Hey Byron South

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State wildlife agencies have several different surveys they use to get their estimates for various species.

Some my require a permit or mandatory check station, and assuming that all are checked/tagged, they have an exact number. Granted some may not get checked or tagged, so that would be a minimum number in that case.

Another survey would involve sending out surveys to all the people who bought a trapping license and asking then how many of each species they trapped during the season. These are not usually sent to every person who bought a license, but will usually have a statical confidence interval. In other works, the believe it to be within +/- 5% of whatever the number is.

They may add to that data collected from another survey such as a big game surver that would be sent out to deer hunters where they record other game harvested during deer season. Again, this data is extrapilated within a staticical confidnce interval. I'm not a statistician, so I can't explain it farter than that.
 
thats what i been saying we may kill that many. there is know way of knowing..

we have lot of coyotes here lots .
in that number killed in 05 i would say only a very small were taken by callers mabe 1000

WE HAVE A TON OF COYOTES,,,
PRESSURE ,, PRESSURE IS THE THING
_______________________________________________________

YELLOWHAMER


and this is just a discussion that's all I ant upset at the least i am just trying to help you guys to under stand
where we are coming from

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Only about 2-3% of Texas is high fenced. Most people outside of Texas believe it to be much higher.


weather you mean to or not I don't know,,
you playing tricks with words ,
as for 2 to 3 % as high fenced hunting , well, you saying high fences and the average guy reading this thinks
your talking ranches when your really talking pens are 3 %,,,, PRIVET RANCHES ARE MORE THEN 3%
most of the country is ranches that are privet ,,, most of you country men in Texas hunt privet places
tell me how much public land do you have in Texas for the every day hunter where he don't pay to play in some sort????
then what is the number of hunters hunting them places??

I should of said government land not public land,,,do you have any land paid for bye sports man there?????

IN SOUTH TEXAS HOW MANY ACERS ARE THERE ???
AND IN THEN ACERS HOW MUCH IS OPEN TO HUNTING ,,PUBLIC LAND

AGAIN I ASK WHAT % OF PUNLIC LAND IS THERE IN THE HOLE STATE? HOW MANY PER ACER PER LIC, HUNTER IS THEE?
 
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State wildlife agencies have several different surveys they use to get their estimates for various species.

Some my require a permit or mandatory check station, and assuming that all are checked/tagged, they have an exact number. Granted some may not get checked or tagged, so that would be a minimum number in that case.

Another survey would involve sending out surveys to all the people who bought a trapping license and asking then how many of each species they trapped during the season. These are not usually sent to every person who bought a license, but will usually have a statical confidence interval. In other works, the believe it to be within +/- 5% of whatever the number is.

They may add to that data collected from another survey such as a big game surver that would be sent out to deer hunters where they record other game harvested during deer season. Again, this data is extrapilated within a staticical confidnce interval. I'm not a statistician, so I can't explain it farter than that.




We in PA have a report card that we sand in after harvesting a deer ,
there is nothing for coyotes,,, and i don't know or ever heard of any question airs being send out and even if there was i don't think it has on there how many where called or how many where trapped or ran with dogs

but the dead count don't matter, its the live in the wood coyotes you cant estimate,

to count deer they fly around in a plain and count deer then they have a equation to help them figure deer per square miles it is all a estimation,, and you know it a very poor one at that.
there is no way on earth to count coyotes ,,,,,,
counting dead coyote can in no way tell you how many are still in the woods no way

WE IN PA HAVE LOTS OF COYOTES LETS JUST SAY THAT...Pressured coyotes but they are here!!!
 
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weather you mean to or not I don't know,,
you playing tricks with words ,
as for 2 to 3 % as high fenced hunting , well, you saying high fences and the average guy reading this thinks
your talking ranches when your really talking pens are 3 %,,,, PRIVET RANCHES ARE MORE THEN 3%
most of the country is ranches that are privet ,,, most of you country men in Texas hunt privet places
tell me how much public land do you have in Texas for the every day hunter where he don't pay to play in some sort????
then what is the number of hunters hunting them places??




Texas has about 144,000,000 (144 million acres of rural (not within a city limit) land. The most recent estimate I could find (202) for high fenced acres in Texas is 4 million.

Texas has about 2-3% of the state under high fence. Almost all of that is private land (size may vary from 100 acres to 100,000 acres.

Texas also has about 2-3% of the state in Public Land. So, the amount of public land, and High Fenced land is about the same. Maybe a little more high fenced, since we are getting more under fence as time goes by than we are public land.

