Pulsar XQ38 vs Super Hogster

alf

alf

Well-known member
I'd like a head to head breakdown between the Pulsar Thermion 2 XQ38 vs the Super Hogster.

Looking at getting either of these two thermals. I've read & compared the specs, read reviews, & watched videos etc till I'm blue in the face.

Like to hear real world comparisons of those with experience and/or opinions.

Thanks....
 
I had a thermion xq38 (not the 2 version)and I have used my cousins super holster a couple times. Both very nice scopes. Thermion had a significantly bigger field of view if I remember correctly. Super hogster had a significantly better image, especially in higher humidity. The thermion took a little more tweaking with contrast and focus to get its best image. I believe the thermion was heavier but had better eye relief for a bolt gun. I sold my thermion. Not for any terrible reason just thought that there would be better stuff coming out. Turns out I was right (for once). They released the thermion 2 for the same price, one week after I sold mine. Basically the super hogster had too tight of a field of view for where I hunt and I wasn’t really impressed with the thermion for the money. I haven’t heard if the 2 version blows the older model away or if it’s just a little better. I still haven’t replaced it yet. Probably just gonna go with a 35 but waiting to hear the details on this super yoter.
 
Since you know the specs, I won’t list them. The Super Hogster is going to be closer to the XQ50 as far as FOV. I haven't owned a Pulsar since the original Trail and Helion. Here is what I say are the pros and cons:

Pulsar Thermion 2:
[*]Records Video and Audio[*]Wider FOV[*]Zoom and PIP can be incrementally adjusted[*]Work on more guns due to traditional shape of scope[*]More known brand[*]More customizable image[*]History of good customer service[/list]
Super Hogster
[*]Smaller and Lighter[*]Better warranty[*]Better image in high humidity (at least compared to older models)[*]Less expensive[*]Higher base magnification[*]No proprietary batteries[*]Requires less image adjustment[*]Fewer model changes and longer service potential[/list]
A few additional comments on my list. Pulsar is known for their customer service. However, they tend to replace a lot of thermals vs fix. This is ok while the unit is in warranty but can be problematic. With how soon they move from models, the question is what happens with a model once out of production. Bering services their entire line up of thermals and should be able to service into the foreseeable future.

For those that want to run any of the Hogsters on a bolt gun, you can get an extended riser, and push it as far back as needed. The cheek weld may be impacted but that can be remedied on most configurations.

Both are solid choices. To me if FOV or audio recording is a key requirement, then go with Pulsar. If small, lightweight, better warranty is more important, go with Super Hogster.
 
Originally Posted By: ToroI had a thermion xq38 (not the 2 version)and I have used my cousins super holster a couple times. Both very nice scopes. Thermion had a significantly bigger field of view if I remember correctly. Super hogster had a significantly better image, especially in higher humidity. The thermion took a little more tweaking with contrast and focus to get its best image. I believe the thermion was heavier but had better eye relief for a bolt gun. I sold my thermion. Not for any terrible reason just thought that there would be better stuff coming out. Turns out I was right (for once). They released the thermion 2 for the same price, one week after I sold mine. Basically the super hogster had too tight of a field of view for where I hunt and I wasn’t really impressed with the thermion for the money. I haven’t heard if the 2 version blows the older model away or if it’s just a little better. I still haven’t replaced it yet. Probably just gonna go with a 35 but waiting to hear the details on this super yoter.

Thanks.....

Be interesting to have a head to head comparison of the old Thermion versus the 2 from someone.

According to the stats, the 2 has almost a half inch more eye relief, 40 vs 50mm.

The 2 weighs 26.5 ozs, which I assume is with both batteries? The SH is 17.1 oz, no mount or battery.

I have a bud that bought the 2 last year who hunts with a guy that has the 35 Hoster, not the SH. Both agree that the 2 beats the regular 35. Too far for me, unfortunately to have a looksee in person.
 
Originally Posted By: KirschSince you know the specs, I won’t list them. The Super Hogster is going to be closer to the XQ50 as far as FOV. I haven't owned a Pulsar since the original Trail and Helion. Here is what I say are the pros and cons:

Pulsar Thermion 2:
[*]Records Video and Audio[*]Wider FOV[*]Zoom and PIP can be incrementally adjusted[*]Work on more guns due to traditional shape of scope[*]More known brand[*]More customizable image[*]History of good customer service[/list]
Super Hogster
[*]Smaller and Lighter[*]Better warranty[*]Better image in high humidity (at least compared to older models)[*]Less expensive[*]Higher base magnification[*]No proprietary batteries[*]Requires less image adjustment[*]Fewer model changes and longer service potential[/list]
A few additional comments on my list. Pulsar is known for their customer service. However, they tend to replace a lot of thermals vs fix. This is ok while the unit is in warranty but can be problematic. With how soon they move from models, the question is what happens with a model once out of production. Bering services their entire line up of thermals and should be able to service into the foreseeable future.

