polishing a choke tube
- Thread starter tgc
- Start date
I wouldnt wast your time. The choke is finished like that for a reason. The roughness of the choke will help slow the wad down a fraction allowing the shot to pull away from the wad, resulting in a better pattern. Especially with a xx full. The shot needs to get away from the wad as quickly as possible or the wad could hit the shot string and interrupt the pattern. Some of your high dolor chokes are made the same way, and some even have little teeth or groves to accomplish the same thing. Shoot the choke at a pattern board and if you are not happy with the results, go ahead and try to polish. after all it is just a factory choke and really isn't very expensive. But like i said probably a wast of time. And you will be better off trying a different choke if you are not happy with the way it performs. Lee
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I wouldnt wast your time. The choke is finished like that for a reason. The roughness of the choke will help slow the wad down a fraction allowing the shot to pull away from the wad, resulting in a better pattern. Especially with a xx full. The shot needs to get away from the wad as quickly as possible or the wad could hit the shot string and interrupt the pattern. Some of your high dolor chokes are made the same way, and some even have little teeth or groves to accomplish the same thing. Shoot the choke at a pattern board and if you are not happy with the results, go ahead and try to polish. after all it is just a factory choke and really isn't very expensive. But like i said probably a wast of time. And you will be better off trying a different choke if you are not happy with the way it performs. Lee
The rough internal surface of the choke tube was probably more effective as a wad retarding mechanism when we shot the card and fiberwad type shotshell wads. At least that was the explanation I read once for it being rough.
With the one piece plastic wads now being used, I would suspect that you would quickly begin to get a plastic build up. And that can cause pattern problems if not cleaned out regularly. At least I saw that in a Pattern Master I once owned. The plastic built up in the tooling marks on the forcing cone side of the wad stripping lugs and I had to use a bore brush and solvent to get it out.
But, as the others have mentioned, either leave it alone, or go slow on the polishing. In doing some pattern testing and machining on factory Browning Invector Plus tubes, we found in shooting fast steel shot loads, that often we could see a difference in pattern performance (for the better or worse) with as little as .002 to .003" change in the choke ID when we were looking for the best long range patterns.
I wouldnt wast your time. The choke is finished like that for a reason. The roughness of the choke will help slow the wad down a fraction allowing the shot to pull away from the wad, resulting in a better pattern. Especially with a xx full. The shot needs to get away from the wad as quickly as possible or the wad could hit the shot string and interrupt the pattern. Some of your high dolor chokes are made the same way, and some even have little teeth or groves to accomplish the same thing. Shoot the choke at a pattern board and if you are not happy with the results, go ahead and try to polish. after all it is just a factory choke and really isn't very expensive. But like i said probably a wast of time. And you will be better off trying a different choke if you are not happy with the way it performs. Lee
The rough internal surface of the choke tube was probably more effective as a wad retarding mechanism when we shot the card and fiberwad type shotshell wads. At least that was the explanation I read once for it being rough.
With the one piece plastic wads now being used, I would suspect that you would quickly begin to get a plastic build up. And that can cause pattern problems if not cleaned out regularly. At least I saw that in a Pattern Master I once owned. The plastic built up in the tooling marks on the forcing cone side of the wad stripping lugs and I had to use a bore brush and solvent to get it out.
But, as the others have mentioned, either leave it alone, or go slow on the polishing. In doing some pattern testing and machining on factory Browning Invector Plus tubes, we found in shooting fast steel shot loads, that often we could see a difference in pattern performance (for the better or worse) with as little as .002 to .003" change in the choke ID when we were looking for the best long range patterns.
ColoradoOsprey
New member
Quote:
With the one piece plastic wads now being used, I would suspect that you would quickly begin to get a plastic build up. And that can cause pattern problems if not cleaned out regularly. At least I saw that in a Pattern Master I once owned. The plastic built up in the tooling marks on the forcing cone side of the wad stripping lugs and I had to use a bore brush and solvent to get it out.
Very true.
In fact I now use exclusively Titanium Nitride coated (Gold colored)choke tubes that are more "slippery" to keep the plastic from building up in the chokes with no deterioration in pattern as well as consistency when shooting hundreds of rounds in a short period of time. Plastic build up is even worse when the gun starts to get hot.
