Question about open reed calls?????

msinc

New member
I don't want to upset anyone on here, I know these calls get the job done, but to me making a coyote howl on an open reed call sounds like your trying to do it with a duck call...it just don't sound right to me. I know what I hear doesn't matter, but I always thought coyotes could hear better than humans.
My questions are, are we using open reed calls mainly because they wont freeze in the cold locations they are being used but still work good enough???? Is there another type call that sounds or howls more realistic and without that quacky open reed duck call noise???? What is the most realistic sounding howler made???? Thanks in advance for any info!!!!
 
Latex of any kind is most realistic..a purpose built mylar (open reed) howler, if a guy knows how to use it, is extremly effective as well. For decades, people have just howled with thier own voice...which is how "howling" for coyotes really started.
Mylar sort of came first, and open reed predator calls actually evolved from duck call design...mylar has been around for decades, is relativly versatile, can make a lot of different pitches and sounds on one call, tough, etc., so thats why you see it a lot. Latex has been around in predator calls for roughly 20 or so years, way before that for turkey and goose calls, and has gained a lot of favor for its realism and versatility.
You will never get the tones that you associate with real coyotes out of mylar, or at least almost never. I have heard a couple guys make a mylar howler sing...but latex matches those sounds almost perfectly, with less effort. I will tell you though, there are pros and cons to both...in the end they are just tools, and I think a guy should learn to use them all.

I will say though that whatever call you end up with(and guys usually try a bunch of different kinds..which is the fun part if you like calls)you should learn how to use it...know every inch of it...learn to work on them, tune and replace reeds, hand jive to change sound, tricks, mouth/tooth position on reed , mouth call position, air presentation etc. I really think people make the mistake of thinking a call is going to do the calling for you, but you have to learn how to really manipulate the thing to get the best results. Putting emotion, cadence, varying the pitches etc. all play into it...not just the raw noise it makes when you blow into it...regardless of material or call type. Get out there and play with em, make all kinds of crazy racket, get used to the call, dont get caught up in trying to make "perfect" or uber realistic sounds right off the bat...I really think this is what discourages most people from handcalling, along with calls that maybe arent that great, or just simply dont fit the callers style in some way.



If you are getting a raspy duck quack out of your open reed predator call...you are not even close to using it correctly.
Mark

 
If you own an open reed howler from one of the custom call makers on this forum, and it sounds like a duck to you when you try to howl on it, I respectfully suggest you don't know how to use it properly. Sounds like you might be holding the mouthpiece too straight into your mouth. There are instructional posts available and some dvd's that cover the basics which should help you. Watch a guy like Randy Anderson, how he positions the howler, etc., and you should get the idea.
 
Thanks for all the info fellas...somehow, "sounds like you are trying to do it with a duck call" got misconstrued into "sounds like a duck"...not the same thing. Maybe a better way of saying what I mean would be if I say the real thing, or one of the high end electronic callers howling would be FM stereo sound on a Kenwood or Sony receiver...an open reed mouth call howling would be likened to a 30's era AM radio. There is a difference, and I was just wondering if there was some type of howler that could be mouth blown and sound more like an electronic call.
Again, I get that you cannot argue with success...the open reed howlers have been working just fine for a long time. With all due respect even Randy Anderson, on any call I have ever watched him use, sounds quacky. It's more of a high pitched AM radio "buzz" than a FM stereo howl. Maybe think of that vibrating reed vs. the whistle of air being blown across a bottle...that vibration is not there. Then again, it must not make much difference to coyotes!!! Thanks again.
 
msinc, if you think Randy Anderson sounds "Quacky", I doubt that anybody is going to please you with a hand held, mouth blown howler. I have no trouble getting coyotes to respond and I am positive that guys like J. D. and Randy are better than me. I am more concerned at how coyotes react to my howling than what it sounds like to me. So far, I have had no problems in that area.
 
