25/06 or 308

I'll add one other thing about the .25-06. As much as I like this cartridge I have owned rifles in other chamberings so I've been able to compare the different cartridges.

In my safe there is a Winchester model 70 Stealth in .308. It's a pretty decent cartridge and I enjoy target shooting with it. I limit the .308 to bullet weights of 168 gr and prefer 155 gr. But when it comes to hunting the rifle I reach for the the .25-06.

At one time I owned a Winchester 70 in 7mm Rem Mag. It's an OK cartridge but along side of a .300 H&H mag or Win Mag there's no contest. The .30 cals are just more versatile with more choices in bullet weights. Whoever said the 7mm Mag is not a heavy recoiling round lied. Between the 7mm Rem Mag and my Remington 700 Classic in .300 H&H mag the 7mm Mag kicks more shooting a bullet 25 gr less in weight.
 
joed, what grain bullets in 30 cal will you have to shoot to get a BC of .625, which is a 7mm 162g Hornady SST or 7mm Berger 180g with a BC of .669. Long range shooting is all about the BC.

There are some very experienced marksmen that are on this board that can utilize a 308 way out there. If you do use a 308 to that distance, the Lapua 155's are the way to go.

Since the 7mm bullets have such a great BC, then a good question would be 7/08 vs. 308, not 25/06 vs 308? Metallic silhouette shooters went to the 7/08's and 260's long ago due to much less wind drift and bullet drop on the rams at 500 meters, it's all about the BC. 260's eat barrels.
 
ackleyman, it isn't all about bc when we're talking hunting.

Effective ranges for hunting are normally out to 400. At 400 yards I don't think you'd see a huge difference with a better bc. That's why a lot of the older cartridges are still around.
 
joed, you are exactly right! This guy is wanting to shoot deer at 600 yards.

Even 400 yards is half way round the world for most people.
 
Originally Posted By: joed Personally, a deer at 600 yards is too far. I'm sure someone has shot one at that distance but it just doesn't seem practical to me.


Exactly... While it may well be possible to hit them that far out, you've lost so much velocity that you can pretty much be guaranteed tracking a wounded animal, with that cartridge. I've hit them farther than that with my .243; doesn't mean it was right; doesn't mean I should have taken the shot. Knocked the deer down, never did find it. Would I attempt it again... NO! Why did I do it that time... Didn't realize it was that far out there, ground was covered with snow, had a light snow falling, and I had 2 buddies telling me there was no way in [beeep] I could hit it.

He'd be better served thinking in the 350 - 400 yard range, if it's a situation where he's absolutely having to shoot that far away, he'd be better off with the .308 in a heavier bullet.
 
Originally Posted By: Rocky1Originally Posted By: joed Personally, a deer at 600 yards is too far. I'm sure someone has shot one at that distance but it just doesn't seem practical to me.


Exactly... While it may well be possible to hit them that far out, you've lost so much velocity that you can pretty much be guaranteed tracking a wounded animal, with that cartridge. I've hit them farther than that with my .243; doesn't mean it was right; doesn't mean I should have taken the shot. Knocked the deer down, never did find it. Would I attempt it again... NO! Why did I do it that time... Didn't realize it was that far out there, ground was covered with snow, had a light snow falling, and I had 2 buddies telling me there was no way in [beeep] I could hit it.

He'd be better served thinking in the 350 - 400 yard range, if it's a situation where he's absolutely having to shoot that far away, he'd be better off with the .308 in a heavier bullet.

I think this friend is mainly wanting to shoot paper out to 1K, But he said that since he had a deer house in a field of his that is about a mile long, he`d like to see if he could kill a deer at 600, most deer hunters here in west Tenn. never kill a deer over 100 yds, 300 would be extremely long for 99% of them. I don`t deer hunt, I only hunt coyotes with a 243 using a NF scope, my son has a 25/06 he uses for deer and his longest shot was a head shot at 330 yds. So I`m not really up to date on the larger calibers, I`m very partial to the 243
 
I've absolutely no love for the quarter bores. None.

