it's most comfortable. Do this several times in a row and mark on the stock with tape where your cheek makes contact with the rifle stock. This is the point where you want the check weld to be and the comb to raise up to where your shooting eye is level with the scope tube. Then mount your scope on the rifle and position it so that you have good eye relief at this point. I've seen this performed several times by a Marine Sniper Instructor that works for the National Shooting Sports Foundation. he has a good video on how this is done. I'd like to get a new stock for my AR15 that has a way to adjust the comb and rise on the rifle stock for this purpose.
Exactly correct. If you put your cheek on the stock where it falls naturally and then build up the stock at that point so that your eye is exactly inline with the scope and the length of pull is set correctly then you have won half the battle in defeating parallax and a lot of other issues. In fact one should do this before even mounting the scope on the rifle.
while holding the gun and getting ready to bring it up into shooting position close your eyes and then put your cheek onto the gun's stock where it's most comfortable. Do this several times in a row and mark on the stock with tape where your cheek makes contact with the rifle stock. This is the point where you want the check weld to be and the comb to raise up to where your shooting eye is level with the scope tube. Then mount your scope on the rifle and position it so that you have good eye relief at this point. I've seen this performed several times by a Marine Sniper Instructor that works for the National Shooting Sports Foundation. he has a good video on how this is done. I'd like to get a new stock for my AR15 that has a way to adjust the comb and rise on the rifle stock for this purpose.
Varminterror
New member
I drew this several years ago. It's kinda hard to follow - basically, the shooter sees the black image, whereas the red is the real coyote. In the parallax MISS case, the shooter is actually on target, but because his eye is mis-positioned, he doesn't realize it (he can't see the red, he only sees the black), so he would shift until the crosshairs were centered on the black - causing him to move OFF of target, thinking he's moving ONTO it.
mbaysinger89
Active member
So would parallax be more or less difficult to deal with in a ffp scope?
Varminterror
New member
Actually - I just noticed - my diagram depicts an FFP, not an SFP.
Parallax is parallax, so both are vulnerable. The adjustment travel relative the angular deflection of the image is proportional regardless of which side of the inverter you're on, so it really depends upon the design quality of the scope.
Parallax is parallax, so both are vulnerable. The adjustment travel relative the angular deflection of the image is proportional regardless of which side of the inverter you're on, so it really depends upon the design quality of the scope.
Varminterror
New member
AO is slower than SF, but I've seen AO be more forgiving for lash than SF. For any SF scope, you need to run your adjustments only in one direction to ensure you hit the true target setting, so if you want to go from 100 to 200yrds, you need to turn the knob all the way out, then come backwards to 200. Then coming back to 100yrds, just turn it backwards from 200 to 100 - adjustment setting approached only from the outside direction. AO's seem, to me at least, to be less sensitive to lash, and easier to fine tune for focal plane unity (no parallax) - which makes sense, larger threads, larger "knob" to turn, with better granularity along the travel... So I'd tend to say AO's are easier to set for perfect focal unity, but either can be just as accurate. Oversized SF wheels are an option to improve the focal precision of SF models - even exceeding that of AO's.
I run both, like both. Prefer SF for hunting due to the speed, prefer AO on the bench for KFD shooting for the precision focus. Can use either in reverse roles. Managing parallax even at high magnification and long ranges in fixed parallax scopes isn't difficult either, but at the same time, it's not really something someone needs to tolerate since AO and SF scopes are out there.
I run both, like both. Prefer SF for hunting due to the speed, prefer AO on the bench for KFD shooting for the precision focus. Can use either in reverse roles. Managing parallax even at high magnification and long ranges in fixed parallax scopes isn't difficult either, but at the same time, it's not really something someone needs to tolerate since AO and SF scopes are out there.
Varminterror
New member
Guys have been shooting long range with fixed parallax scopes for a long time, so it IS manageable. But it doesn't come without a burden of practice.
With a "Fixie," draw your face a little out of ideal eye relief so you can see the black perimeter halo. If you hold the black halo even thickness around the rim, such that the crosshairs are centered, then you're not showing parallax. The human eye is supremely effective in detecting concentricity of circles, so a shooter paying attention to it can successfully center the crosshairs and eliminate parallax error in this way even though the crosshairs won't be in focus on the target image. It sacrifices a little size to your eye, and takes a little practice to acclimate - we're all taught the black rim is a bad thing - but it works very well.
With a "Fixie," draw your face a little out of ideal eye relief so you can see the black perimeter halo. If you hold the black halo even thickness around the rim, such that the crosshairs are centered, then you're not showing parallax. The human eye is supremely effective in detecting concentricity of circles, so a shooter paying attention to it can successfully center the crosshairs and eliminate parallax error in this way even though the crosshairs won't be in focus on the target image. It sacrifices a little size to your eye, and takes a little practice to acclimate - we're all taught the black rim is a bad thing - but it works very well.