NcWhitetail
New member
http://www.the33tv.com/about/station/newsteam/kdaf-texas-hunters-can-now-use-silencers-on-their-firearms-20120428,0,5122184.story
Suppressors now legal in Texas
- Thread starter NcWhitetail
- Start date
Just for clarification, I hope you MEAN "suppressors" and not the word "silencers" that you wrote. As far as I know, "Silencers" are still a violation of federal law unless you have license issued by BTAF and they are very hesitant to issue licenses for those little darlings. In several states nowadays, "suppressors" are perfectly legal and sell like hotcates.
ninehorses
New member
You still have to have your BATF stamp, Texas just made it legal to hunt game animals during the seasons with them.
CatShooter
New member
Originally Posted By: ShynlocoJust for clarification, I hope you MEAN "suppressors" and not the word "silencers" that you wrote. As far as I know, "Silencers" are still a violation of federal law unless you have license issued by BTAF and they are very hesitant to issue licenses for those little darlings. In several states nowadays, "suppressors" are perfectly legal and sell like hotcates.
They are both the same thing - there are no "silencers", that is a movie name.
The very best suppressors reduce the sound levels ~32db - that is enough to save your hearing, but not to silence the firearm.
The ATF is NOT "... very hesitant to issue licenses for those little darlings."
It is automatic - if you live in a suppressor legal state, and you have a clean background (and $200) you get the suppressor.
If your local LE chief refuses to sign the ATF forms (like mine did
), then you set up a "Revocable Trust"... but one way or another, you get the suppressor.
And from reports from the ATF, the ATF is issuing tax stamps for "cans" at a faster rate than ever before - many firearms companies are now selling new, over the counter rifles and pistols threaded for a suppressor, right out of the box.
Savage even has three of it's .22 rimfires threaded, and the new Ruger 22 pistol is threaded.
I bought one of the Savage 64 TRR-SR rifles - it came threaded (with a thread protector) a Picatinny rail, and ready to go - it now has a can and a starlight scope on it (the ultimate "Cat Riffle
)
Then I had a Stainless Ruger MK-I target pistol, and a Remington 40X rimfire target rifle threaded, so the can will fit on all three.
Most fun you can have with your clothes on
.
They are both the same thing - there are no "silencers", that is a movie name.
The very best suppressors reduce the sound levels ~32db - that is enough to save your hearing, but not to silence the firearm.
The ATF is NOT "... very hesitant to issue licenses for those little darlings."
It is automatic - if you live in a suppressor legal state, and you have a clean background (and $200) you get the suppressor.
If your local LE chief refuses to sign the ATF forms (like mine did
And from reports from the ATF, the ATF is issuing tax stamps for "cans" at a faster rate than ever before - many firearms companies are now selling new, over the counter rifles and pistols threaded for a suppressor, right out of the box.
Savage even has three of it's .22 rimfires threaded, and the new Ruger 22 pistol is threaded.
I bought one of the Savage 64 TRR-SR rifles - it came threaded (with a thread protector) a Picatinny rail, and ready to go - it now has a can and a starlight scope on it (the ultimate "Cat Riffle
Then I had a Stainless Ruger MK-I target pistol, and a Remington 40X rimfire target rifle threaded, so the can will fit on all three.
Most fun you can have with your clothes on
.
Originally Posted By: CatShooterOriginally Posted By: ShynlocoJust for clarification, I hope you MEAN "suppressors" and not the word "silencers" that you wrote. As far as I know, "Silencers" are still a violation of federal law unless you have license issued by BTAF and they are very hesitant to issue licenses for those little darlings. In several states nowadays, "suppressors" are perfectly legal and sell like hotcates.
They are both the same thing - there are no "silencers", that is a movie name.
The very best suppressors reduce the sound levels ~32db - that is enough to save your hearing, but not to silence the firearm.
The ATF is NOT "... very hesitant to issue licenses for those little darlings."
It is automatic - if you live in a suppressor legal state, and you have a clean background (and $200) you get the suppressor.
If your local LE chief refuses to sign the ATF forms (like mine did
), then you set up a "Revocable Trust"... but one way or another, you get the suppressor.
And from reports from the ATF, the ATF is issuing tax stamps for "cans" at a faster rate than ever before - many firearms companies are now selling new, over the counter rifles and pistols threaded for a suppressor, right out of the box.