For those that want to run any of the Hogsters on a bolt gun, you can get an extended riser, and push it as far back as needed. The cheek weld may be impacted but that can be remedied on most configurations.

Both are solid choices. To me if FOV or audio recording is a key requirement, then go with Pulsar. If small, lightweight, better warranty is more important, go with Super Hogster.
Thanks....

It is a bit discerning that Pulsar changes models like underwear. Sad to buy a scope that's discontinued in a year in regards to resale value. Of course warranty is a consideration, but if that was the main issue, I guess maybe a guy should look at Iray with their 5 year backing. Their new Bolt model has my interest too, but in reading your post about the China connection, makes you rethink things.

Which bring me to the biggest appeal of the Pulsar, the conventional mounting aspect. With most thermals having 4-5 zero options, I would like the option of running it on both an AR and a bolt gun. I was hoping I could use standard 30mm picatinny rings on the bolt gun, then move it to the AR with a separate 3/4" riser on top to bolt to. I did this previously when I borrowed a higher powered scope off my varmint gun for load work on the AR. Worked perfect for that, but will that be possible with the SH?
 
As long as both guns have a Picatinny rail, the answer is probably. The same thing with the 30mm rings, they should be set up as some type of QD mount for the Thermion to work as well. The nice thing about the traditional shape of the Thermion is it pushes the scope far enough back so it works well on lots of traditional bolt guns.

As for the Super Hogster, there are a few options. You can try to get an extended picatinny base on your bolt gun. If it extends back far enough past your action, you should be fine. Many people will mount Hogsters and Super Hogsters on the last 1 or 2 rail slots. I have found that any mount even LaRue and Bobro, if the scope is attached with just a partial piece of rail after enough recoil, you start to get POI shift. So I recommend an extended rail of some kind so you get the entire mounting surface on rail.

The new mount on the Super Yoter is even more susceptible to this than the traditional Super Hogster mount, so I am going to try something different, and this would work on the Super Hogster as well. I hear some complaints many thermals including Hogsters can tend to sit a little low on many ARs. Many people like to shoot more head's up. So, I am currently testing a LaRue Tactical Picatinny Riser. This would provide two things. It would allow me to get the scope much further back on my bolt action guns, and also raise the scope on my ARs for better comfort. The only potential issue is if you don't have an adjustable check piece on your bolt action guns, it might sit too high for a good cheek weld. You could add a cheek riser on your bolt if that is the issue.

I hope to test the return to zero of this LaRue mount combination tomorrow. This would allow me to move the entire assembly from gun to gun and not even remove the scope. If I wanted to remove it to use as a scanner, I still could, but I am hopeful this will work well.

LaRue_mount.jpg


Bering also has 3 different mounts that extend the mount further back. These are available by special order, but they are not QD style mounts. I would recommend going with the LaRue and have the QD ability.
 
After posting the last picture, I have received some questions and comments on PM so I thought I would share the answers with the group.

What are those clips on the Picatinny Rail? Those are LaRue index clips. I have them on the rail of all my guns. They serve 4 purposes. First, they help you know what rail slot to remount your scope. Second, they help manage your cables as there are special clips to hold your cables. Third, they help take the sharpness away from your rail, so it is more comfortable to grab your rifle as well as you aren't touching bare metal in the extreme cold. Fourth it protects the rail itself and could add some color or contrast to the gun. They are really inexpensive and available on LaRue's Website or on Amazon. If you are only buying the clips, it is cheaper to buy it from Amazon with free shipping. If you are buying something else from LaRue, get them from LaRue.

I ran out of all black, and will be using the riser on a tan build and a black build, so used multiple color index clips on my mount. You can see on the 2nd picture below some of the cable management clips keeping the power cable tight against the rail.

How far back is the LOP (Length of Pull) on your bolt chassis? My current rig is 13". I could probably go back another 2" if I needed to with the LaRue riser. I have included 2 pictures with it mounted on the gun. Bolt guns do look a little funny with a thermal optic sitting this far back and so high, but with it set like this, I can interchange it between my AR and bolt, perfectly.

larue_mount2.jpg


larue_mount3.jpg


Does the LaRue Tactical Picatinny Riser LT101 return to zero? I tested it this morning. I removed the entire assembly and remounted it 3 times and saw no change to my zero. This should allow a person to swap between guns or potentially swap between a daytime optic and thermal with no change to POI. After my test, I feel confident mounting it and going coyote hunting without checking my zero. This is not an official endorsement from Bering Optics or Night Goggles just my experiences on one of my coyote hunting guns.

