Hunting in the East forum gone.

Not picking a side here but I am like Dave in that I fail to see where you post your hunting story or question is of such importance. None of this argument about East vs. West has anything to do with why there must be a separate place for that tribe to post their stories. Nobody has articulated why that is necessary to have separate forums. Because the conditions are different is it not still predator hunting?
 
Admittedly I rarely checked the east forum due to lack of new content. I honestly would like to know what tactics you are using there that I’m not using here. Seriously, I am always looking for new ways to improve.

Here are the top 10 from the 2022 Eastern coyote calling championship; defined as east of the Mississippi River.

Top 10:
Team 131-38 coyotes
Team 87-36 coyotes
Team 128-33 coyotes
Team 112-30 coyotes
Team 47-27 coyotes
Team 127-26 coyotes
Team 12-25 coyotes
Team 54-22 coyotes
Team 45-20 coyotes
Team 52-20 coyotes

The Top 10 teams killed 277 coyotes. I think that is a pretty good gauge of the regions potential as opposed to individual experiences based of that persons “areas” land access, determination and actual time spent in the field.

I would never look at someone who killed a pile of coyotes and shrug it off as simply due to the part of country he is hunting. Those teams in the eastern did what it takes to kill coyotes; got access to land, knew how to setup and call, could shoot and put in the time and work.

as for having a separate forum I’m good either way. I do Think it would have more activity if it was combined
 
reb8600 said:
Ok, so how many of the eastern hunters here wanting it back have as you put it "hunted all across the country successfully"? Not once or twice but successful enough to be experts and know what they are talking about? If they havent then according to you they are not experts and their opinions are not based on fact either. Since the "tactics" are different in so many locations, do we make a forum for each of them or is this just about the eastern members.


So because they are proven eastern hunters we should listen? Once again how much experience out west do the others from the east have out west to make a comparison. Because as you said, "If you haven't hunted all across the country successfully than you don't know what your talking about and your forming opinions not based on fact." There have been several from the east in the past and present.
.

I am sure the unsuccessful hunters here on PM will appreciate knowing what you think of them since "they suck". I would call that showing your ego but hey it has nothing to do with ego does it.


I dont think I ever said it was easier to kill coyotes in the east. If I did, show me the post. You are correct, I have never hunted the east and am not as successful as you so my opinion must suck. That being the case, this will be the last post I make on this subject and will not discuss it again. How many of those here that you say are very successful in the east are as you put it successful in the west also. If they are not then according to you, they dont know what they are talking about. That is how you worded that.




Now back to the question that has been asked several times that not even you have answered. What is different from east to west. Dont just say tactics as that is the only thing being said. What do you do so different in the east that nobody does in the west?? Also, where does it say the Predator forum is west only?? You also have not said what the line is for the east.

Also since it the different tactics that seem to be the argument here for putting the forum back, I would like to see you share links from your posts in the last 6 months that were discussions about tactics. I am pretty sure that just about all the posts even made in that forum were just posts about successful hunts and not discussions about tactics.
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I've came to the realization that REGARDLESS of what I say, your going to oppose it, regardless if I'm right, wrong or indifferent, this thread or any other. You've done your very best to spin doctor this into an ego or personal thing and contort wording for your support in eliminating the eastern forum and your stance. Whatever.

I didn't take something from these guys, you did and some others, and now they want it back so make a change, pretty simple...
 
Driven2tri24 said:
KINO is dead on.
Not even in the same realm of difficulty. Not the same stand setups, sounds when calling, bait sites/setups. Guys aren't driving 2 miles throwing E-caller out and killing 1 every stand on virgin ears with Cagie Cottontail and claiming it's the "same". Guys here are calling educated coyotes accustomed to living among us. As coyote calling increases(both day and night) the difference becomes more and more evident. We can't just use Cagie Cottontail on Virgin ears every 2 miles during the day to put one in the truck and have a dozen in one trip..lol
Bring the forum back ...Pretty Please
or I'm certain the 1015 guys who surf it regularly will turn to Social Media for more "pertinent to them" info like the flood of others already leaving PM.
No disrespect intended..just facts.
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I can't do any of the above either, and I live about as far West as possible. Like, I can literally see the Golden Gate Bridge and the Pacific Ocean from work every day. I guess that makes me Super-West? My successful coyote spots are on slivers of private ag land surrounded by tractor activity and white pickups that shoot at them every chance they get, and slivers of undesirable overhunted public land others pass by. Vigin coyote ears? Ha! Calling, let alone killing 1 on every stand yeah... right. More than 1 in a day is way above average here! My West region actually seems very close to how you guys describe the East. Coyotes are here but not in big numbers and I work pretty hard for every one.

