17 hmr failed on a fox???

**The old Rem. 17 has about died because us old timers found it lacking in all respects to hunting anything bigger than praire dogs. And the wind. No explanation needed. **

While I find the 17 HMR to be a bit pathetic at any range for predators,I have taken several hundred coyotes with the 17 Rem CF.I dont have the visability for long shots as a rule,but have taken them at over 250 yds cleanly.The only reason I dont own the gun any more is due to bore fouling;which was prolly an ammo problem.

Now I use the 22-250 and love it except for the pole lines,where I use a 243.

Edge
 
Pecci, you sound like a man with a brain. Edge, I like the word you used best to sum up the 17HMR...(pathetic)...lol. Maybe they should have called it the 17 HMRP? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
 
If you want to use a rimfire for foxes then use 22mag with 50 grain bullets. The 17HMR is deadly for small rodents and rabbits because it explodes on contact. Foxes are quite a bit tougher as you found out and need more penetration than provided by a 17HMR.
 
Im not going to use my HMR on predators, but to insinuate that the 17 Rem is not a capable round for fox or even coyotes is way out there. While it may not be my gun of choice on a coyote, if one comes in, so be it, he'll be just as dead as if I used the 22-250. The 17 Rem vaporizes reds and grays efficiently with usually zero fur damage. Most times, you only get to see a few flicks of their tail waving goodbye to this world.
 
I believe and hope the novelty of the 17 wears off soon or they are limited to barn rats and mice.
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Ain't that the truth! The 17 HMR is fad and won't do anything that another cartridge already does. I feel that there aren't many uses or needs for it; I've already got multiple firearms that will get the job done on whatever needs to get killed without the services of the small 17 gr bullets.
It seems as though even the 17HMR supporters and defenders, state that a perfect shot is needed. Why would anyone depend on a "perfect shot" or "perfect bullet placement". None of us are good enough for either, everytime. In fact, maybe even part of the time. Hunting is about stopping an animal in a humane, ethical, and responsible way.
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Well spoken, sir.
 
Dee:

You need to tune in at Saubier or The Coyote Gods and educate the folks there about your knowledge and experience with the 17 Remington. They haven't heard yet that its too small for coyotes.

Maybe its because they keep pointing them in the direction of coyotes and the coyotes keep falling over for some mysterious reason.
:rolleyes:
 
I am not deffending the 17 but shot placement is better than bigger. We owe it to the animal for a quick clean kill. When we start hunting with large calibers some people get it in their minds that I can shoot and hit the animal anywhere, my gun is big enough that it just picks the critters up and throws them. There is a lot of people out here in my area that bigger is better hands down. Bigger is better, but you should still shoot for the vitals. I can't say if the 17 is good or bad, I have never shot one. I do know a few guys that shoot them and are happy no compaints. Sometimes animals get away. The will for an animal to survive is stonger that the will of man to shoot staight
 
Well, guess maybe these Texas grey fox are not as tough. Or maybe the shooters are better! Who knows...I have probably taken around 25-30 greys with my 17HMR this year and have not had one run off yet. I am using the 20 gr. XTP...Am i saying that the 17 HMR is a good all around varmint gun...NO. I have two rifles when I hunt here in Texas at night. 204 and 17HMR. A lot of stands if I call for 20-30min and see NADA I switch over to the grey fox fight, or grey fox pup and here the come a running. I also switch over to the 17HMR. If I am calling and have two shooters one shoots the 204 the other the 17HMR. IMHO I like the 17HMR for greys, reds, and coons. Very little damage and a dead varmint. Larger Cats and yotes stick with the 204. Oh yeah...I am sure there is a "horror" story about a cat or yote running off with a 204 also! I also shot a yote one time deer hunting with a 300 win mag running that I never found. Plenty of blood but no yote found. Guess I should have had a "BIGGER" caliber...or maybe just a better shot on the coyote?! Thats a thought!
 
try the cci TNT hollow points their good i saw a test at variment als you should see it buti don't know the link to it sorry about it just go to variment als and check for feild testing the 17 hmr form that i started using the cci
 
You would have thought that I had kicked someones dog with MY OPINION of the 17 Remington. The Indian quit using the bow and arrow as soon as the white boys showed him gunpowder and Winchesters. I am just saying that IN "MY" OPINION there are more dependable predator rifles out there. I do not live in an area with coyotes that pose for the shot. Therefore some of my shots are less that perfect. I don't shot them with a 7mm Rem mag or a 30-06 but, a little more insurance than a 25gr bullet is nice. Hornady (I believe the only manufacturer of the 17 bullet, but I'm not positive) recommends them for VARMITS but, doesn't mention larger predators.
 
