Red LED lights – reflector vs. aspheric – which is best for spotting?

C

choclabs

New member
I am new to nighttime coyote hunting using lights, here is what I wish to learn from the more experienced nighttime coyote hunters.

I have researched a lot of different LED lights for use as aids to nighttime coyote hunting. I have bought 2 different red LED lights, one is a reflector based light and one is an aspheric designed light. Here is the difference for those who do not know. A reflector light is as name implies a LED at the back of a shiny reflector cone that the light is focused through and is the most common. The reflector light also emits a dual type of light stream in that there is a bright circular inner glow and a less bright outer glow, kind of like a halo. The aspheric light has a thick lens that focuses the light from the LED and maintains almost 100% of the light in a concentrated contained beam. The aspheric lens contains the LED energy in a tight beam very much similar to the brighter inner beam of a reflector style light, with absolutely no halo effect.

I only recently received both lights and the large moon phase has prevented me from getting a really good field test situation to compare each light against the other.

Preliminary results point towards the aspheric producing a much more intense and focused beam at a longer distance than the inner beam of the reflector light. I believe that across the flat rice fields where I hunt in SW Louisiana, that the aspheric will provide the ability to ID a coyote as far off as 300-400 yards. It is my initial belief that the reflector will allow for the ID of a coyote out to 200-300 yards. I know that is not a very precise description but as previously mentioned, the ambient light sources are pretty bright right now. I plan to perform additional testing in darker settings with known targets at known distances in the future.

Here are my questions for you seasoned coyote hunters. I have been advised that when shining for coyotes that it is best to keep the halo portion of the light in their eyes so as to not blind them and have them stop coming in. Now it is also my belief that this technique was most valid when hi-powered, bright, non LED, white reflector style lights were the best technology available.

What I am seeking is to find out if you experienced hunters who have been afield with the new red LED lights have halted coyotes from approaching by blinding them with the brighter inner focus of the reflector style lights?

Also of more interest to me is have any of you who have been afield with the aspheric style red LED lights had coyotes stall out while hitting them with the beams?

The reason I ask is that I already know that the aspheric style red LED light will make a VERY good kill light when mounted to the scope. But what I am really looking for is information that will support my intention to use the aspheric style red LED light for a spotting light as well.

I have purposefully left manufacturers names unidentified as this is not meant to be a product endorsement.

However if manufacturer identification is allowed by the moderators I would be glad to provide this information.

Regards -
Michael
 
Originally Posted By: choclabs Now it is also my belief that this technique was most valid when hi-powered, bright, non LED, white reflector style lights were the best technology available.


That's an incorrect assumption. The opposite is true. The old school belief that coyotes don't see red light is a bunch of malarkey. Read the latest (or next to latest) issue of Predator Xtreme, an article entitled "Get the Red Out." This might also be beneficial:

Dog Vision

My success rate soared when I quit using red filters 3 years ago.
 
Originally Posted By: KizmoOriginally Posted By: choclabs Now it is also my belief that this technique was most valid when hi-powered, bright, non LED, white reflector style lights were the best technology available.


That's an incorrect assumption. The opposite is true. The old school belief that coyotes don't see red light is a bunch of malarkey. Read the latest (or next to latest) issue of Predator Xtreme, an article entitled "Get the Red Out." This might also be beneficial:

Dog Vision

My success rate soared when I quit using red filters 3 years ago.

not sure i get your point. the link you posted supports the fact that dogs do not see the red/green spectrum. they do see the light, i don't think anyone will argue that, they just see it in a different hue than humans. please explain further.
 
That's just the Carnivore guys opinion on white vs red.....

Good link though,I like the "dog vision" converter.....


coloured-leds_zps631899a6.jpg

coloured-leds-DogVision_zpsa4446811.jpg
 
Originally Posted By: kevind43
not sure i get your point. the link you posted supports the fact that dogs do not see the red/green spectrum. they do see the light, i don't think anyone will argue that, they just see it in a different hue than humans. please explain further.

Let me state up front that I used red lights for 30 years, other than the short times I experimented with green ones. I only started using white lights 3 years ago. Just because I used red lights for so long doesn't mean I can't admit I was wrong.

Lots of people subscribe to the dogma that red lights don't spook coyotes. I can't tell you how many times I have read or heard someone say that coyotes don't see red light. That's just a load of old-fashioned hogwash. It's akin to the old timers that tell you to yelp 3 times and put the call down when you're turkey hunting. If any of the mythical properties of red lights were remotely true, I'd have my whole house covered in pelts wall to wall and from floor to ceiling.