Savage even has three of it's .22 rimfires threaded, and the new Ruger 22 pistol is threaded.
I bought one of the Savage 64 TRR-SR rifles - it came threaded (with a thread protector) a Picatinny rail, and ready to go - it now has a can and a starlight scope on it (the ultimate "Cat Riffle
)
Then I had a Stainless Ruger MK-I target pistol, and a Remington 40X rimfire target rifle threaded, so the can will fit on all three.
Most fun you can have with your clothes on
.
Without getting into a length discussion, you are only partially correct. Title 2 still applies to certain weapons having "silencers" more effectionately called "suppressors" these days. Some states do allow them (with some restrictions occasionally) and some states do not allow them at all. The notion of "muffling" the sound of a shot varies from weapon to weapon and the effects of a "muffled" shot from a .22 compared to a 300 WimMag will be signicantly different. But there still exists certain weapons that require a license issued by BTAF and personal-private ownership is not permitted for those weapons, suppressed, silenced or whatever you want to call it. My point is simply that you cannot simply make any alteration to any weapon without doing your homework, because of the potential to get yourself into problems legally and criminally. BTW, the reduction of emitted sounds when mounting a suppressor CAN have an effect on accuracy (changes the temperatures and pressures of gases exiting the barrel) so do some testing to see how well your particular rifles takes to them if you are so inclined to mount one. And some states do not have any requirement to own, mount or shoot a rifle with a supressor which is why they've become so popular after certain laws were ammended to make them illegal in some states. But there are still illegal and can cause you grief in some places, even here in the US. Those laws also do not apply to certain Federal and Law Enforcement agencies while you use those otherwise illegal devices in your official capacity. However once you leave that position, you cannot legally (personally) own those weapons or devices per Federal and State laws that apply.
They are both the same thing - there are no "silencers", that is a movie name.
The very best suppressors reduce the sound levels ~32db - that is enough to save your hearing, but not to silence the firearm.
The ATF is NOT "... very hesitant to issue licenses for those little darlings."
It is automatic - if you live in a suppressor legal state, and you have a clean background (and $200) you get the suppressor.
If your local LE chief refuses to sign the ATF forms (like mine did
And from reports from the ATF, the ATF is issuing tax stamps for "cans" at a faster rate than ever before - many firearms companies are now selling new, over the counter rifles and pistols threaded for a suppressor, right out of the box.
Savage even has three of it's .22 rimfires threaded, and the new Ruger 22 pistol is threaded.
I bought one of the Savage 64 TRR-SR rifles - it came threaded (with a thread protector) a Picatinny rail, and ready to go - it now has a can and a starlight scope on it (the ultimate "Cat Riffle
Then I had a Stainless Ruger MK-I target pistol, and a Remington 40X rimfire target rifle threaded, so the can will fit on all three.
Most fun you can have with your clothes on
.
Without getting into a length discussion, you are only partially correct. Title 2 still applies to certain weapons having "silencers" more effectionately called "suppressors" these days. Some states do allow them (with some restrictions occasionally) and some states do not allow them at all. The notion of "muffling" the sound of a shot varies from weapon to weapon and the effects of a "muffled" shot from a .22 compared to a 300 WimMag will be signicantly different. But there still exists certain weapons that require a license issued by BTAF and personal-private ownership is not permitted for those weapons, suppressed, silenced or whatever you want to call it. My point is simply that you cannot simply make any alteration to any weapon without doing your homework, because of the potential to get yourself into problems legally and criminally. BTW, the reduction of emitted sounds when mounting a suppressor CAN have an effect on accuracy (changes the temperatures and pressures of gases exiting the barrel) so do some testing to see how well your particular rifles takes to them if you are so inclined to mount one. And some states do not have any requirement to own, mount or shoot a rifle with a supressor which is why they've become so popular after certain laws were ammended to make them illegal in some states. But there are still illegal and can cause you grief in some places, even here in the US. Those laws also do not apply to certain Federal and Law Enforcement agencies while you use those otherwise illegal devices in your official capacity. However once you leave that position, you cannot legally (personally) own those weapons or devices per Federal and State laws that apply.