Yep, open reeds dont have the tone, they have a high pitched, "siren" type sound. Sort of a "one layer" sound. Latex howlers have the rich, layered, smooth tones your looking for. Diapragms are even better in the right hands, better barks etc than say a Power Howler.

I understand what you mean by "quacky buzz" now..depending on the howler and how you blow it, you can either get it or not. Its mostly technique imo. Its a buzzy, mostly "flat" sound. See it all the time, and thats the way most guys demo howlers.

Some guys use lips to contact the reed, and others use thier teeth (or tooth). Using your lips, and just puffing your cheeks and blowing half-azzed air into the call will make a flat, buzzy howl. If you are a lip caller like that, roll your lips over your teeth, and blow from your diapragm, and put some real air into the call, vary your air pressure up or down etc. and put some emotion into it. having your lips rolled over your teeth lets you put more pressure on the reed. If you are a tooth caller, your going to get a sharper sound out of the reed, with none of the "flat buzz", by keeping tooth pressure on the reed. It keeps the reed under pressure, not letting it vibrate as much. You get the sharper, higher pitched sounds that way. Kinda hard to explain I guess?

Personally, I put some voice into my howls, I kind of bark or growl with my voice a bit as Im blowing into the call. Just a habit I picked up long ago.

What I hate seeing people do on a open reed howler is barks...almost nobody can do em nowdays...everyone just blows a short burst of air into the call, with the "puffy cheek" technique, and it actually does almost "quack" or just "buzz". Thats not how you do it. A lot of howlers, you cannot even get a proper sharp bark on em...and especially if your using a small open reed distress call like a lot of guys do. The techniques above will help with that.

Most open reed howlers either have a square slot air channel (Critter Call Magnum) or a round air channel (Dan Thompsen Red Desert). The square style is able to get more pitches and variations, but sometimes needs to be pretty wide and deep to get good raspy barks. They are generally the easiest to blow, simply because of aerodynamics, they pick up air faster. The round style generally is a bit more tricky to control, but you can get good deep raspy barks on them if you put a tooth on the reed, press down on it and put a short burst of air into the call, then let off the reed real quick. Timing is everything there, but imo that technique gives the best barks. Same technique on the square style, but for me, I like the round style better for that. Reed thickness counts as well.

If I was going to go out and buy a production howler right now, Id buy the new Foxpro howler that has the open reed and the Power Howler type mouth piece that is interchangable. I think it also comes with a diapragm too.


This is all jmo.
Mark

EDIT..sorry for the rambling lol.
 
Originally Posted By: LONEHOWLIf I was going to go out and buy a production howler right now, Id buy the new Foxpro howler that has the open reed and the Power Howler type mouth piece that is interchangable. I think it also comes with a diapragm too.
And that is coming from a guy that makes his own calls.

This is all jmo.
Mark

EDIT..sorry for the rambling lol.



You'd buy a plastic howler? Has the world gone mad????
scared.gif
 
Coyotes don't all howl just alike. Most experienced coyote hunters know that many times, they thought a big male was sounding off, only to find out later it was a younger female. I always like to use two different howlers, coupled up with the ecaller 50 to 75 yards away, giving a realistic scenario.
 
Originally Posted By: possumalCoyotes don't all howl just alike. Most experienced coyote hunters know that many times, they thought a big male was sounding off, only to find out later it was a younger female. I always like to use two different howlers, coupled up with the ecaller 50 to 75 yards away, giving a realistic scenario.

Yep,I've had them hang up when in a challenge howl match with the ecall.I shut the call down and whip out the horn so they think the coyote has moved back.....BANG.
 
Quacking on an open-reeder is more often about lack of ability from the guy running it.

Guys running diaphragm howlers can sound just as bad if the caller doesn't know how to run it. Not really "quacky," but definitely a horrific sound.
 
Most of the guys I have run across who can't operate an open reed howler have a tendency to look like somebody blowing up a balloon. A lot of people can't bring it up from their diaphragm or add any voice to it. Guys like J. D. sound good on various howlers.
 
