Originally Posted By: calling4lifeIs your point best proven at a distance???
In theory, yes. If your 100 yd groups open up by 1 MOA, then your 400 yd groups will also open up. When I said my accuracy decreased, I was talking about going from 3/4 -1 MOA to 1-2 MOA at 100 yds. Sometimes more, sometimes less. It was just enough that I could notice the difference. Mostly in random fliers that opened up the groups. IMO it is not the pressure on the barrel that necessarily hurts accuracy, it is the INCONSISTENT pressure that affects accuracy. Having a barrel that rubs part of the time and free floats other times will tend to show inconsistent grouping vs a barrel that is always free floated or always rubbing.
Originally Posted By: calling4lifeI would hate to take a rifle that shot like that and mess it up, the whole idea of " I have to fix it until it's broke."
This why you shoot the gun before you decide to work on it. If you buy the gun and you are happy with the accuracy, then don't change a thing. If my 700 would have shot 1/2 MOA out of the box I probably wouldn't have done a thing to it. But I wasn't happy with 1-1.5 MOA. Like most shooters, I'm obsessed with getting the most out of my rifles. I wanted more!
I knew the gun could do better and changing the stock seemed like a reasonable means to gain accuracy. You don't have to buy a $700 McMillan or Manners. I sold my Hogue for $70 and bought a B&C for $155. To me it was worth the $85 investment. I still only have around $650 invested in the rifle.
Originally Posted By: calling4lifeYou talked about "cranking down" on a bi pod or putting an exorbitant amount of forward pressure on the stock showing the change in accuracy, but what makes you do that, I just want to hunt with it, not see if it shoots well with my buddy standing on the barrel.
Perhaps I should have worded my response better. I just meant that when the gun was on the table the barrel was free floating. When I put a bi-pod on, laid in prone position with a little forward pressure on the stock, the barrel was rubbing the stock. I usually shoot prone with a rear bag and like to apply forward pressure to the rifle to "lock" my body and rifle into place. No particular reason, just works for me I guess.
My observations of the stock were just that, my observations. Your shooting style and experiences may be different. But from what I've read, I'm not the only one that has experienced this.
Originally Posted By: calling4lifeMy point may have been made a bit facetiously, but the point is still there, is a touching stock on a sub 1/2 moa $500 rifle a good enough reason for the average hunter to be changing things??? A stock and having it installed will dang near run you the cost of the gun.
Absolutely not! If your stock rifle will shoot 1/2 MOA then I wouldn't change a thing. Refer to my above response regarding stocks. You don't have to spend a ton of money on a stock. Many people have seen great results with B&C and HS Precision stocks. It is an easy change that you can do at home. Unbolt one, bolt on another. I haven't even bedded mine yet. That is a little more permanent experiment that I haven't quite committed to yet. As far as the Remington being a 1/2 MOA shooter out of the box. Keep in mind, that the previously mentioned review was most likely shot by an individual that is a better shot than most, with match grade ammo. Will you be using match grade ammo all the time? I bet if he used run of the mill hunting ammo his average group size would not have been .466. Also, the groups he shows are all .3's but his average is 1/2 MOA. Must have shot a few 3/4 MOA groups to average things out.
I'm not good at typing sarcasm/humor, so I apologize if any part of my response seems harsh. I'm just trying to be helpful.
I don't think you will be disappointing in the SPS. My opinions aside, I've rarely read a bad review on these rifles.
In theory, yes. If your 100 yd groups open up by 1 MOA, then your 400 yd groups will also open up. When I said my accuracy decreased, I was talking about going from 3/4 -1 MOA to 1-2 MOA at 100 yds. Sometimes more, sometimes less. It was just enough that I could notice the difference. Mostly in random fliers that opened up the groups. IMO it is not the pressure on the barrel that necessarily hurts accuracy, it is the INCONSISTENT pressure that affects accuracy. Having a barrel that rubs part of the time and free floats other times will tend to show inconsistent grouping vs a barrel that is always free floated or always rubbing.
Originally Posted By: calling4lifeI would hate to take a rifle that shot like that and mess it up, the whole idea of " I have to fix it until it's broke."
This why you shoot the gun before you decide to work on it. If you buy the gun and you are happy with the accuracy, then don't change a thing. If my 700 would have shot 1/2 MOA out of the box I probably wouldn't have done a thing to it. But I wasn't happy with 1-1.5 MOA. Like most shooters, I'm obsessed with getting the most out of my rifles. I wanted more!
Originally Posted By: calling4lifeYou talked about "cranking down" on a bi pod or putting an exorbitant amount of forward pressure on the stock showing the change in accuracy, but what makes you do that, I just want to hunt with it, not see if it shoots well with my buddy standing on the barrel.
Perhaps I should have worded my response better. I just meant that when the gun was on the table the barrel was free floating. When I put a bi-pod on, laid in prone position with a little forward pressure on the stock, the barrel was rubbing the stock. I usually shoot prone with a rear bag and like to apply forward pressure to the rifle to "lock" my body and rifle into place. No particular reason, just works for me I guess.
Originally Posted By: calling4lifeMy point may have been made a bit facetiously, but the point is still there, is a touching stock on a sub 1/2 moa $500 rifle a good enough reason for the average hunter to be changing things??? A stock and having it installed will dang near run you the cost of the gun.
Absolutely not! If your stock rifle will shoot 1/2 MOA then I wouldn't change a thing. Refer to my above response regarding stocks. You don't have to spend a ton of money on a stock. Many people have seen great results with B&C and HS Precision stocks. It is an easy change that you can do at home. Unbolt one, bolt on another. I haven't even bedded mine yet. That is a little more permanent experiment that I haven't quite committed to yet. As far as the Remington being a 1/2 MOA shooter out of the box. Keep in mind, that the previously mentioned review was most likely shot by an individual that is a better shot than most, with match grade ammo. Will you be using match grade ammo all the time? I bet if he used run of the mill hunting ammo his average group size would not have been .466. Also, the groups he shows are all .3's but his average is 1/2 MOA. Must have shot a few 3/4 MOA groups to average things out.
I'm not good at typing sarcasm/humor, so I apologize if any part of my response seems harsh. I'm just trying to be helpful.
Last edited:
