whats the largest animal youd take with a 6mm or 243 ?

Long ago read an article about an Alaskan hunter that took "everything", Brown and Polar bears, with a .222. But, that does not justify the choice. ,243 is a good deer caliber, period. .270/7mm are sensible choices for Mule Deer/Elk. Can it be done with a .243? Yes. Should you plan to do it...not if you have bigger choices.
 
Originally Posted By: 19grizz69i have taken 35 elk hundreds of deer and speed goats and 3 moose all with my 243, a good bullet and shot placement are important and distances .not a 500 yard cartridge

Hundreds ? Fairly liberal game laws there in MT ? Daytime with a license ?
 
GIVE me a good 100 grain Nosler Partition or Barnes X-bullet and I'd shoot anything that walks on the planet with it...I might be a little concerned about elephant but that would be about it.. A Partition or X-bullet to the side of the head and down it will go, I'd be a litle nervous on some but not many.. a skull plate wacked at about 2700 fps second will open like a revival meeting. with a splash and a dash..
 


Originally Posted By: CacheCreekOriginally Posted By: Steve Timm



Yup, bigger cartridges usually simply make the hunter shoot worse.

If a fella is having a hard time killing big game animals dead, he should default to a smaller cartridge, not a larger one.

Regrettably common horse-sense isn't all that common.

At least, that has been my observation in a lifetime of active hunting.

Steve Timm








Sorry Steve, but I don't agree with that statement. Switching guns to a different caliber, either bigger or smaller, doesn't improve your skill level, and going smaller only makes things worse. Skill level gains only comes from experience and practice, and switching guns is not a cure. Here is my advice; start with enough gun to sensibly do the job, then work to improve your skill level from there.

That being said, I have killed bull elk with a 6mm, but it is not what I would consider a good choice for an elk cartridge. There are more sensible calibers out there for elk sized animals, an ethical hunter is better off using one of those.


Cache,

Actually, we're saying the same thing ... just in a different way.

There is absolutely NO substitute for trigger time. Experience behind your rifle, quality experience, is something that will enhance your skill with it. One cannot buy experience.

Story Time:
As most of my readers know, I guided in He11's Canyon of the Snake for several years. One year, we had a likeable guy show up with a Brown Precision rifle in 7RemMag.

Bill's rifle was an awfully nice example of state-of-the art custom rifles. When I asked the innocent question, "How does it shoot?" He answered, "Heck, I don't know; they sighted it in at the factory."

When I asked, "How many rounds have you fired through your new rifle?" He answered honestly, "None."

A few days later, I got Bill and another hunter (happily a great one) into a herd of elk. I had my good shooter kill his elk, which he did with his .308 and quite professionally placed a 150 Hornady through both lungs ... and the elk fell off the hill, quite dead.

Bill's turn was next. My good shooter nailed the herd cow, so the rest of them were milling around, quite leaderless. During the following five minutes, Bill hit just about every non-lethal part of his cow, plus ventilating the hillside a bit. I won't bore you with forensics, but the atrocity would make a good PETA ad.

Finally, he threw the rifle down (literally) and said, "Steve, will you please kill this elk?"

Gladly. Bang-Flop.

As Bill left, I asked him how the trip was. He told me that he had no idea how tough elk were and that next year he would come prepared. I opined that perhaps it might be better to buy a .25-'06 and put five hundred (or more) rounds through the light-recoiling rifle. Skill is what it is all about, not rifle, cartridge, bullet and such.

The next year, Bill showed up with his new Kenny Jarrett .300 KONG. They sighted it in at the factory. Bill DID shoot it ... one round at the range, which gave him a half-moon over his eye.

That year was a disaster. I will not even write about it, but the experience was one that gave me the unchangable opinion that skill with a rifle and hunting skills are what it takes to be successful in the field ... and that moderation in cartridge size surely helps to improve shooting skills.

Basically, get as close as you can, place a moderate-sized bullet where it will kill the animal and the war is over in a single shot.

Steve Timm
 
Originally Posted By: Steve Timm



Yup, bigger cartridges usually simply make the hunter shoot worse.

If a fella is having a hard time killing big game animals dead, he should default to a smaller cartridge, not a larger one.

Regrettably common horse-sense isn't all that common.

At least, that has been my observation in a lifetime of active hunting.

Steve Timm



hmm...I shoot my 300 Win Mag as good as I shoot my .243...
wink.gif
 
Originally Posted By: NdIndyMule deer.

I've talked crap about the .243 for most of my life, based on this.

My first ever deer was also my biggest, niiiiice buck. Taken with a .243 at
 
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If you are used to recoil then have at it with the BMG, but the average hunter doesnt run a box a year through his rifle. Steves dead on bullet size is no substitute for trigger time. I experience the same scenario guiding hogs in florida, the kid with the H&R Handi Rifle usually does better than sidewalk Rambo with his $10,000 customized automatic butt wiping make you supper at night 470 Nitro Express with solid gold handloads.
 
6mm Remington is one of my all time favorite cartridges. I've killed everything from ground hogs to 300 lb wild hogs with it. It may not be the best choice for the largest North American game, but in the hands of a skilled shooter it will certainly get the job done.
 