"Guys running diaphragm howlers can sound just as bad if the caller doesn't know how to run it. Not really "quacky," but definitely a horrific sound."

Exactly right.


Mark
 
Originally Posted By: LONEHOWLYep, open reeds dont have the tone, they have a high pitched, "siren" type sound. Sort of a "one layer" sound. Latex howlers have the rich, layered, smooth tones your looking for. Diapragms are even better in the right hands, better barks etc than say a Power Howler.

I understand what you mean by "quacky buzz" now..depending on the howler and how you blow it, you can either get it or not. Its mostly technique imo. Its a buzzy, mostly "flat" sound. See it all the time, and thats the way most guys demo howlers.

Some guys use lips to contact the reed, and others use thier teeth (or tooth). Using your lips, and just puffing your cheeks and blowing half-azzed air into the call will make a flat, buzzy howl. If you are a lip caller like that, roll your lips over your teeth, and blow from your diapragm, and put some real air into the call, vary your air pressure up or down etc. and put some emotion into it. having your lips rolled over your teeth lets you put more pressure on the reed. If you are a tooth caller, your going to get a sharper sound out of the reed, with none of the "flat buzz", by keeping tooth pressure on the reed. It keeps the reed under pressure, not letting it vibrate as much. You get the sharper, higher pitched sounds that way. Kinda hard to explain I guess?

Personally, I put some voice into my howls, I kind of bark or growl with my voice a bit as Im blowing into the call. Just a habit I picked up long ago.

What I hate seeing people do on a open reed howler is barks...almost nobody can do em nowdays...everyone just blows a short burst of air into the call, with the "puffy cheek" technique, and it actually does almost "quack" or just "buzz". Thats not how you do it. A lot of howlers, you cannot even get a proper sharp bark on em...and especially if your using a small open reed distress call like a lot of guys do. The techniques above will help with that.

Most open reed howlers either have a square slot air channel (Critter Call Magnum) or a round air channel (Dan Thompsen Red Desert). The square style is able to get more pitches and variations, but sometimes needs to be pretty wide and deep to get good raspy barks. They are generally the easiest to blow, simply because of aerodynamics, they pick up air faster. The round style generally is a bit more tricky to control, but you can get good deep raspy barks on them if you put a tooth on the reed, press down on it and put a short burst of air into the call, then let off the reed real quick. Timing is everything there, but imo that technique gives the best barks. Same technique on the square style, but for me, I like the round style better for that. Reed thickness counts as well.

If I was going to go out and buy a production howler right now, Id buy the new Foxpro howler that has the open reed and the Power Howler type mouth piece that is interchangable. I think it also comes with a diapragm too.


This is all jmo.
Mark

EDIT..sorry for the rambling lol.


This is a very informative post that a lot of us can learn from, so I say ramble on any time!!!! Thanks for the info...what do we have to do to convince you to make a few youtube videos about technique????
I get what you are saying, and probably one of the most frustrating things about calling with any kind of mouth call is trying to describe what exactly the guy using it is doing. It's not like you can just take a video of what is going on because that part is all covered...but it can help a lot for most guys if they can hear the sound. At least the student caller has a sound that's correct as a target to try and copy.
I really like hand calls, there is just something about calling up an animal with a mouth call. It could be compared to the difference between killing a deer at 300 yards with a benchrest accurate rifle {electronic call} and hitting one at 15 yards with a recurve, watching him run another 50 yards and fall over...I guess either way he's dead, but it just isn't the same for me.
I totally get the technique thing...and I also believe that technique is the most important thing with any call. Nothing makes the sounds for geese like a tube call, nothing gobbles perfectly like a Haint. Even a simple duck call, easy as they are to learn, can be messed up by "laughing" into the call. Thanks again!!!!
 
Exactly, I have always had better responses when I switched up something, location, sound anything. I guess it adds more realism to the situation, but like technique on the caller it has to also be done right.
 


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