I have not had a chance to try my 17 on a fox or coyote yet but i do know they are accurate.I would not take a long shot on a predator with this rifle but I have taken out a crow at 173 yards.I know a crow is not big but this is a rimfire rifle we are talking about it has less limits so as long as you stay within those limits I cant see why it wouldnt work and be a good fox cartrigde at that.
 
gentlemen, there is a article in the small caliber news (winter edition 2003 vol 6 no. 4 page 17) on just this subject. it compared the 17 hmr to the 17 Ackley hornet as used for a fox rifle. the experience with the 17 HMR was almost exactly the same as stated here.
the 17 Ackley hornet anchored the gray fox dead in his tracks. where as the 17 HMR only had a 50% success ratio, 3 killed and three ran off never to be seen again. the fox were hit about as square behind the front shoulder as you could ask. the results were the same with both hornady and cci ammo, which was all that was available at the time.
the 17 Ackley was loaded with 20 gr vmaxes at 3850 fps and dropped them in their tracks with the exact same shot placement.
a bobcat was shot on the last stand of the day with a center of the chest shot using the 17 HMR. the bobcat actually went down easier than the fox. this might have something to do with the fact the fox came in all pissed off and angry where as the bobcat was just curious.

all this is true, i know i wrote the article.
bob
 
after reading some of the other post on 17's and coyotes i just had to come back with a post. from 1991 thru 1993 i hunted coyotes for bounty for the county. i used a remington model 7 chambered in 17 remington. the little rifle was scary accurate, were talking .25 groups with 30 gr. berger match bullets doing 3700 fps.
in those 3 years i took over 200 coyotes with out a single runoff. granted i did put my share of second shots in during the coyotes get well whirls and did not have to take any shots over 200 yards. the second shot was so this tired old man didn't have to drag them critters any further than i had to. pelt damage was next to nothing, with very little stitching.
i know i am in good company and blaine eddy will back me up on this one with his results. his last post stated he had shot 109 coyotes this winter with his 17 athena.

bob AKA foxhunter
 
You did kick my dog! hehehe.

Some of the problem of this 17 debate to me is the fact that some posters simply say .17, and dont distinguish between the 17HMR, and the 17Rem in thier posts, so its hard to know exactly what they are using.
 
redfrog, i noticed the same thing, it is rather confusing. i hope my post were specific enough to clarify my thoughts on the difference. the 17 Remington is an extremely deadly cartridge on critters from coyotes on down. i have a friend, Roy up in Alaska he shoots wolves and wolverines with a 17 predator, a 17 remington on steroids. he is very successful with it, after all that's how he makes his living.the same holds true for Blaine Eddy, he also derives his living using a 17 caliber rifle to earn a living
 
Thats a bit disingenuous Harley....blain as I remember is a concrete contractor, and hunts coyotes in the winter. Taking only 109 coyotes after factoring in fuel, grub and time, there's no way a fella can scratch out a living getting only that many.
 
ChileRojo, is right. Blain and Q do the same thing in the winter and I'm sure that fur don't pay the bills. A hundred coyotes may bring you 3 or 4 thousand dollers, that ain't much when you think about it. I was doing what they are doing in the late 70s when fur was way up there and I had to have a normal job. One year a batch of fur we sold in Rock Springs Wyoming went for a little more then $5000, we were happy as hell but couldn't live off of it. By the way, how you doing Harley, when are you coming over? I think you'd like to check out the predator hunting museum. Same goes for you ChileRojo, you ain't that far away.
 
i stand corrected, he earns part of his living during the winter months killing coyotes, as well as his videos. thanks for using the word disingenuous instead of the word lie, other wise i might have been offended.
i guess robert redford makes a living as a actor but if i said he makes a living as an actor i would be disingenuous since i did not say he also makes money as a producer, rancher and a director.
disingenuous, maybe, nit picker no.
 


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