Could the riser help retain my POI? The Bering Optics thermals have been extremely reliable for holding POI. However, in the case where a thermal is mounted on a gun where it is mounted on one of the final rail slots, yes, I believe this would help. This will give your optic a lot more rail to hold to. I have found when mounting any thermal too far back, thermals tend to tilt slightly back (especially under recoil) making the POI begin to shift down.
 
I wonder if I would need a cheek attachment to put that rig on a savage axis II. I gotta say it kinda seems like a lot to go through to put it on the gun I want. I noticed you said the yoter mount was more susceptible that hogster mounts. Does the yoter not come back as far with the stock mount?
 
Originally Posted By: ToroI wonder if I would need a cheek attachment to put that rig on a savage axis II. I gotta say it kinda seems like a lot to go through to put it on the gun I want. It is the same amount of work for any thermal besides the Thermion, ATN Thor 4, or the iRay Bolt as they are all the more standard glass scope design. For a night rig, I prefer a chassis system on a bolt action gun as this allows you to put on battery packs, lasers, LRFs, or whatever additional night vision equipment you may need. On top of this, you can add an ARCA-Swiss plate on the bottom for connecting to tripods, etc. To answer your original question, if you used a riser like this, yes I assume you would need some type of cheek adjustment. If you can potentially get a rail that bolts directly to the top of the gun without a riser, then you may be OK.

On the flip side, how well does a glass scope work if you want to use it as a hand-held scanner, not very well. They all have their advantages and disadvantages. You can always go with a thermal with a longer traditional glass-scope design.

Originally Posted By: ToroI noticed you said the yoter mount was more susceptible that hogster mounts. Does the yoter not come back as far with the stock mount? Bering went to a name-brand manufacturer (hopefully to be announced soon) for the mount for the Super Yoter. This mount doesn't have a rail-lug or rail-post like most. It actually uses the front of the base as the rail-lug. It makes the mount very secure on the rail which I really like. This design did a great job of returning to zero, but I noticed early on if the mount wasn't entirely supported by the rail, my POI would shift on recoil. I knew a lot of bolt action users run their Hogsters way back, so I started looking for a potential solution.

The Yoter comes back as far but due to the design of the base, the Bering Optics Tactical QD mount was able to mount further back to the edge of a rail and maintain POI/zero. The Super Yoter mount just needs a little more rail is what I am saying.
 
Kirsh you are a true wealth of knowledge. Hate to hijack a thread but gave me some good ideas on getting my super hogster positioned right on my begara.
 
Originally Posted By: KirschAs long as both guns have a Picatinny rail, the answer is probably. The same thing with the 30mm rings, they should be set up as some type of QD mount for the Thermion to work as well. The nice thing about the traditional shape of the Thermion is it pushes the scope far enough back so it works well on lots of traditional bolt guns.

As for the Super Hogster, there are a few options. You can try to get an extended picatinny base on your bolt gun. If it extends back far enough past your action, you should be fine. Many people will mount Hogsters and Super Hogsters on the last 1 or 2 rail slots. I have found that any mount even LaRue and Bobro, if the scope is attached with just a partial piece of rail after enough recoil, you start to get POI shift. So I recommend an extended rail of some kind so you get the entire mounting surface on rail.

The new mount on the Super Yoter is even more susceptible to this than the traditional Super Hogster mount, so I am going to try something different, and this would work on the Super Hogster as well. I hear some complaints many thermals including Hogsters can tend to sit a little low on many ARs. Many people like to shoot more head's up. So, I am currently testing a LaRue Tactical Picatinny Riser. This would provide two things. It would allow me to get the scope much further back on my bolt action guns, and also raise the scope on my ARs for better comfort. The only potential issue is if you don't have an adjustable check piece on your bolt action guns, it might sit too high for a good cheek weld. You could add a cheek riser on your bolt if that is the issue.

I hope to test the return to zero of this LaRue mount combination tomorrow. This would allow me to move the entire assembly from gun to gun and not even remove the scope. If I wanted to remove it to use as a scanner, I still could, but I am hopeful this will work well.

LaRue_mount.jpg


Bering also has 3 different mounts that extend the mount further back. These are available by special order, but they are not QD style mounts. I would recommend going with the LaRue and have the QD ability.
Most of my varmint guns (700's) have Seekins picatinny rails, and I have 2-3 extra on the shelf, so I'm set there.