Last edited:
CatShooter
New member
Originally Posted By: ShynlocoOriginally Posted By: CatShooterOriginally Posted By: ShynlocoJust for clarification, I hope you MEAN "suppressors" and not the word "silencers" that you wrote. As far as I know, "Silencers" are still a violation of federal law unless you have license issued by BTAF and they are very hesitant to issue licenses for those little darlings. In several states nowadays, "suppressors" are perfectly legal and sell like hotcates.
They are both the same thing - there are no "silencers", that is a movie name.
The very best suppressors reduce the sound levels ~32db - that is enough to save your hearing, but not to silence the firearm.
The ATF is NOT "... very hesitant to issue licenses for those little darlings."
It is automatic - if you live in a suppressor legal state, and you have a clean background (and $200) you get the suppressor.
If your local LE chief refuses to sign the ATF forms (like mine did
), then you set up a "Revocable Trust"... but one way or another, you get the suppressor.
And from reports from the ATF, the ATF is issuing tax stamps for "cans" at a faster rate than ever before - many firearms companies are now selling new, over the counter rifles and pistols threaded for a suppressor, right out of the box.
Savage even has three of it's .22 rimfires threaded, and the new Ruger 22 pistol is threaded.
I bought one of the Savage 64 TRR-SR rifles - it came threaded (with a thread protector) a Picatinny rail, and ready to go - it now has a can and a starlight scope on it (the ultimate "Cat Riffle
)
Then I had a Stainless Ruger MK-I target pistol, and a Remington 40X rimfire target rifle threaded, so the can will fit on all three.
Most fun you can have with your clothes on
.
Without getting into a length discussion, you are incorrect with that statement regarding "they are both the same thing." And you are also incorrect that you need to pay anything to BATF for obtain and mount a "suppressor." You have mixed fact with fiction that civilian, military and Law Enforcement equipment is the same and that certain pieces of equipment or attachments are permissible and are "automatic".
Oh, I would welcome your lengthy discussion... cuz I don't know what you are talking about, and YOU don't know what you are talking about.
1 - "Cans", "Suppressors" and "Silencers" ARE the same thing - contact any suppressor maker or dealer and ask them.
2 - You said, "And you are also incorrect that you need to pay anything to BATF for obtain and mount a "suppressor."
I have re-read and re-read my post several times, and I can NOT find that passage - are you sure that you are reading my post? Maybe you are reading someone else's post?
I NEVER said that the BATF sells and mounts suppressors - show me where I said that??
The BATF does not sell or mount suppressors - BUT you DO have to pay the BATF $200 for the tax stamp that is affixed to the top of your paperwork that allows you to take possession from your dealer. See, it works like this - you PAY IN FULL for your silencer and it sits at your dealer (you cannot get it through the mail - it MUST be a live dealer - face to face transaction)...
... and THEN you file the paperwork with the BATF. Then you wait for the paperwork to go through the system. Then the BATF sends the tax stamp to your dealer. Then he can give you your silencer (or whatever you want to call it). You get the silencer, AND the tax stamp - you MUST have a copy of the tax stamp paper with you when you take the silencer out to play, or you can be arrested and it will be a beetch to fix that problem.
You make out the $200 check to the BATF (not the gun store) so you are "paying for the stamp" just like you pay for stamps at the post office.
3 - "You have mixed fact with fiction that civilian, military and Law Enforcement equipment is the same and that certain pieces of equipment or attachments are permissible and are "automatic"."
I don't even know what this mumbly garbage means...
A civilian can buy any Suppressor (can, silencer) that he wants, if it is available, and s/he lives in one of the 37 states where ownership is legal - Our local class three dealer will sell any military or police suppressor - there are no "restricted devices" in the suppressor market.
And I will tell you (from a lot of experience) that IF you live in one of the 37 suppressor legal states, and IF you have a clean record, then you WILL get a tax stamp issued to you - the BATF does NOT say, "Well, he can have one and YOU can't".
But back to your original post...
Just for clarification, I hope you MEAN "suppressors" and not the word "silencers" that you wrote. As far as I know, "Silencers" are still a violation of federal law unless you have license issued by BTAF and they are very hesitant to issue licenses for those little darlings. In several states nowadays, "suppressors" are perfectly legal and sell like hotcates.
It is obvious that you know nothing about suppressor-silencer-can stuff.
