If I were the devil
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Fursniper
Active member
Originally Posted By: fw707Fursniper,Did you think about the doctrine of election/predestination, as opposed your doctrine of free will?
I was wondering what would cause you to choose one over the other.
I do things for God's kingdom, not for my kingdom. I choose to live my life so that it has a bigger purpose. Thus, I use my free will to get closer to God so I can do things according to God's purpose for my life.
I was wondering what would cause you to choose one over the other.
I do things for God's kingdom, not for my kingdom. I choose to live my life so that it has a bigger purpose. Thus, I use my free will to get closer to God so I can do things according to God's purpose for my life.
Originally Posted By: FursniperOriginally Posted By: fw707Fursniper,Did you think about the doctrine of election/predestination, as opposed your doctrine of free will?
I was wondering what would cause you to choose one over the other.
I do things for God's kingdom, not for my kingdom. I choose to live my life so that it has a bigger purpose. Thus, I use my free will to get closer to God so I can do things according to God's purpose for my life.
I expected you’d have an opinion on the predestination deal, since it’s pretty much opposite of the free will option.
I guess it’s just another contradiction in the infallible book, and this one is a pretty big one.
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I was wondering what would cause you to choose one over the other.
I do things for God's kingdom, not for my kingdom. I choose to live my life so that it has a bigger purpose. Thus, I use my free will to get closer to God so I can do things according to God's purpose for my life.
I expected you’d have an opinion on the predestination deal, since it’s pretty much opposite of the free will option.
I guess it’s just another contradiction in the infallible book, and this one is a pretty big one.
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tnshootist
New member
It's not a contradiction at all if you understand the whole thing.
You don't need me to explain I am sure.
You don't need me to explain I am sure.
Originally Posted By: tnshootistIt's not a contradiction at all if you understand the whole thing.
You don't need me to explain I am sure.
Yes, I would like for you to explain it.
I hope you can explain it as if you were explaining it to a person who believes that he was chosen and his name was written in a book of life before the universe was created, and you have been doomed to eternal damm-nation since the time he was chosen.
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You don't need me to explain I am sure.
Yes, I would like for you to explain it.
I hope you can explain it as if you were explaining it to a person who believes that he was chosen and his name was written in a book of life before the universe was created, and you have been doomed to eternal damm-nation since the time he was chosen.
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Fursniper
Active member
Originally Posted By: FW707 Yes, I would like for you to explain it.
I hope you can explain it as if you were explaining it to a person who believes that he was chosen and his name was written in a book of life before the universe was created, and you have been doomed to eternal damm-nation since the time he was chosen.
Where in the Bible does it state your name gets put into the Book of Life before you are born?
If that was the case, an impure person could enter heaven.
Also, where does it state in the Bible that God is an unloving God to those who have seeked Him, repented, and sincerely asked for forgiveness?
I hope you can explain it as if you were explaining it to a person who believes that he was chosen and his name was written in a book of life before the universe was created, and you have been doomed to eternal damm-nation since the time he was chosen.
Where in the Bible does it state your name gets put into the Book of Life before you are born?
If that was the case, an impure person could enter heaven.
Also, where does it state in the Bible that God is an unloving God to those who have seeked Him, repented, and sincerely asked for forgiveness?
Originally Posted By: FursniperOriginally Posted By: FW707 Yes, I would like for you to explain it.
I hope you can explain it as if you were explaining it to a person who believes that he was chosen and his name was written in a book of life before the universe was created, and you have been doomed to eternal damm-nation since the time he was chosen.
Where in the Bible does it state your name gets put into the Book of Life before you are born?
If that was the case, an impure person could enter heaven.
Also, where does it state in the Bible that God is an unloving God to those who have seeked Him, repented, and sincerely asked for forgiveness?
In the Eternal Covenant we see that God has given a certain number of people to the Son and that the Son came to redeem them, to "lose none of them" (John 6:39). We can conclude from this that God had in mind a certain people whom would be His elect. Since God knows all things, He knows those whom He has chosen. Hence, they are predestined from the very beginning of time.
Supporting scriptures are included:
https://www.calvinistcorner.com/predestination.htm
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I hope you can explain it as if you were explaining it to a person who believes that he was chosen and his name was written in a book of life before the universe was created, and you have been doomed to eternal damm-nation since the time he was chosen.
Where in the Bible does it state your name gets put into the Book of Life before you are born?
If that was the case, an impure person could enter heaven.