So if we have 144 million acres (roughly) of huntable land, and 4-5 million are high fenced, and 4 million are public, the leaves 135 million acers of unfenced (low fence) acres in Texas.
 
scientific methods /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smiliesmack.gif

I have aked them,there scientific methods.
they fly around and count deer in the feilds them deer +
the equstion = deer per squear mile

sound scientific to me /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif

coyote don't have a tag!!!! you hunt and kill them on your general lic.. there is no report card to send in ,,,and the surveys only go to trappers that buy a fur takers tag that's how and the only way they now who is killing coyotes,,to call coyote this fur takers tag is not required,
and estimation is just that,, a estimation,, the only thing they know for shore is,, they don't know for shore how many coyotes that are in PA
 
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George, I have always dated Women with like interests I saw no reason to spend time with folks I had nothing in common with. We were there to visit her family. They all worked during the day so that gave us time to fish, hike and call critters during the day, We did very little fishing after I caught a 14 incher{some kind of trout} that would have been consdered bait here and some guy made a big deal about how good a fish it was. I thought the guy was going in after it when I threw it back /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif. We would head out at day break and come in near dark for 2 solid weeks,I was amazed at the number of coons you guys had since at that time our numbers were way down.
2 weeks time is a lot of hunting and our stands were long.

I could care less what you choose to believe or not.If I took a picture of me with a dead coyote in front of a PA sign you would swear I flew it out there with me.
I'm not going to get in a peeing match or name calling match with you. I'm here to have fun and share my experiences.
lighten up man before you have a stroke.
We are here to;
#1 learn, don't know about you but I've learned things here.
#2 share our experiences with others. {shouldn't have to try and defend every action}.
#3 to have fun without someone getting all uptight.
 
the way they find out how many of what animal is killed per year is they send out a survey. I have recieved two over the last three years. it has on there about if you call em or trap em. how many you called how many trapped where bouts you hunted em. then the average em out. I will try to get in touch with the head of the pgc and find out. but like george has stated there are alot of coyotes trapped. I would have to say out of 10 maybe one was killed being called. over the north western part of the state they have been runnin dogs for em. supposedly that makes em weary. I do not know the area I hunt does not have hound hunters hunting them. I know in my area there are only a handful killed by calling. most of them are killed while deer hunting.
 
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I could care less what you choose to believe or not.If I took a picture of me with a dead coyote in front of a PA sign you would swear I flew it out there with me.
I'm not going to get in a peeing match or name calling match with you. I'm here to have fun and share my experiences.
lighten up man before you have a stroke.
We are here to;
#1 learn, don't know about you but I've learned things here.
#2 share our experiences with others. {shouldn't have to try and defend every action}.
#3 to have fun without someone getting all uptight.





I could care less what you choose to believe or not.If I took a picture of me with a dead coyote in front of a PA sign you would swear I flew it out there with me.

No Glen i would believe yea,,photos unlike people don't lie /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif


I'm here to have fun and share my experiences.

That is the point pal . you have no experiences! other then what you hunted in your area,, but you insist on telling us about are hunting, and the critters that you never hunted...
that's what gets me going !! you speak as if you know, when you really don't.. your trying way to hard to be someone in the industry,, again when's you video coming out ,, you sight has been up for a year now with nothing but under construction notes on all its links.
You upset many glen , by you showing you arrogance on matterS that you have no field experiences in..

you trying to hard pal,

See Yellowhammer I can learn from , because he is just stating what he knows never what he don't know
but everything you write is written as if it gospel, As if you hunted coyotes in many places and have come to learn the different traits of all god huntable critters.
most everyone see's though it Glenn

you post that for 2 week you where in PA and you called in every Pennsylvania predator that we have running around in are woods.


Glenn you can fool some of the people some of the time, but you cant fool all the people all the time pal..

I hope you get in life what your looking for Glenn , I really do
 
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Does anyone know how many coyotes equals a lot? And I don't mean, "we have lots".. But honestly, what would constitute a LOT.

As an example, bioligist have a pretty good grasp on how many deer per square mile makes for over populated, so do we know how many coyotes per square mile is too many, too little or just right? (if there is such a thing as just right)??? I had a friend in GA, who was a bioligist for the Fish and Games Quail Initiative. He once told me that 1 grey fox or 1 pair (can't remember which) per 30-40 acres was ideal. On base I repeatedly saw 6 or 7 from the treestand every night, I think we were overpopulated. Are there any numbers like that out there for coyotes?

anyone? Hammer?

I assume that the number would vary depending on location, but could there be a general answer?

Too bad this discussion had to turn to personal attacks. By the way, I've seen my fair share of pretty girls from PA, at 16 I even lost my, ahhhh, never mind. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smiliesmack.gif
 
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at 16 I even lost my, ahhhh, never mind.




You guys from NJ always did start late /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

I don't know how many we have but I can say the place's I am calling the road and paths are cover in coyote droppings ..
the guys I know trapping them are doing well,. I think if a good trapper could easily take 2 or 3 of each of my calling area's .
but i have no clue to how many run the woods here
 
I had allways figured that coyotes themselfs would determine that. I allways thought that if there were more killed in a year they produced more and if not that many were killed then the would produce less. this is allways what I have been told. I will contact the old PGC furberer biologist and post what he says. he is probably the only one in pa that knows for certian.
 
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Does anyone know how many coyotes equals a lot? And I don't mean, "we have lots".. But honestly, what would constitute a LOT.



Hmmmm...good question. It sure isn't PA that's for sure!! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smiliesmack.gif
 
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Does anyone know how many coyotes equals a lot? And I don't mean, "we have lots".. But honestly, what would constitute a LOT.