I'd say go ahead and polish that choke tube, but I think 180 grit is still too rough... I'd opt for 400-600. For a finish try Flitz metal polish inside the choke tube.
With the one piece plastic wads now being used, I would suspect that you would quickly begin to get a plastic build up. And that can cause pattern problems if not cleaned out regularly. At least I saw that in a Pattern Master I once owned. The plastic built up in the tooling marks on the forcing cone side of the wad stripping lugs and I had to use a bore brush and solvent to get it out.
Very true.
In fact I now use exclusively Titanium Nitride coated (Gold colored)choke tubes that are more "slippery" to keep the plastic from building up in the chokes with no deterioration in pattern as well as consistency when shooting hundreds of rounds in a short period of time. Plastic build up is even worse when the gun starts to get hot.
I'd say go ahead and polish that choke tube, but I think 180 grit is still too rough... I'd opt for 400-600. For a finish try Flitz metal polish inside the choke tube.
OldTurtle
Moderator - Deceased
I'd leave the choke tube alone... most of the manufacturers have their own reasons for letting them out in a specific condition..
If you want to get an improvement through polishing something, apply your efforts to the forcing cone at the front of the chamber.. Just go gently..The slicker/smoother, the better!
Don't put much effort into changing the angle of the cone unless you have the guidance of an experienced gunsmith that does that on a routine basis.
If you want to get an improvement through polishing something, apply your efforts to the forcing cone at the front of the chamber.. Just go gently..The slicker/smoother, the better!
Don't put much effort into changing the angle of the cone unless you have the guidance of an experienced gunsmith that does that on a routine basis.
Anyone telling you to slick your choke up is miss informed about how a choke works. Yes it will build up some plastic, but they all do. I all comes down to basic cleaning of your firearm. Anytime you can slow the wad down away from your shot column it is a plus. the plastic wads used today are a better quality than the old fiber wads and will hold together better at higher velocity and can be pushed into the shot string causing pattern interruptions. Experiment if you want, you wont be out much, but i shoot around 10,000 shells a year and coach students foe around another 10,000 shells a year and if i thought i would help, i would do it, and so would comp-n-choke Kicks, and the other major choke makers. This is just my educated experience. Lee
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I'd leave the choke tube alone... most of the manufacturers have their own reasons for letting them out in a specific condition..
If you want to get an improvement through polishing something, apply your efforts to the forcing cone at the front of the chamber.. Just go gently..The slicker/smoother, the better!
Don't put much effort into changing the angle of the cone unless you have the guidance of an experienced gunsmith that does that on a routine basis.
Polishing the forcing cone can really help cut down on plastic build up forward of it. The reamer marks act somewhat like the teeth of a file as the plastic wad goes over them. If you are using slower velocity loads, you may not see plastic build up very fast, but if you get above 1300 fps., a rough forcing cone can leave streaks of plastic for several inches down the bore. And, as it builds up, it becomes increasing hard to clean out without some special techniques or chemicals.
I made a forcing cone polisher with a 3/8" aluminum rod, notched at the end, the end of which I wrapped with a couple 0 steel wool pads, which I had unwrapped. I tied 1/4 sheet squares of emery cloth over the steel wood, which acted as a flexible backer going through the forcing cone and bore, and started with 320 grit emery cloth. I did one sheet of 320, 1 of 400 emery cloth, then 1 sheet of 500 wet or dry/Rem Oil bore lube, then 1 sheet of 600 grit wet or dry/Rem Oil. The paper will tear if the Rem oil wasn't used. The emery and wet or dry paper is tied over the steel wool sort of like a flag, and wrapped to tighten as the 1/2" drill used to rotate it is run.
The rod is run up and down the bore, concentrating in the area of the forcing cone first, when the grit is fresh. But, the movements are continuous from the breach to the muzzle and you don't stop at one spot ..... keep it moving, with more work done at the breach end that at the muzzle end. It won't hurt if there's a slight taper polished running from the breach to the muzzle, with the larger ID at the breach. Just don't enlarge the chamber by allowing the abrasive to dwell in there.
By the time I had finished, the forcing cone and bore shined like a new coin and it is much easier to clean, too.
The whole process took about 1/2 hour.