At one time, you had to run a 208gr A-max in the .308s to equal 7mm 162gr A-max BCs. That there is a no-brainer.

I'm fairly certain I could take deer "clean" at 600yds with the right rifle/bullet combo. However, that just doesn't equate to "hunting" in my book. I like to get so close I'm afraid to blink.........
 
So, I'm curious what you folks don't like about the 25-06. I bought one a year or so ago. After a little floating, bedding and load work it shoots awesome. Who knew a Rem 700 could shoot so well! Anyway, I had it at the range yesterday and the more I shoot that rifle the more I like it. Using it on an antelope hunt this year, but don't plan on shots of more than 3-400 yards. Is it just not a great "long range" caliber based on bullet weights and ballistic coeffiecent?
 
The 25 is a cult. Seems you either hate or love it. I happen to love it.

However at 600 I would choose the .308 because of the heavier bullets avail. I would put BC behind bullet construction for sure.

But any reasonble distance would draw me to the 25. I personally would be ashamed of my skill if 600 yards were as close as I could get. But to each his own.
 
I had a pre 64 model 70 in 257 roberts that I just hated. Never seemed to group with any handload. I ditched the gun. I did give the caliber another chance, in of all guns a Ruger #1. That gun is just downright scary accurate, which I find amazing, but am very pleased with. I also own a 250 Savage that is very pleasant.

I don't hate any caliber, and have a particular fondness for some of the classics, say 7x57 and 6.5x55. Never owned a 25-06, but folks that I know that have owned them have been pleased. I like 308's too, and then again, have always had a strange fascination with 303 British. Guess I'm just a gun nut.
 
Originally Posted By: deadhorse I personally would be ashamed of my skill if 600 yards were as close as I could get. But to each his own.
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Agreed, Not trying to slam the OP but long range-hunting is best left to the "experts" who have mastered the art of doping the wind and know their rifles intimately.
 
I am no expert by any means. But since the 30-06 is the parent cartridge of the 308 and the 25-06, why not go with the 06 with a lighter bullet of some kind like a 140 to 165gr and maybe have the best of both worlds in distance and BC. Like I said, I am no Expert. I have shot a .308. Never have shot a 25-06. 25-06 may be fast, flat and accurate, seems to me the .30 is where to go. Nothing wrong with the .308, I just couldn't see having one with a 30-06 in the safe. I'm just asking a question here. Please don't be to hard on me for my opinion.

Tony
 
25-06 is almost worthless, IMHO.

Funny the countless deer, ground hogs, crow,and coyotes that have been shot with my two 25-06 didn't think so. I haven't had a deer run more than 50 yards in 5 years and that's averaging 4 deer a year. All double lung shots.

For the distance given I can not shed any light as the farthest I've ever shot a deer was 260 yards. Oh yea it was with a 25-06 and fell right where it was shot.
 
Originally Posted By: RTLOF18918B I am no expert by any means. But since the 30-06 is the parent cartridge of the 308 and the 25-06, why not go with the 06 with a lighter bullet of some kind like a 140 to 165gr and maybe have the best of both worlds in distance and BC. Like I said, I am no Expert. I have shot a .308. Never have shot a 25-06. 25-06 may be fast, flat and accurate, seems to me the .30 is where to go. Nothing wrong with the .308, I just couldn't see having one with a 30-06 in the safe. I'm just asking a question here. Please don't be to hard on me for my opinion.

Tony
The 140 wont get you the bc needed for long range. Closest is the 155 scener and it is classified as a target bullet. 168, 175, 208 class of bullets gets you in the better bc just depends on how far your shooting and how much gas behind them. We push 208s out to 1000 on warm days out of a 308 and do just fine. There are a lot of variables a guy needs to know and master in order to get first round hits on targets at longer ranges.
 