I think combining East/West is good. More people will see more info. I for one rarely visited the East or North forums because it's one more seperate place to click and when I did I mostly just saw brag pics which are cool but I didn't feel there was much educational info for me.
 
crazyyote said:
220 Swift,
One thing very different in the East, at least in Ohio, is you are supposed to carry written permission from landowners when you hunt. That means any private land you obtain permission to be on. It takes quite some time to amass a lot of properties to hunt, at least in my area in Northern Ohio. Some places I hunt are only about 5 acre lots, and as crazy as it sounds they can be productive year after year. It's tough in the East, really is.
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Same here as far West as it's possible to go. Written permission required by law, and generally smaller properties.
 
IF it's not different than ...WHY was the forum ever created?
Nowadays if you say you want Blue, then everyone hears...(You HATE Red).
Guys from out West, NOBODY is trying to take anything from your sense of accomplishment saying it's harder in the East. Your challenges are different. We don't have to be marksman and experts with wind drift, because we have fewer areas that exceed 200 yd shots. A lot more guys calling in each other's laps and more baiting tactics than you guys employ. Some call timber with shotguns. IT's different enough to warrant it's own forum. There are other forums on here that have ZERO relevance to PREDATOR HUNTING(and hence a lot more disposable), yet because the right people WANT them they remain unquestioned.
After hearing the strong response from members to this administrative action, Doubling down it is just being stubborn and expressing your lack of concern. I doubt I'd leave over it, but I imagine the road this is going down, several of us might.

FWIW, I don't think anyone is being "childish" stating they will leave if you remove the reason they came here and contributed for years.
I think refusing to listen to your members is "childish"..
 
So I have been watching this thread, reading with an open mind, and really trying to see the true merits of each point of view. There are some good legitimate points made on both sides, even if some of the delivery has been less than optimal.

I have been a coyote hunter for 35 years (at least) and on this board for nearly 20. Have a degree in Wildlife Biology, do a little ADC work here and there on the side. I have been a serious student of the coyote for a long time. I don't have a dog in this fight as far as being an "eastern" hunter. I am not an eastern hunter. But then again, even though I am "West of the Mississippi" I don't consider myself a "western" hunter either. I consider western places like Nevada, Utah, Arizona, Montana, places with big tracts of public BLM and Forestry land. But that is just me. If you live those places and don't agree with my take on that, I don't have an issue with it. Then again, I am not really a "predator" hunter either. I don't hunt lions, or wolves, or lynx, and very few bobcats/foxes. Pretty much in my daily hunting I target coyotes and pigs. To be honest I am not a label type person. In fact, I resist most types of labels completely because I feel in general they just tend to divide groups and not bring them together. EXACTLY LIKE WHAT IS HAPPENEING HERE.

So, sorry for yelling at you guys with that last sentence. But I feel it was a point that needed to be made, to remind folks, and here is why.

There are differences from east/west, north/south, however you want to classify. PA is not the same as GA, even though both are east. The PNW is not the same as Nevada, both west. STX is not the same as Manitoba, both centerline North America. Kansas is not the same as any of the above. Different areas are different. Land access, laws, weather/clothing, means and methods, seasons, predominant prey species, vegetation, timing of breeding season, LOCAL/CULTURAL STYLES OF HUNTING, all kinds of issues. All of these nuances must be taken into consideration as far as the local area. But even with all of that the coyotes biology is still the same from place to place. That is genetically coded in. A coyote in any of those areas may (probably will) have different learned behavior and respond to different stimuli. But his biology IS the same, his life cycle is the same. And it does not take great distances or huge geographical shifts to kick (sometimes significant) behavioral changes into effect. Those can happen in as little as 5 or 10 miles, and in as few as just a couple of weeks.

My point in all this being, we all have way more in common than we have differences. Most of the best coyote hunters I know never stop learning. They never think, "I know enough now." Coyote behavior is constantly in flux as the environment around them changes. The great hunters are constantly scouting and in tune with these changes as they occur. They know what is happening in their own particular hunting areas, right now. And that applies no matter what part of the country you are in. Personally I really enjoy seeing all the posts from members from all the various areas around the country. There are always little things you can pick up. Tricks that are different from the other callers in your own geographic area that you can use to give you an edge. You can learn something from any one, even if it is what not to do.

So, I am in favor of a combined forum, strictly on that basis. But by no means am I totally committed to it. I see the eastern hunters point of view and respect it. If having a separate forum is that big of a thing for y'all, then I have no issue with it whatsoever. The bigger issue to me is that I enjoy you guys stuff and want you to stick around.

The problem I see from the outside is that now the change has been made, restoring that forum might be really tricky. Perhaps even near impossible. Adding the forum back in would be simple enough I would imagine. Gathering up all of those old posts and putting them back in there, IDK. Might be a herculean task to sort it all back out. I'm no computer guy so I don't know. But I know it is not as simple as hitting the back button.

Anyways, just some thoughts from an old country boy who likes to kill coyotes. Hope everyone can work things out and stick around, because I like seeing all of you guys content. It is what makes this a place I have been coming back to since 2004.
 