I'd leave the choke tube alone... most of the manufacturers have their own reasons for letting them out in a specific condition..
If you want to get an improvement through polishing something, apply your efforts to the forcing cone at the front of the chamber.. Just go gently..The slicker/smoother, the better!
Don't put much effort into changing the angle of the cone unless you have the guidance of an experienced gunsmith that does that on a routine basis.
Polishing the forcing cone can really help cut down on plastic build up forward of it. The reamer marks act somewhat like the teeth of a file as the plastic wad goes over them. If you are using slower velocity loads, you may not see plastic build up very fast, but if you get above 1300 fps., a rough forcing cone can leave streaks of plastic for several inches down the bore. And, as it builds up, it becomes increasing hard to clean out without some special techniques or chemicals.
I made a forcing cone polisher with a 3/8" aluminum rod, notched at the end, the end of which I wrapped with a couple 0 steel wool pads, which I had unwrapped. I tied 1/4 sheet squares of emery cloth over the steel wood, which acted as a flexible backer going through the forcing cone and bore, and started with 320 grit emery cloth. I did one sheet of 320, 1 of 400 emery cloth, then 1 sheet of 500 wet or dry/Rem Oil bore lube, then 1 sheet of 600 grit wet or dry/Rem Oil. The paper will tear if the Rem oil wasn't used. The emery and wet or dry paper is tied over the steel wool sort of like a flag, and wrapped to tighten as the 1/2" drill used to rotate it is run.
The rod is run up and down the bore, concentrating in the area of the forcing cone first, when the grit is fresh. But, the movements are continuous from the breach to the muzzle and you don't stop at one spot ..... keep it moving, with more work done at the breach end that at the muzzle end. It won't hurt if there's a slight taper polished running from the breach to the muzzle, with the larger ID at the breach. Just don't enlarge the chamber by allowing the abrasive to dwell in there.
By the time I had finished, the forcing cone and bore shined like a new coin and it is much easier to clean, too.
The whole process took about 1/2 hour.
GC
Well-known member
I'm surprised more high end guns don't hard chrome their bores like Benelli does. Good grief a Benelli barrel is easy to clean! The neighbor kid was talking about shooting a couple of rounds of Sporting Clays with his Remington 870 Express and having trouble getting it clean. He brought it over and it was probably the best imitation of the interior of what a sewer pipe must look like I'll ever come across. Dang that barrel was rough and the plastic and powder residue was stuck in the crevices of that bore so tight even the plastic melting sprays had a time with it. I ruined a bronze bristle bore brush. I realize that is an economical shotgun, but they really should try to do some finish work on the interior of the barrel! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smiliesmack.gif
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I'm surprised more high end guns don't hard chrome their bores like Benelli does. Good grief a Benelli barrel is easy to clean! The neighbor kid was talking about shooting a couple of rounds of Sporting Clays with his Remington 870 Express and having trouble getting it clean. He brought it over and it was probably the best imitation of the interior of what a sewer pipe must look like I'll ever come across. Dang that barrel was rough and the plastic and powder residue was stuck in the crevices of that bore so tight even the plastic melting sprays had a time with it. I ruined a bronze bristle bore brush. I realize that is an economical shotgun, but they really should try to do some finish work on the interior of the barrel! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smiliesmack.gif
I am not going to recommend it because of the health and safety issues if proper care isn't taken, but a friend of mine uses acetone on a bore brush to clean out plastic build up. He said it cuts right through the stuff.
But, if the kid doesn't polish his bore, or clean it regularly, it will continue to build up. Brownells, used to sell a couple of "bore hones", which had small abrasive balls on a rod, which was lubed with a special oil so as not to dissolve the adhesive holding the abrasives in the ball borm. They made them in medium and fine grit, as I recall. They were easy to use, but a bit expensive.