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Originally Posted By: bowhunt32So, I'm curious what you folks don't like about the 25-06.
I'm guessing the folks that don't like the .25 cals do so because there are not a lot of high bc bullets available in this caliber.

But what some don't seem to realize is a bullet is designed for a specific purpose such as varmint hunting, thin skinned game hunting, dangerous game, short range target shooting and long range target shooting. Someone hunting large dangerous game in Africa is going to pick a solid bullet (maybe even round nose with .200 bc) over a target bullet with a .600+ bc. You should never pick a bullet for use based on bc alone.

The above is why the .25-06 is still around. It wasn't designed for 1000 yard target shooting, it does extremely well hunting small to medium sized game at ranges to 400 yards or so. Every cartridge has it's limitations.

I own both a .25-06 and a .308. Which one I shoot depends on what I want to do. For hunting medium sized game at practical ranges I prefer the .25 over the .308 any day. Plus the .25-06 is not out of place hunting groundhogs with light bullets.

I'm a big fan of the .25-06, always have been.
 
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Originally Posted By: joedOriginally Posted By: bowhunt32So, I'm curious what you folks don't like about the 25-06.
I'm guessing the folks that don't like the .25 cals do so because there are not a lot of high bc bullets available in this caliber.

But what some don't seem to realize is a bullet is designed for a specific purpose such as varmint hunting, thin skinned game hunting, dangerous game, short range target shooting and long range target shooting. Someone hunting large dangerous game in Africa is going to pick a solid bullet (maybe even round nose with .200 bc) over a target bullet with a .600+ bc. You should never pick a bullet for use based on bc alone.

The above is why the .25-06 is still around. It wasn't designed for 1000 yard target shooting, it does extremely well hunting small to medium sized game at ranges to 400 yards or so. Every cartridge has it's limitations.

If you read the whole thread the question is about 600 yards not 400 yards and they most certainly do make high bc hunting bullets in other calibers that will get the job done at 600 and beyond given that the shooter is up to the task. And up to the task does not mean going out and buying a scope with holdovers and assuming the stars will line up just right so everything works. Ask any shooter who shoots extended ranges and if they are very good I would be willing to bet there rounds down range are in the high hundreds to thousands each year not a couple of shells at the range to confirm zero. Sorry if I got off track but some people have no business shooting at game at such ranges. I can first round hit an 8" gong beyond the 600 we are talking but my enjoyment when it comes to hunting comes in the form of bow hunting and seeing how close I can kill a game animal, not from how far I can wound one.
 
Originally Posted By: bowhunt32So, I'm curious what you folks don't like about the 25-06. I bought one a year or so ago. After a little floating, bedding and load work it shoots awesome. Who knew a Rem 700 could shoot so well! Anyway, I had it at the range yesterday and the more I shoot that rifle the more I like it. Using it on an antelope hunt this year, but don't plan on shots of more than 3-400 yards. Is it just not a great "long range" caliber based on bullet weights and ballistic coeffiecent?

There is no doubt that the various .257s are good on deer and lesser critters. They will kill them. Effectively. A good ways out.

That said, in order to figure out why some do not like them, I guess you have to compare them directly to their nearest competitiors, 6mms(243s) and 6.5mms(260s). Both of these calibers are highly popular in benchrest and LR competition. Both have won TONS of matches and set records. The .257s have done neither. Why? Well, you can go to higher BCs of bullets, which definitely turns shooters on. And then you can go to the fact that there are simply more inherently accurate cartridges chambered for the 6s and 6.5s. Simply put, more research has been done, more accurate cartridge designs have been developed, and better bullets exist. Ballistically, the .257s just don't bring much to the table.

As for taking game out to 600 yds, I highly doubt even the most experienced hunter could tell a difference between the 3 on deer/pronghorn or yotes.........
 
As for taking game out to 600 yds, I highly doubt even the most experienced hunter could tell a difference between the 3 on deer/pronghorn or yotes......... [/quote]

Thank you. Finally.....
 
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