1 - you do NOT get a license for a can-suppressor-silencer... there is no such thing as a license for these things.
If the transfer is approved, you get a TAX STAMP that allows you to take possession of it.
If you want to buy two, then you must get TWO tax stamps... if you want ten, then you get TEN tax stamps.
If you are a dealer, THEN you get a license (and pay for the stamp that goes with it) but you don't pay the $200 transfer tax.
"In several states nowadays, "suppressors" are perfectly legal and sell like hotcates."
Actually, Suppressors are legal in 37 states. Silencers are legal in 37 states, and CANS are legal in 37 states... because they are all the same thing.
You CANNOT buy a suppressor without getting the BATF $200 tax stamp, cuz it's the same thing as a silencer - without the stamp, I guaree-damm-tee that you will go to jail (or spend a ton of money in exchange for 10 years of probation).
They are NOT legal in 13 states... even if you legally own one in the 37 states, you cannot bring it into one of the other (13) states - or you go to jail, and loose your toy.
So, Shynloco dude, your BS is over the top of your hip boots and I can tell you that you don't know doodle squat about what you are talking about!
Meow
They are both the same thing - there are no "silencers", that is a movie name.
The very best suppressors reduce the sound levels ~32db - that is enough to save your hearing, but not to silence the firearm.
The ATF is NOT "... very hesitant to issue licenses for those little darlings."
It is automatic - if you live in a suppressor legal state, and you have a clean background (and $200) you get the suppressor.
If your local LE chief refuses to sign the ATF forms (like mine did
And from reports from the ATF, the ATF is issuing tax stamps for "cans" at a faster rate than ever before - many firearms companies are now selling new, over the counter rifles and pistols threaded for a suppressor, right out of the box.
Savage even has three of it's .22 rimfires threaded, and the new Ruger 22 pistol is threaded.
I bought one of the Savage 64 TRR-SR rifles - it came threaded (with a thread protector) a Picatinny rail, and ready to go - it now has a can and a starlight scope on it (the ultimate "Cat Riffle
Then I had a Stainless Ruger MK-I target pistol, and a Remington 40X rimfire target rifle threaded, so the can will fit on all three.
Most fun you can have with your clothes on
.
Without getting into a length discussion, you are incorrect with that statement regarding "they are both the same thing." And you are also incorrect that you need to pay anything to BATF for obtain and mount a "suppressor." You have mixed fact with fiction that civilian, military and Law Enforcement equipment is the same and that certain pieces of equipment or attachments are permissible and are "automatic".
Oh, I would welcome your lengthy discussion... cuz I don't know what you are talking about, and YOU don't know what you are talking about.
1 - "Cans", "Suppressors" and "Silencers" ARE the same thing - contact any suppressor maker or dealer and ask them.
2 - You said, "And you are also incorrect that you need to pay anything to BATF for obtain and mount a "suppressor."
I have re-read and re-read my post several times, and I can NOT find that passage - are you sure that you are reading my post? Maybe you are reading someone else's post?
I NEVER said that the BATF sells and mounts suppressors - show me where I said that??
The BATF does not sell or mount suppressors - BUT you DO have to pay the BATF $200 for the tax stamp that is affixed to the top of your paperwork that allows you to take possession from your dealer. See, it works like this - you PAY IN FULL for your silencer and it sits at your dealer (you cannot get it through the mail - it MUST be a live dealer - face to face transaction)...
... and THEN you file the paperwork with the BATF. Then you wait for the paperwork to go through the system. Then the BATF sends the tax stamp to your dealer. Then he can give you your silencer (or whatever you want to call it). You get the silencer, AND the tax stamp - you MUST have a copy of the tax stamp paper with you when you take the silencer out to play, or you can be arrested and it will be a beetch to fix that problem.
You make out the $200 check to the BATF (not the gun store) so you are "paying for the stamp" just like you pay for stamps at the post office.
3 - "You have mixed fact with fiction that civilian, military and Law Enforcement equipment is the same and that certain pieces of equipment or attachments are permissible and are "automatic"."
I don't even know what this mumbly garbage means...
A civilian can buy any Suppressor (can, silencer) that he wants, if it is available, and s/he lives in one of the 37 states where ownership is legal - Our local class three dealer will sell any military or police suppressor - there are no "restricted devices" in the suppressor market.
