Perplexing problem with thermal scope

Wabbit

Wabbit

New member
After several misses i spent the day at the range. What i determined is my POI changes when I change the magnification. I tested this 4 times from a bench and sandbagged. At 100 yard there is eight inches variations. Here's my results at 100 yds:

1x- high 3" right 3"
2x- 1" h 1"r
4x- 1" left 1"low
8x- 3" left 2" low

I was able to repeat these results each time. Has anyone else had similar experiences? I had adjusted the margins when i had it in front of a day scope but have since removed the day scope and use the thermal as a stand alone scope. i also tried resetting the factory default and there was no change in the results.
The scope is an Armasight apollo 640/512 30hz.
I would appreciate any advise or suggestions on how to fix this issue.

Thanks
 
Interesting. I've read about this on thermals, but can't remember the explanation as to why some do this. I can tell you on my Armasight Zeus, it did not do that. POI remains the same no matter the zoom level I'm at.
 
This is the response I received from FLIR, your thoughts on this?



That is normal function of the scope. There is nothing out of the ordinary operation. Just like a day time optic with a second focal plane your adjustments do change with your magnification. So if you are using it as a stand-alone optic you will have to adjust per your magnification or simply set a zero for a magnification under your rifle profile settings.



If you have any other questions or concerns please let me know.



Thank you,





Andrew Amongol

Director of Customer Service, Outdoor and Tactical Systems



FLIR Systems, Inc.

815 Dubuque Avenue, South San Francisco, CA 94080

Office/Fax: (650) 265-4279 | Toll Free: (888) 959-2259, ext #110

andrew.amongol@flir.com | www.flir.com
 
Now I feel Like I need to recheck mine............................ That just doesn't sound right to me.

I know dealing with cheap rifle scope, you will have this happen, but not on a quality scope.

If I was you I would join the Lonestarboars page, go to their night hunting section and ask this question. They have a handful of people of there who are very knowledgeable and will answer your question. Whenever I have a tech question with my thermal I go over to that page and they always respond.
 
I do not have an Apollo, but after you zero and save the zero x,y coordinates then the software automatically readjusts the reticle to take into account each different magnification change.

What magnification do the instructions say to first zero the scope on?
 
After two lengthy calls to Armasight, I finally understand. There are basically differences between a traditional day scope and digital thermal that I didn't realize. Yes the poi will shift because the reticle is not in the digital picture but imposed on it, that's why it doesn't get larger as you zoom. Because of this the picture changes while the reticle doesn't which results in the shift of poi. Beware all thermal are currently made this way, in the future this may be rectified. You must zero the scope on the magnification setting you plan to shoot on if you shoot beyond 100yds.
 
Originally Posted By: WabbitYou must zero the scope on the magnification setting you plan to shoot on if you shoot beyond 100yds.

This in incorrect. The POI point should not shift when zooming the scope. What would be the point of having a zoom function that is unusable except at one zoom setting?

IMO...You need to get in touch with someone there and see about getting your scope repaired.


 
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Interesting info, I can zoom my Zeus all over the place, and it seems to hit at all levels.....Not challenging what you were told, but I can hit a soda can at 200 yards with mine zoomed all the way in, and I sighted it in at 100 on the normal zoom level.

But - I feel now I need to re-check everything I thought I knew! ha.
 
None of my Flir RS64 or Flir Clip Ons do that, they all work at all magnifications.

Must be an Armasight software thing?
 
My ATN Thor is sighted in at 1" high at 100 yards, if my target is 100 yards and I zoom into 8X the POI remains the same.

Now if the target is 300 yards and I am at 8X my POI is going to be in the dirt well short of my target, just as a day scope the POI does not change once you go up in magnification.
 
I joined lonestarboars and asked the question, it set off a pretty good discussion, but the fact remains Armasight thermals are designed to allow shifting of the poi when zoomed according to the company. A secret that is not revealed. Evidently some scopes do not shift as much as others, so it's luck of the draw i guess.
 
I also had that issue with my FLIR RS32 35mm up until last year. I sat down and figured out what was goin on.
Found out how to do the software/firmware update on the thing and now it doesnt matter what zoom it is on it is dead on. We sat down one night with a MAP torch and a few AR500 targets out in the field from 100 to 500 yards and hammered away and it works like it is suppose to now.
 
Absolutely not the way thermal scopes should operate. I understand the analogy to a SFP day scope, but thermals are all digital. If the software designer takes the time to do the math correctly, zero should be consistent regardless of zoom. FLIR's RS line had that problem when it was initially released but it was quickly fixed with a SW update. And the thought of "luck of the draw" from any vendor would be enough to turn me away. If the designers didn't take the time to make zero consistent across zoom, I'd be wondering what other corners they cut too.
 


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