I also have a couple extra sets of Seekins 3omm high rings too. While they aren't QR style, it's no biggie to remove & replace on another gun. I would assume their RTZ will be as good as any QR style. My biggest question is if I can mount the Thermion (or BOLT) with the Seekins parts & not resort to an extended rail of some sort.

The 3/4" riser I have on the AR should let me switch the scope between guns w/o resorting to an adjustable cheek piece.(hopefully)

That LaRue riser mount looks like the cat's azz.



 
Originally Posted By: TFIKirsh you are a true wealth of knowledge.
Absolutely


Originally Posted By: TFIHate to hijack a thread but gave me some good ideas on getting my super hogster positioned right on my begara.
Not a hijack at all. Fits right in with why I started the thread with the comparison of the two thermals.
 
Alf, I had my thermion on my savage axis ii and I had no problem at all with eye relief. I believe you’re gonna need high mounts for the bell to clear the barrel. The focus on the bell needs clearance to move. Especially if you put a throw lever ring of some sort around the bell. The focus was not super easy to adjust with one hand while the gun was shouldered without the lever.
 
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Originally Posted By: ToroAlf, I had my thermion on my savage axis ii and I had no problem at all with eye relief. I believe you’re gonna need high mounts for the bell to clear the barrel. The focus on the bell needs clearance to move. Especially if you put a throw lever ring of some sort around the bell. The focus was not super easy to adjust with one hand while the gun was shouldered without the lever.
Thanks....

For reference, I can run a 40MOA Seekins rail, with Seekins high rings, and a Nightforce 5.5-22x50, and have clearance with a Heavy Varmint contour, which is quite a bit bigger than a Remington Varmint contour. Should be fine if I go with the Thermion.

Still stuck in a quandary. Be nice to get some feedback on the new 2 version.
 
Originally Posted By: ToroListing my cousins super hogster in classifieds. Perfect condition. Used approximately 10 times. 3k
What's cousin moving to?
 
Thermion 2 xq50. Unless he can hold on to his money till kirsch comes out with these yoter videos. LOL in all seriousness he wants the thermion cause of bolt gun. Yoter videos may fix him though. Personally I don’t know if the 50 fits where we hunt fov wise but different strokes for different folks.
 
Kirsch, clarification question on your mounts.....

So you are using the picatinny that came with the chassis, bolted to the action.

Then using the QR Larue extended picatinny attached to that.

Then you're still using factory quick release mount that's bolted to the Hogsters?
 
Originally Posted By: ToroThermion 2 xq50. Unless he can hold on to his money till kirsch comes out with these yoter videos. Video, specs, and review will post on Monday.
 
larue_mount3.jpg
Originally Posted By: alfKirsch, clarification question on your mounts..... So you are using the picatinny that came with the chassis, bolted to the action. On the picture I included yes. Some chassis include and some do not. I am building another bolt gun and using a Magpul Pro Chassis. That chassis doesn't include a picatinny mount for the action, so I bought an EGW Picatinny Rail Scope Mount.

Originally Posted By: alfThen using the QR Larue extended picatinny attached to that.Yes, it allows the user to get the scope elevated on the AR allowing for more of a head's up style shooting. It also allows me to get the scope further back on my bolt guns. The biggest concern can be the check weld on traditional style bolt guns. If doing something like this, most people would require an adjustable stock, riser, pad, etc to get a higher cheek weld.

You can always try to get some type of extended action mount, but they can get in the way of the bolt when cycling. Many people will simply attach the scope to the last 1-2 rail slots. For any optic to hold zero when only grabbing a part of the rail, it will be hard for it retain zero. The Super Hogster mount did a better job of holding to a partial rail than the new mount included with the Super Yoter. The Super Yoter mount is very good, but just needs more rail.

This is not the only option as there are lots of extended riser options. However, this was a way that allowed me to solve two problems at one time, and so far looks very promising.

Originally Posted By: alfThen you're still using factory quick release mount that's bolted to the Hogsters? Yes, I am using it to initially get it secured to the riser. When I am set up with this riser system, I personally am moving the entire riser and scope from rig to rig, so I am not disconnecting the scope. Both the QD mount of the Bering Optics as well as the LaRue QD mount are all supposed to be return to zero. By moving it all as one unit, I am decreasing the chances of potential shifts.

Could I disconnect the scope from the riser, the answer is yes if I wanted to use it as a scanner, I could. I could also leave the riser on the bolt gun and detach the scope from the riser via the scope QD mount and put it directly on my AR, so there are lots of options.

I brought this up in this conversation thread because the topic was brought up about putting the scopes on a bolt-action and AR. This is how I plan to do it, so just passing it along.
 


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