Personally, under certain night hunting circumstances (hunting with a centerfire around livestock, in populated areas, etc.), I believe that the use of a red light is borderline irresponsible. I hear people talking all the time about how far this or that red light can ID game or illuminate enough for a shot at an animal. What about what's on the other side of that animal in case you miss? We have a Hunter of the Year nominee who shot his FoxPro using, you guessed it, a red light. There's nothing magical about a red light, other than the fact that you can't see as well with it at any given intensity as you can with a white light, yet many people still proceed under the unquestioned assumption assumption that you have to have a red light to hunt at night. Nothing wrong with them for scanning, I suppose, but when you pull the trigger, you need to be able to see as well as possible.
 
Originally Posted By: ultramagThat's just the Carnivore guys opinion on white vs red.....

Good link though,I like the "dog vision" converter.....


coloured-leds_zps631899a6.jpg

coloured-leds-DogVision_zpsa4446811.jpg





Wish someone had a speaking dog that could back all these claims up, it would help us all.lol.
 
Originally Posted By: KizmoOriginally Posted By: choclabs Now it is also my belief that this technique was most valid when hi-powered, bright, non LED, white reflector style lights were the best technology available.


That's an incorrect assumption. The opposite is true. The old school belief that coyotes don't see red light is a bunch of malarkey. Read the latest (or next to latest) issue of Predator Xtreme, an article entitled "Get the Red Out." This might also be beneficial:

Dog Vision

My success rate soared when I quit using red filters 3 years ago.


Not trying to start any conflict.But how has the change to white made your success sore?
Was there more changes or just the light?
What red light were you using?
 
I still lean towards red.Scanning with red and shooting with white is like getting up to take a leak in the middle of the night and flipping the bathroom light on.....
 
Originally Posted By: ultramagMy hunting partner uses one,he blinds me atleast once at every set.

You need to hunt with me, lol.
 
Ever watch a dog chase a RED laser pointer? If they couldn't see the light they wouldn't chase it.

It's not the color it's the sudden change in light intensity that spooks a coyote. Give their eyes a chance to adjust as you bring the light up and hold it steady. That is the problem with a laser type of light. It's all or nothing and then if your not steady that compounds the effect.

I've hunted with white LED's since they first came. Before switching to night vision last year.
 
Kizmo,

I agree with all that you have said and totally respect your 30 plus years of hunting with lights. I especially get the SAFETY factor issue and the long range ballistics capability of our weapons. I hunt our farm which currently has about 100 mother cows with young ones popping out over the next few months. I totally get the white kill light is the safest way to go.

But what you do not seem to have experience with is the latest generation of aspheric lens equiped red LED lights. As per what Pa. Mick posted there is "Big difference between old red lights and new red LEDs.". A properly tuned aspheric lens light is by far the brightest most concentrated red LED light design on the market. And I have what is currently estimated to be the brightest currently available, perhaps only out shinned by one other brand.

This thread is not intended to go towards W vs. R vs. G in spotting use, but again some good information shared based on experience. What I was trying to ask is would a new generation red LED aspheric designed light burn the coyote eys so much that he would halt his progress?

I have yet to light up a coyote with my aspheric lens red LED light which is rated at "29Kcd ANSI beam distance 344 meters". I did come across a raccoon last night and the aspheric kill light did burn his eyes badly versus the reflector light.

There is one basic FACT about using red LEDs, they are much less blinding to the human eye in relation to keeping our night vision sensitive.

Out of respect to some of our Sponsors, I have so far chosen to not specifiy brand names. Send me a PM if you wish to learn more about what I am using.

Here are 2 articles in the digitized original editions of Predator Xtreme written by Dr. Charles Shawley which discusees the coyote eye structure and light gathering capability.

Part 1 http://www.predatorxtreme-digital.com/200810/october2008#&pageSet=40
Part 2 http://www.predatorxtreme-digital.com/200812/december2008#&pageSet=31

Part 3 was written by someone else and is more of a camo comparison article.
Part 3 http://www.predatorxtreme-digital.com/200902/february2009#&pageSet=42

Here is the webpage which hosts many of the digitized original versions of Predator Xtreme amagazine - http://www.predatorxtreme-digital.com/issues

With respect to all who are sharing their experience, THANKS!

Regards - Michael
 
Originally Posted By: family guyEver watch a dog chase a RED laser pointer? If they couldn't see the light they wouldn't chase it.



Ever watch a coyote chase a RED laser pointer?
 
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