And I will tell you (from a lot of experience) that IF you live in one of the 37 suppressor legal states, and IF you have a clean record, then you WILL get a tax stamp issued to you - the BATF does NOT say, "Well, he can have one and YOU can't".
But back to your original post...
Just for clarification, I hope you MEAN "suppressors" and not the word "silencers" that you wrote. As far as I know, "Silencers" are still a violation of federal law unless you have license issued by BTAF and they are very hesitant to issue licenses for those little darlings. In several states nowadays, "suppressors" are perfectly legal and sell like hotcates.
It is obvious that you know nothing about suppressor-silencer-can stuff.
1 - you do NOT get a license for a can-suppressor-silencer... there is no such thing as a license for these things.
If the transfer is approved, you get a TAX STAMP that allows you to take possession of it.
If you want to buy two, then you must get TWO tax stamps... if you want ten, then you get TEN tax stamps.
If you are a dealer, THEN you get a license (and pay for the stamp that goes with it) but you don't pay the $200 transfer tax.
"In several states nowadays, "suppressors" are perfectly legal and sell like hotcates."
Actually, Suppressors are legal in 37 states. Silencers are legal in 37 states, and CANS are legal in 37 states... because they are all the same thing.
You CANNOT buy a suppressor without getting the BATF $200 tax stamp, cuz it's the same thing as a silencer - without the stamp, I guaree-damm-tee that you will go to jail (or spend a ton of money in exchange for 10 years of probation).
They are NOT legal in 13 states... even if you legally own one in the 37 states, you cannot bring it into one of the other (13) states - or you go to jail, and loose your toy.
So, Shynloco dude, your BS is over the top of your hip boots and I can tell you that you don't know doodle squat about what you are talking about!
Meow
jlindholm70
New member
Gotta agree with Catshooter on this one, except for one possible mis-statement. "And from reports from the ATF, the ATF is issuing tax stamps for "cans" at a faster rate than ever before" Maybe they meant to say that they are issuing MORE stamps than ever before. I'd buy that statement for a nickel, but they are definitley not issuing them faster.
I'm going on 5 months waiting for my TiRant45 and SBR stamps. It only took 3 months to get the stamps for my 762SD and 22lr cans a year ago.
Where people come up with the thought that a "silencer" is different than a "suppressor" is beyond me.
I'm going on 5 months waiting for my TiRant45 and SBR stamps. It only took 3 months to get the stamps for my 762SD and 22lr cans a year ago.
Where people come up with the thought that a "silencer" is different than a "suppressor" is beyond me.
CatShooter
New member
Originally Posted By: jlindholm70Gotta agree with Catshooter on this one, except for one possible mis-statement. "And from reports from the ATF, the ATF is issuing tax stamps for "cans" at a faster rate than ever before" Maybe they meant to say that they are issuing MORE stamps than ever before. I'd buy that statement for a nickel, but they are definitley not issuing them faster.
I'm going on 5 months waiting for my TiRant45 and SBR stamps. It only took 3 months to get the stamps for my 762SD and 22lr cans a year ago.
Where people come up with the thought that a "silencer" is different than a "suppressor" is beyond me.
They are not processing them faster - Gag, such a miracle should happen - but the numbers of tax stamps they are issuing are higher. Better wording.
It amazes me that no matter what time of year, and what the work load is - they can still take 5 to 6 months to do a 10 minute background check...
... must be that the background check interferes with the parties in Las Vegas.
I'm going on 5 months waiting for my TiRant45 and SBR stamps. It only took 3 months to get the stamps for my 762SD and 22lr cans a year ago.
Where people come up with the thought that a "silencer" is different than a "suppressor" is beyond me.
They are not processing them faster - Gag, such a miracle should happen - but the numbers of tax stamps they are issuing are higher. Better wording.
It amazes me that no matter what time of year, and what the work load is - they can still take 5 to 6 months to do a 10 minute background check...
... must be that the background check interferes with the parties in Las Vegas.
sendit223
Well-known member
Catshooter's facts are spot on. Having thoroughly researched the topic myself (and owning multiple cans) I can say his points are valid.
The issue of increased wait time is very real and driven by the vastly increased demand combined with a static number of examiners at BATF. The former is a good thing, while the latter makes no sense.