Ok i have the answer ,,

The answer is ,, A LOT , Is a bit more then a tad , and a tad is a bit more them some ,

Now ,Lot's means theres a tad more them a lot ,,

you can call the PAGC ,but you will only get a quesstimation
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
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Here is one paper based on a study done in PA, dated 1991. I did find several spelling errors (missing letter probably due to converting to pdf or something)

Satus of Coyotes and Coyote Depredations in Pennsylvania


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The harvest of coyotes in Pennsylvania has increased steadily from 1978 (850 per year, Table 1). We believe thatthe annual harvest may be as high as 1,500 per year when the number killed by deer hunters is included. A 1990 survey indicated 850 coyotes were harvested by those persons buying a furtaker license. A gametake survey that includes the number of coyotes harvested by deer hunters is currently underway.




This figures are the same as numbers reported earier on page 2.


What is a LOT of coytoes? I would say that is somewhat subjective. What you I might think is a lot of coyotes, may not be that many to someone else.

Deer numbers are considered "higher" or "low" in the context of the habitat. If you have too many for the habitat, it is "high". But, a "high" density (in relation to the habitat) may be considered "low" in an area of better habitat.

In other words, if the habitat can support a deer to 10 acres, and you only have a deer to 20 acres, the density could be considered "low".

Consequently, if you have a deer per 100 acres, and the habitat will only support a deer per 200 acres, the deer density would be considered to high.

Relative food abundance will determine the density of coyotes much more than deer.

http://www.predatormastersforums.com/ubb...page=1#52466383

http://www.predatormastersforums.com/ubb...page=0#52463741
 
Towards the top of page 2 in this thread George said this
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THEY ARE HERE!!
trappers take them ,all the time I know a guy that traps like 20 a year and herd of many others taken them with traps on a regular basses ,,



20 coyotes a YEAR for a trapper are TERRIBLE numbers. Several things come to mind.

1...This "trapper" has no idea what he is doing. OR

2...The "trapper" is only trapping for fun and is not very serious about it. OR

3...There is really not very many coyoets in PA.
 
the only one I know of in the area that is serious about coyote trapping is mark zagger and he is in new york. he caught 125 this year and is dedicated.

doggin just a question nothing more how many do you catch a year or how many do you feel is a decent number?
 
you got me there George everyone knows photo's don't lie.This Texas cottontail weighed every ounce of 100 pounds. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smiliesmack.gif
normal_wabbitzilla.jpg
 
there are a lot if IF'S & POSSIBLY In that 1991 study


These study aren't scientific fact,, they are done by Biologist that are making there best educated guess,
How do they come up with number to even begin to know coyote population and mortality's if you don't know how many deer hunters kill coyote daring the firearm season, small game season ,archery deer season and bear season the freak 30 '' of snow that fell with 20 days of below zero temp, the rabies and mange that could of occurred,,, Biologist don't take all this in to account,, the little bit of info they are acquiring from trappers & scat count and accident reports and road killed coyotes is a much different number them what actually is happing .it's the best they can do becouse you cant count how many critters are out there .There is no law saying you need to tell them that you harvested a coyote ,there are no tags required to harvest coyotes, even if they sand out a question air not every body reply's , how many reply do they get back or are they getting half back and that half killed 50 coyotes so the other half must of as well
so they come up with possibly number again..(if's and possibly's) are a long way from fact..

That's all I am saying...

bottom line to this hole stur up is, we have more coyote then most think.
terrain and land isn't why we don't kill that many by methods of call, we are calling a very stressed critter
he is under attack all year long . he is very wise,, do to people pressure,, and now that we have more people calling and hunting them that is why we are killing more..

human pressure on any critter no matter where you live what terrain you hunt or the population you are hunting. the bottom line is anything pressured is harder to hunt....................................

The original poster of this thread asked Mr. South why he change from what he has said in the past to what he is saying now...
I really don't care at this point my self,, I believe most guys that talk the talk and never called a critter hear can say what they like , my feeling are that Mr, South has been hear multiple times and now is seeing they aren't that call friendly ..

But its guys like guess and his bold statements that get a guy all railed up, because there are guys out there that think guess knows what he is talking about when in fact he don't......

GLEN GUESS said he called in every predator PA as to offer in weeks that he was here after a girl
he even said he called in both RED & GRAY FOX when its rear you even find them in the same area..
 
Glenn ,,i dont need to get you, you get your self ,,,

you dont need my help kid,,

the fact is the funny rabbit will not help you from looking like a -------- well you know what i was going to say....

in 2 week here you called in every predator we have???????????????????????????????????

maybe you need to come next time the foxpro team is here in PA out trying to kill somthing..... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif

edited to add,
JUST SO YOU KNOW , GUYS LIKE YOU ARE WHAT MAKES ME NOT LIKE FOXPRO..

I will not own a call you are associated with or will I promote it to new hunters...

for a fox pro felid staff or pro staff to tell such a story as you did about calling in every predator in PA in 2 weeks, just tells me that you must tell lots of story's so how can I take you for your word when it comes to the call you use
 
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