Here it is.
http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/store/P...%20FLEX%20HONE~
I have more time than money, so I use the method described above. LOL
I'm surprised more high end guns don't hard chrome their bores like Benelli does. Good grief a Benelli barrel is easy to clean! The neighbor kid was talking about shooting a couple of rounds of Sporting Clays with his Remington 870 Express and having trouble getting it clean. He brought it over and it was probably the best imitation of the interior of what a sewer pipe must look like I'll ever come across. Dang that barrel was rough and the plastic and powder residue was stuck in the crevices of that bore so tight even the plastic melting sprays had a time with it. I ruined a bronze bristle bore brush. I realize that is an economical shotgun, but they really should try to do some finish work on the interior of the barrel! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smiliesmack.gif
I am not going to recommend it because of the health and safety issues if proper care isn't taken, but a friend of mine uses acetone on a bore brush to clean out plastic build up. He said it cuts right through the stuff.
But, if the kid doesn't polish his bore, or clean it regularly, it will continue to build up. Brownells, used to sell a couple of "bore hones", which had small abrasive balls on a rod, which was lubed with a special oil so as not to dissolve the adhesive holding the abrasives in the ball borm. They made them in medium and fine grit, as I recall. They were easy to use, but a bit expensive.
Here it is.
http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/store/P...%20FLEX%20HONE~
I have more time than money, so I use the method described above. LOL
If you want to do any kind of an upgrade to a shotgun barrel the forcing cone is where the work needs to be done. I do two things to every tournament grade shotgun i own. First i have release triggers installed, second i have the forcing cone relieved. CDR and GC have it right on this one. I however do not get my forcing cones relieved just because of a plastic build up issue. actually I never even thought about that much. What it does do, is improve your shot patterns and also help a little on recoil. Even magnum shot will distort in shape as it is blasted through a forcing cone, resulting in oblong shape shot that will not fly true. The recoil benefit comes from a smother transition through the forcing cone, = less resistance, less deformed shot= better patterns, or at least more uniform patterns. As far as plastic build up, It is unavoidable because when a round is fired the heat of the blast will make the plastic weak resulting in plastic being deposited. The only thing I have found to help in this area is a better plastic wad, they are not all the same by far. Downrange makes an excellent wad that leaves very little plastic. Wads like claybuster are a good wad but they are not made out of virgin plastic and are a little soft. Thats a hole other story. soft wads dont protect your shot as it travels down the barrel as well as a wad like Downrange makes. They are a lot stiffer. Anyway i could go on and on. Again just my educated experience. I have tried them all and shoot a bunch of 12ga shells every year, in practice and competition. And i do feel that having the forcing cone relieved is well worth the money!
You know, I have never really thought about it till now. It is sort of funny that shotgunners back bore their shotgun to slow the acceleration of the shot/wad into the the engaged part of the barrel. Then ammunition makers come along and develop nice flanged wads to seal the gap created by the shotgunners.
John
John
pcammo
I am not sure i follow what you are saying. Please explain it a little more. What wad are you refurring to? Back boring doesnt do so much for performance as far as i am concerned. The older Beretta Mobile choke guns generally will have a tighter core on a patterning board as compared to a Browning with inv+ chokes. The beretta will have a bore around .725-.728 and the browning will be closer to .750. Kolar and Kreighoff still use the the tighter bore on there shotguns. My Kolar sporting had .725 top and bottom. I think that folks who open up there entire bore just have more money than they know what to do with. And you are right pcammo. the bigger the bore the more gas that escapes around the wad resaulting in slower velocity. I have heard some of my students say that back boring helps with recoil. And they are right! But so would an 1oz load running 1100fps. Lee
I am not sure i follow what you are saying. Please explain it a little more. What wad are you refurring to? Back boring doesnt do so much for performance as far as i am concerned. The older Beretta Mobile choke guns generally will have a tighter core on a patterning board as compared to a Browning with inv+ chokes. The beretta will have a bore around .725-.728 and the browning will be closer to .750. Kolar and Kreighoff still use the the tighter bore on there shotguns. My Kolar sporting had .725 top and bottom. I think that folks who open up there entire bore just have more money than they know what to do with. And you are right pcammo. the bigger the bore the more gas that escapes around the wad resaulting in slower velocity. I have heard some of my students say that back boring helps with recoil. And they are right! But so would an 1oz load running 1100fps. Lee
In the Brownings in particular for high velocity loads we now use wads like the X10X, X12X and some of the new imported GBP wads to get the velocity back up to where it should be. I will never understand why Browning used such an over sized tube in their pump 10ga. I guess maybe it helps with recoil....
John
John