And Catshooter do you know if one may travel through a can-unfriendly state with a suppressor if it is secured and you are simply driving through the state? I am pretty sure I read that is the case, but can't find the source.
For the record I am not asking for legal advice!
Sendit
The issue of increased wait time is very real and driven by the vastly increased demand combined with a static number of examiners at BATF. The former is a good thing, while the latter makes no sense.
And Catshooter do you know if one may travel through a can-unfriendly state with a suppressor if it is secured and you are simply driving through the state? I am pretty sure I read that is the case, but can't find the source.
For the record I am not asking for legal advice!
Sendit
CatShooter
New member
Originally Posted By: sendit223Catshooter's facts are spot on. Having thoroughly researched the topic myself (and owning multiple cans) I can say his points are valid.
The issue of increased wait time is very real and driven by the vastly increased demand combined with a static number of examiners at BATF. The former is a good thing, while the latter makes no sense.
And Catshooter do you know if one may travel through a can-unfriendly state with a suppressor if it is secured and you are simply driving through the state? I am pretty sure I read that is the case, but can't find the source.
For the record I am not asking for legal advice!
Sendit
Maybe... You can travel through a can unfriendly state, but there is no specific mention of silencers, or suppressors.
The Firearm Owners' Protection Act (FOPA), Pub.L. 99-308, 100 Stat. 449, enacted May 19, 1986, codified at 18 U.S.C. § 921 et seq.
I would be tempted to FED-EX it to myself, or bury it so deep in the car's luggage (in the dirty cat box
, cuz here in Connecticut, we are OK, but we are surrounded by Mass on the north side, and New Yawk on the south and west so we are boxed in by the country's worst states.
Having fought a class three case in federal court a long time ago (and won), I do NOT want to have to do that again.
Actually, I think I would write (not call) the BATF and get written clarification on if the FOPA does protect the class three device owner, and how to go through unfriendly states, and if I could FED-EX it to myself.
.
The issue of increased wait time is very real and driven by the vastly increased demand combined with a static number of examiners at BATF. The former is a good thing, while the latter makes no sense.
And Catshooter do you know if one may travel through a can-unfriendly state with a suppressor if it is secured and you are simply driving through the state? I am pretty sure I read that is the case, but can't find the source.
For the record I am not asking for legal advice!
Sendit
Maybe... You can travel through a can unfriendly state, but there is no specific mention of silencers, or suppressors.
The Firearm Owners' Protection Act (FOPA), Pub.L. 99-308, 100 Stat. 449, enacted May 19, 1986, codified at 18 U.S.C. § 921 et seq.
I would be tempted to FED-EX it to myself, or bury it so deep in the car's luggage (in the dirty cat box
, cuz here in Connecticut, we are OK, but we are surrounded by Mass on the north side, and New Yawk on the south and west so we are boxed in by the country's worst states.Having fought a class three case in federal court a long time ago (and won), I do NOT want to have to do that again.
Actually, I think I would write (not call) the BATF and get written clarification on if the FOPA does protect the class three device owner, and how to go through unfriendly states, and if I could FED-EX it to myself.
.
Pretty good reading here! I'm not to old to learn a few things!!
I have a buddy that has a few silencers (LOL) and he does the trust thingy. He says its a PITA and a waiting game. Another bud is waiting on his stamp and waiting and waiting and waiting and......
I have a buddy that has a few silencers (LOL) and he does the trust thingy. He says its a PITA and a waiting game. Another bud is waiting on his stamp and waiting and waiting and waiting and......
Last edited:
BATFE 5320.20 is the form you want to fill out to avoid any issues with a local smoky that doesn't know federal law trumps state law.
It is NOT necessary for traveling with a suppressor but if a law enforcement officer stops you, searches and finds it...they may not be aware that its not a violation.
IIRC...Fill out the form listing ANY AND ALL stares that you MIGHT travel to or through for up to an entire year.
Be sure to fill it out well in advance so its approved before you leave and you'll have no issues.
It's designed for sbs, sbr and machine guns but it will offer piece of mind if you need to transport a can as well.
It is NOT necessary for traveling with a suppressor but if a law enforcement officer stops you, searches and finds it...they may not be aware that its not a violation.
IIRC...Fill out the form listing ANY AND ALL stares that you MIGHT travel to or through for up to an entire year.
