weatherby vanguard or Sub-moa vanguard??

Wa_Coyote_Hunter

Wa_Coyote_Hunter

New member
I am looking at getting a new rifle, and am trying to decide on which weatherby. I want a synthetic stock and was wondering if there is much difference in the regular Vanguard compaired with the vanguard Sub-Moa. I know the sub-moa has a better stock but do they really shoot better.

Also am looking at a tikka because they also have the Under 1 inch moa garantee. Dave
 
The Vangaurd is built by Howa. Either one is fine. If one costs more buy the other. Myself, I own a Howa1500 Varmint, Its a great shooter. But If I bought a rifle off of the rack. Id choose the Tikka. Try em out and see how they feel to ya. Good Luck !
 
I have the Sub-MOA in 223 and I can say it is a real shooter with 40gr V-Maxs and 60gr V-Maxs and the stock is a lot nicer..
 
Get the Tikka or the Sako A7 which is a cross between Sako/Tikka better bolt, safety, and clip. The removable magazine is modified with metal lip. Tikka has a 3 shot 1" and Sako has a 5 shot 1" tag. Bereta was extending warranty if you register online.
The Weatherby MOA does shoot better than the standard.
The Weatherby does not have a removable mag, it does not operate nearly as smooth and the trigger leaves alot to be desired even after adj.
I just gave a vanguard away a few weeks ago. Less than 100 shots. Not nearly as pleasant to operate with spotty fussy accuracy. Sad but this was my last weatherby. Not going to play that game again.
 
I like my .257WBY in the cheap vanguard, just think it's too over powered for anything this neck of the woods..


Juan
 
I had the standard Vanguard in .223. Can't imagine a rifle shooting any better than that one. I guess it depends on how much actual accuracy you want but I'd buy the standard model and not worry about it.
 
from what I've read, this is what Weatherby does.

They test fire each barreled action in a vise, but NOT in a stock. Then they segregate each barreled action into 2 piles...sub MOA and non-MOA. The sub MOA guns get the nicer, fancy tan webbed stocks, and the non-MOA get the black tupperware stocks. Of course, there's about a $300 price difference.

Now, as far as I know, each caliber is tested with the same load. It would seem to me that if you took a non-MOA gun and carefully worked up handloads with different bullet weights/powders, it could shoot sub-MOA. Conversely, you might buy a sub-MOA gun and shoot ammo different than what was tested and it might not shoot sub-MOA or even close. Who knows?

Maybe the sub-MOA guns are put together (fitted) better and do in fact shoot better, on average, than the non-MOA guns. The better stock definitely should help with accuracy...in theory. But is it really worth the extra money?

bownut


 
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That's the same understanding I have of the procedure, so in effect the sub-moa are the cream and the standard are the culls.
Mine was not a sub moa but had the tan black web stock. We struggled with many different loads to achieve a group. In doing so we decided this rifle was nothing special and that the stock was it's nicest feature.
Some people enjoy fiddling with a gun to get groups, and putting extra money into it makes them feel accomplished.
I enjoy buying a rifle, cleaning it, and shooting good groups, then going hunting with a gun I have confidence in.
Many gun makers produce such guns and even the homely savages or stevens can achieve great groups for less money than the weatherby. My current choice for price value is Tikka which fits the bill of clean & shoot right out of the box. There are several other makes that will do the same.
After getting spoiled by smooth operation and good triggers it is hard to go backwards.
 
I heard that they now shoot the rifles in the stock that there in not a master stock. i've got a standard .30-06 that shoot about 1/2" at a hundred yards. my .223 standard shot about the same and my dads .243 carbine shoots just under an inch. I don't think you can get a better rifle for the price. theres also a 1.5 inch guarentee or .5 inch for the sub moa
 
I bought the Sub-MOA in a .338 Mag about two years ago. The stock is indeed nice and I like the feel of it, plus the action is smooth. I've always liked the Vanguard / Howa actions. The trigger leaves something to be desired, so I ordered a Timney for it.

I've been a bit disappointed in the accuracy with handloads and the fact that the factory ammo suggested by Weatherby to achieve Sub-MOA has been discontinued. It was actually discontinued prior to me purchasing the rifle, I later found out. I managed to find one box of ammo at about $55, and it did shoot less than an inch, but I haven't found a handload that will. I haven't handloaded much for the rifle, so I may have to save those comments for a later time, to be fair.

Weatherby's suggested load was a 225 gr. Soft Point and not really the kind of bullet I think a .338 should shoot for big game. It would not be my choice of bullet, so the fact that it might shoot less than an inch might not matter where it really counts.

I've owned two other Vanguards over the years (both 7mm Mags), and both were the standard versions and real shooters - under an inch for both. I am now questioning if my move toward the Sub-MOA model was worth the difference in cost. It's a nice rifle for sure, but maybe not cost effective.
 
Most quality rifles with a descent Action - Barrel combination are capable of Sub-MOA given a little work. Pillar the action, float the barrel, a bit of trigger tweek, good optics, and certainly correct load development. In the right hands, there's no reason the thing should not shoot well. Of all those items, Load Development is critical I think. If you don't find what the gun likes to shoot, no matter how nice the action / barrel is, it's going to be a mute point.

I'm working on a Howa 22-250 for my better half as we speak. It will get the basicas I listed above, but I will also do initial testing to see where things are at out of the box, v.s. where they finish up.

I suppose it's all down to what you want, true accuracy, the name / branding, the guns appearence, etc etc. Personlly, I like them to look good, but would certainly give on the looks to ensure the rifle shoots well, that's why I tend to choose the guns I do, as I generally put a fair bit into them from the get go.
 
What i would do is buy a Howa Barreled action in 243 varmint and order a Manners t3 stock. Have the stock pillar beaded and a little trigger work done, and go play. The Howa heavy barreled actions are the same thing for less money, plus you dont have to live with a half rate stock. Well i shouldnt say that. I dont know what stock comes with the sub MOA it might be a B&C which are decent stocks. The manners t3 would be an awesome stock though!! Check them out!! I like to be different though so take what i say for what its worth. My taste may be different than yours. Lee
 


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