Farmer J's story reminded me of one of my own. When I was a young buck and first experimenting with calling coyotes, I packed my 7mm Rem mag because that was the only center fire rifle I owned at the time.

Anyway, I call in this coyote and he pops up at only 10 yards away. He was facing me and I put the cross hairs at where the neck meets the body and pulled the trigger.

Now this is where it gets strange.....when I retreived the coyote, there was no exit wound. I was shooting 120 gr. Hornady hollow points at a moderate velocity, and it turned the coyote's spine to saw dust from the base of the neck to the base of the tail, but the bullet never came out.

The reason I bring this up is that sometimes you get some ballistic quirks. Coyotes that one would expect to be blown apart by an oversized cartridge, aren't, and other animals like elk, are killed quickly and efficeintly with small calibers. But that still doesn't make them a sensible choice.
 
You can use it to kill anything. Even an elephant was killed with the little 22LR just to show it could be done. I have a vintage M77 ruger in 6mm and have taken whitetails with it using 100gr handloads. I would use it for anything from varmint up to deer sized game. I would want something bigger if hunting bears and such. My goal as a hunter is to kill the animal as quickly and humainly as possible. I always hate when I make a bad shot and have to track the animal, to me, that means its suffered. I want the one shot - drop. A small caliber on a large animal increases the likely hood of a wounded animal. For larger game than whitetails, there are much better choices.
 
I have a pawn shop near me full of 7mm rifles all between 200 and 350 I guess no one here likes them. I might pick one up.but I love my 243 and id use it on bigger game if I had the license for them and a clear shot I was comfortable with.

Thanks for all the information, its cleared up a few things for me
 
I like my 243 but it's my preditor rifle. Will it kill larger animals, of course but I think there ar better suited cartridges of very light recoil.

I know that a properly placed bullet of any size that can get in and disrupt vitals can kill and do iot cleanly. But I also know that what a 90gr or 100gr bullet from a 24 cal rifle will do, a 125gr to 140gr bullet from a 6.5 cartridge will do a bit better. Does it need to be done a bit better? Probably not but it does make me feel like I've chosen the right tool for the job. You can dig a very deep hole with a garden rake but you can dig the same hole faster with a shovel!

My impression of the 24's is that they are preditor cartridges first that will kill about anything. No body on here would suggest a 243 for brown bear, simply because they might not be in good humor at the time. But a 375 is not needed either and that get's suggested a lot. Just because an animal doesn't fight back doesn't mean we should not use the most suitable cartridge we can handle. "Can handle" being the key word here. I think my 25-06 is a better deer cartridge than my 243 and yes I have shot a few deer with the 243. I've also killed deer very dead very quickly with a 22 LR; doesn't make it a deer cartridge, only shows I knew how to use it.
 
Only thing my 243 will ever shoot is coyote size or smaller critters. If it was all I had, god forbid, I guess I'd shoot up to elk with it since it is legal, but I"d hold my shots to no more then 200 and wait for a broadside shot, make the first one count and keep shooting till hes down. Who the heck gets those kinda perfect scenarios for elk year after year?? Serious elk hunters know thats just not gonna happen, so we use "enough gun". 243 just is not enough gun for much more then coyotes.

Course they can kill deer, but there is far better cartridges for that task. 100lb whitetails shot over a feeder at 100 yards are totally different then 250lb muleys shot across wheat fields at 500...
 
This is just me and how I feel about the Cal sizes

17 and 22 Cals......good up to coyote size game

6mm....coyote to deer size game

25 cal......deer size only

7mm....deer up to elk size game

30 cal. and up.....deer, elk, and on up of anything in N. American.

Now I hnow some on here woun't like my picks, but this is just how I look at it.
 
I love how people think there is a huge difference between Mule deer and White tail.

That aside. I would use it for Elk if the situation presented itself. I wouldn't head out after on with a 243. But if I run across run with the 243 in my hands, I am more then confident I will put the bullet in the boiler room. A 95+ gr bullet, especially a Partition, TSX, ect would be fine for Elk out to around 200 yds. A 100 gr 243 Win has 1500 ft/lbs at 150yds. (the target book)

I haven't shot an elk yet, but have witnessed them being taken. I prefer my 7 Rem Mag. I shoot it quite well and it sure will deliver energy WAY down range.


With all that said a 243 would be fine for;

Varmints
Deer
Caribou
Pronghorns
Lower 48 Black Bear
Elk, if it was all I had
 
I agree patially with pahntr760. If a .243 was all you had at the time, you could take an elk with one and a well placed bullet!!!! Honestly, I have a .22lr that my grandfather gave me when I was a kid, and it's killed more elk than I'll probably kill in my life time, so to make a point, if it's all you got, it can be done!!

With that said, I've always believed in taking enough gun for the job, so I can be confident in a humane kill. I've witnessed to many elk wounded and not dispatched with to little gun!!! My elk gun is a 300 Win. Mag. My .243 has taken many mule deer, pronghorn, and even some yotes, although I believe it's a little to much for coyotes.

By the way, I've shot both whitetail, and muley bucks, and there IS a size diference!!! Close to double in some cases!!!

Just my 2 cents,

Hamer
 
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