Be sure to fill it out well in advance so its approved before you leave and you'll have no issues.
It's designed for sbs, sbr and machine guns but it will offer piece of mind if you need to transport a can as well.
coleridge
Active member
"Can" (pun intended) someone clarify the option of creating a Trust(advantage/disadvantage)?
This past weekend I won a Thunder Beast Suppressor certificate at a shoot. I had been looking into the "rules" (been thinking about one for a while) but now starting the process & need help with some of the specifics from those with experience. Any advice would be GREATLY appreciated.
Thanks!
This past weekend I won a Thunder Beast Suppressor certificate at a shoot. I had been looking into the "rules" (been thinking about one for a while) but now starting the process & need help with some of the specifics from those with experience. Any advice would be GREATLY appreciated.
Thanks!
Ricky Bobby
New member
Come On ... I thought everything was legal in Texas!
CatShooter
New member
Originally Posted By: coleridge"Can" (pun intended) someone clarify the option of creating a Trust(advantage/disadvantage)?
This past weekend I won a Thunder Beast Suppressor certificate at a shoot. I had been looking into the "rules" (been thinking about one for a while) but now starting the process & need help with some of the specifics from those with experience. Any advice would be GREATLY appreciated.
Thanks!
Disadvantages... it is a legal court document, and costs money.
I have seen them go for $400 to $1000. I paid a lawyer $750 for mine.
Advantages.
1 - If you have a regular transfer, only you (legally) can use the can or have it in your possession - you cannot let your son or friend borrow it for a day. When you croke, the disposition of all of your class 3 devices becomes problematic, and if you leave it to your kidlets (or anyone else), they have to pay the $200 tax for each item.
With a trust, everyone listed on the trust (which you can change as time passes) can possess the device - and when you die, since the device still belongs to the "trust" anyone on the trust (your rugrats, or friends) automatically get the device with no paper work and no taxes.
2 - Many police chiefs do not want locals to own class 3 devices - the chief in my town thinks only police and the army should own ANY gun things
He refused to sign the papers for the transfer. So I got a trust, and there was nothing he could do to stop it - the BATF notified him that I had it AFTER the transfer had taken place. (Eat your heart out, chief!!)
This past weekend I won a Thunder Beast Suppressor certificate at a shoot. I had been looking into the "rules" (been thinking about one for a while) but now starting the process & need help with some of the specifics from those with experience. Any advice would be GREATLY appreciated.
Thanks!
Disadvantages... it is a legal court document, and costs money.
I have seen them go for $400 to $1000. I paid a lawyer $750 for mine.
Advantages.
1 - If you have a regular transfer, only you (legally) can use the can or have it in your possession - you cannot let your son or friend borrow it for a day. When you croke, the disposition of all of your class 3 devices becomes problematic, and if you leave it to your kidlets (or anyone else), they have to pay the $200 tax for each item.
With a trust, everyone listed on the trust (which you can change as time passes) can possess the device - and when you die, since the device still belongs to the "trust" anyone on the trust (your rugrats, or friends) automatically get the device with no paper work and no taxes.
2 - Many police chiefs do not want locals to own class 3 devices - the chief in my town thinks only police and the army should own ANY gun things
He refused to sign the papers for the transfer. So I got a trust, and there was nothing he could do to stop it - the BATF notified him that I had it AFTER the transfer had taken place. (Eat your heart out, chief!!)
Originally Posted By: CatShooter
1 - If you have a regular transfer, only you (legally) can use the can or have it in your possession - you cannot let your son or friend borrow it for a day.
I think anyone can USE the suppressor YOU just have to be present when it is out and about.
Pretty much if you think you will be the only one shooting with your suppressor and your LEO will sign go that route. NOW if you plan on letting your kids, wife, father, mother, your dog so on and so on use it your better off doing the trust route. Wife might be mad if you left it in the car and she gets pulled over and gets slapped with a felony for a simple mistake.
Catshooter is right on with everything he has said. The best advice is if you are wanting to "get your can on" look up the laws yourself as the net is full of misinformation now days!
Also take what people say that live in CA with a grain of salt as their laws are so messed up they forget how the rest of the world works!
1 - If you have a regular transfer, only you (legally) can use the can or have it in your possession - you cannot let your son or friend borrow it for a day.