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Yellowhammer said:
Facts? Now talk about exaggeration! Have you ever actually hunted out west?
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Actually ...I've never hunted Coyotes out West, but have lived and hunted Colorado and it's bordering states for Elk/Muleys/Bear/Antelope for years. This doesn't make me an expert, but I have a general idea to know that it's just different terrain, hunting pressure, population etc.
 
Hey guys, why can't we all just get along? I visit this site multiple times daily and cherry pick info and experiences as presented, no matter where you are from. I have bought and sold items without regard to north, south, east or west. I have a sense of camaraderie here, a member welcomed by all. We have enough division in this country and I see no place for that here. Happy Thanksgiving and God bless all!!!
 
It's a discussion that needs to happen.

Some things everyone should know, too, though.

So, it was me that did the moving of posts from one forum to another. Me... And not intentionally, but just by being dumb, I moved them in a way that will make it very difficult at best to get them sorted back out and moved back. I don't know how to do it. Stu thinks it's probably not possible.

If the Hunting in the East forum comes back in some fashion, it's not going to have all the old posts in it. Anyone that is mad about that, I don't blame you. But don't be mad at all of PM - that was my own, personal, dumb mistake. Didn't mean to. But I did... And I don't blame anyone for being mad at me for it.

An open discussion about bringing it back is a good thing to have, regardless. I think I've clearly stated why I thought it was a good idea in the first place. And I do still think those reasons are valid. But I don't make any decisions on anything here. I'm just one vote. And I'm willing to listen to reasonable, thoughtful, helpful conversation towards reaching a thoughtful consensus. But, again, to be clear, I'm speaking for myself as one vote on the BoD.

- DAA
 
Dave, I don't think anyone believes the East Forum and Baiting Forum were dropped to offend eastern or bait hunters. It was, I feel confident, a decision that was made trying to improve the website and make it more user friendly. We understand that, and that no malice was involved in the decision making. Some of us have been around long enough to remember when other forums were added and some of those forums were kept in place this time. To me at least, it's not really a matter of east vs. west hunting or even baiting versus calling. It is a matter of making members feel they are valued. When some forums are kept and others dropped, it leaves the appearance that those methods or places were not highly valued by the BOD.

Which, leads me to this. What is the purpose of the BOD? Since they are not elected, but rather selected, who are they supposed to serve? Is it the website or the members making up the website and who try and add fresh content to it? The BOD is heavily selected from the west. That in itself is apt to make eastern hunters feel they are less important and their opinions are less valued. So, I'll be very direct here. When current MODS and BOD members had forums that were added at their request over the years and those forums were kept intact while the two I have mentioned were dropped, it gives the appearance again that eastern and bait hunters aren't really valued here. I'm pretty sure the BOD and MODS can't see that and that it is not intentional on their part. When one is inside the "Bubble" it can be very difficult to see outside it.

I appreciate the difficulty that all of you have in the decision-making process and since it is mostly volunteer, makes it even more so. I just don't happen to believe that keeping those two Forums intact should have been considered detrimental to Predator Masters or the efficiency of the website.
 
DoubleUp said:
Which, leads me to this. What is the purpose of the BOD? Since they are not elected, but rather selected, who are they supposed to serve? Is it the website or the members making up the website and who try and add fresh content to it? The BOD is heavily selected from the west. That in itself is apt to make eastern hunters feel they are less important and their opinions are less valued. So, I'll be very direct here.
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As the newest, or at least the least experienced BOD member. I'm not qualified to give a definitive answer. To me, personally, the website and the members are joined at the hip. What's good for one is good for the other. And my purpose, single minded purpose, as a member of the BOD is to bring this place back from the near dead and get it not back to what it used to be, but towards what I feel it always should have been. Honestly, I have a goal for Predatormasters in mind, that is within sight, that when reached, I think I will have served my purpose and it will be time for me to step down. I'm really not well suited for the job! I'm far too action and results oriented and that just tends to make people mad.

Members are being heard loud and clear though. Even though I do, still, strongly believe that this move will have measurably better results for the entire board a year from now, and that going back will be a drag on growth, yet, even I am starting to come around to just giving you all what you want, as far as we can (see my screw up post above...). Even though I think it's the wrong move for the one or two year growth of Predatormasters.

- DAA
 
My mother served Liver for dinner one night cause it was good for us. All 4 of us kids took 1 bite and refused to eat it, We where sent to bed hungry. Me being the youngest, crying and hungry. I recall the words that my father said to here 58 years ago, I could hear through the wall.

He said " I don't give a Damn how good for them it is" "It ain't worth nothing if they don't eat it"
He added to that. But we never had liver ever again!

Going to bed now LOL . Happy Thanksgiving
 
I didn't want to quote your whole post DAA cause I agree with the bulk of it.

"Members are being heard loud and clear though. Even though I do, still, strongly believe that this move will have measurably better results for the entire board a year from now"

Like my mother in the above analogy "You strongly believe that this is good for us"
This is Liver to some of us.

George Bush didn't like broccoli
 
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