I think anyone can USE the suppressor YOU just have to be present when it is out and about.
Pretty much if you think you will be the only one shooting with your suppressor and your LEO will sign go that route. NOW if you plan on letting your kids, wife, father, mother, your dog so on and so on use it your better off doing the trust route. Wife might be mad if you left it in the car and she gets pulled over and gets slapped with a felony for a simple mistake.
Catshooter is right on with everything he has said. The best advice is if you are wanting to "get your can on" look up the laws yourself as the net is full of misinformation now days!
Also take what people say that live in CA with a grain of salt as their laws are so messed up they forget how the rest of the world works!
CatShooter
New member
Originally Posted By: dmpowderOriginally Posted By: CatShooter
1 - If you have a regular transfer, only you (legally) can use the can or have it in your possession - you cannot let your son or friend borrow it for a day.
I think anyone can USE the suppressor YOU just have to be present when it is out and about.
I think this is cloudy area.
My class 3 dealer (a very knowledgeable expert in these things) told me that there is a technicality in this.
If you are present and let the guy next to you use your gun/can, some agents will say that you are in control, so you are in possession.
But others (newbees or agents with a woody) can make a case that since you were not holding it, that you were not in possession.
And since the other guy was holding it, HE was in possession, so you both need to go to the poky.
Of course a judge will dismiss it, but I am really tired of fighting windmills and now leave the "causes" to younger (and nobler [or dumber?]) people.
.
1 - If you have a regular transfer, only you (legally) can use the can or have it in your possession - you cannot let your son or friend borrow it for a day.
I think anyone can USE the suppressor YOU just have to be present when it is out and about.
I think this is cloudy area.
My class 3 dealer (a very knowledgeable expert in these things) told me that there is a technicality in this.
If you are present and let the guy next to you use your gun/can, some agents will say that you are in control, so you are in possession.
But others (newbees or agents with a woody) can make a case that since you were not holding it, that you were not in possession.
And since the other guy was holding it, HE was in possession, so you both need to go to the poky.
Of course a judge will dismiss it, but I am really tired of fighting windmills and now leave the "causes" to younger (and nobler [or dumber?]) people.
.
Quote:
I think this is cloudy area.
My class 3 dealer (a very knowledgeable expert in these things) told me that there is a technicality in this.
If you are present and let the guy next to you use your gun/can, some agents will say that you are in control, so you are in possession.
But others (newbees or agents with a woody) can make a case that since you were not holding it, that you were not in possession.
And since the other guy was holding it, HE was in possession, so you both need to go to the poky.
Of course a judge will dismiss it, but I am really tired of fighting windmills and now leave the "causes" to younger (and nobler [or dumber?]) people.
The sad truth is that an agent can misuse or abuse his authority, just like anyone else. He can charge you for whatever he thinks will stick. It may be dismissed in a heartbeat, but its still a hassle.
My direct first hand face to face info from two ATF agents says that as long as the person its registered to is present...everything is fine.
To be double sure...just write or email them (BATFE) a letter and print their response and keep it with your copy of the form 4. We have 3-4 documents that we always carry with a can. Documentation from a state authority acknowledging that they are legal for whatever we are hunting at the time is just another.
Not all official are up to date with regulations they don't deal with daily.
I think this is cloudy area.
My class 3 dealer (a very knowledgeable expert in these things) told me that there is a technicality in this.
If you are present and let the guy next to you use your gun/can, some agents will say that you are in control, so you are in possession.
But others (newbees or agents with a woody) can make a case that since you were not holding it, that you were not in possession.
And since the other guy was holding it, HE was in possession, so you both need to go to the poky.
Of course a judge will dismiss it, but I am really tired of fighting windmills and now leave the "causes" to younger (and nobler [or dumber?]) people.
The sad truth is that an agent can misuse or abuse his authority, just like anyone else. He can charge you for whatever he thinks will stick. It may be dismissed in a heartbeat, but its still a hassle.
My direct first hand face to face info from two ATF agents says that as long as the person its registered to is present...everything is fine.
To be double sure...just write or email them (BATFE) a letter and print their response and keep it with your copy of the form 4. We have 3-4 documents that we always carry with a can. Documentation from a state authority acknowledging that they are legal for whatever we are hunting at the time is just another.
Not all official are up to date with regulations they don't deal with daily.