Also, where does it state in the Bible that God is an unloving God to those who have seeked Him, repented, and sincerely asked for forgiveness?
In the Eternal Covenant we see that God has given a certain number of people to the Son and that the Son came to redeem them, to "lose none of them" (John 6:39). We can conclude from this that God had in mind a certain people whom would be His elect. Since God knows all things, He knows those whom He has chosen. Hence, they are predestined from the very beginning of time.
Supporting scriptures are included:
https://www.calvinistcorner.com/predestination.htm
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Fursniper
Active member
Originally Posted By: fw707 In the Eternal Covenant we see that God has given a certain number of people to the Son and that the Son came to redeem them, to "lose none of them" (John 6:39). We can conclude from this that God had in mind a certain people whom would be His elect. Since God knows all things, He knows those whom He has chosen. Hence, they are predestined from the very beginning of time.
Supporting scriptures are included:
https://www.calvinistcorner.com/predestination.htmquote=fw707]
I read the Bible and interpret it myself. I don't need false prophets interpreting the Bible for me so I will follow them. I do not believe in Calvinism. It is based on the theological beliefs and teaching of John Calvin (1509-1564), a leader of the Reformation. There are all kinds of religious cult leaders out there trying to get a following. Don't drink their Kool-Aid!
Supporting scriptures are included:
https://www.calvinistcorner.com/predestination.htmquote=fw707]
I read the Bible and interpret it myself. I don't need false prophets interpreting the Bible for me so I will follow them. I do not believe in Calvinism. It is based on the theological beliefs and teaching of John Calvin (1509-1564), a leader of the Reformation. There are all kinds of religious cult leaders out there trying to get a following. Don't drink their Kool-Aid!
Originally Posted By: FursniperOriginally Posted By: fw707 In the Eternal Covenant we see that God has given a certain number of people to the Son and that the Son came to redeem them, to "lose none of them" (John 6:39). We can conclude from this that God had in mind a certain people whom would be His elect. Since God knows all things, He knows those whom He has chosen. Hence, they are predestined from the very beginning of time.
Supporting scriptures are included:
https://www.calvinistcorner.com/predestination.htmquote=fw707]
I read the Bible and interpret it myself. I don't need false prophets interpreting the Bible for me so I will follow them. I do not believe in Calvinism. It is based on the theological beliefs and teaching of John Calvin (1509-1564), a leader of the Reformation. There are all kinds of religious cult leaders out there trying to get a following. Don't drink their Kool-Aid!
”The Christian Reformed Church contains 300,000 members in the United States and Canada. It started as part of the reform movement by John Calvin in the mid 16th century and was imported to North America by Dutch immigrants in 1848, according to the church's website. It separated from the Dutch movement to become its own American entity in 1857.”
”Here are five Christian denominations that identify with Calvinist beliefs.
Primitive Baptist or Reformed Baptist Churches. ...
Presbyterian Churches. ...
Reformed Churches. ...
The United Church of Christ. ...
The Protestant Reformed Churches in America.”
http://www.newsmax.com/t/newsmax/article/636130
How do you differentiate between “cults” and denominations?
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Supporting scriptures are included:
https://www.calvinistcorner.com/predestination.htmquote=fw707]
I read the Bible and interpret it myself. I don't need false prophets interpreting the Bible for me so I will follow them. I do not believe in Calvinism. It is based on the theological beliefs and teaching of John Calvin (1509-1564), a leader of the Reformation. There are all kinds of religious cult leaders out there trying to get a following. Don't drink their Kool-Aid!
”The Christian Reformed Church contains 300,000 members in the United States and Canada. It started as part of the reform movement by John Calvin in the mid 16th century and was imported to North America by Dutch immigrants in 1848, according to the church's website. It separated from the Dutch movement to become its own American entity in 1857.”
”Here are five Christian denominations that identify with Calvinist beliefs.
Primitive Baptist or Reformed Baptist Churches. ...
Presbyterian Churches. ...
Reformed Churches. ...
The United Church of Christ. ...
The Protestant Reformed Churches in America.”
http://www.newsmax.com/t/newsmax/article/636130
How do you differentiate between “cults” and denominations?
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swampwalker
New member
Putting The whole message of the Bible aside, whether you think it's good or bad. can someone explain, how in the hades does a modern man end up worshiping a God that honors a "blood sacrifice" system? I mean, due to their ignorance of the natural world, I give the Aztec's a little wiggle room, for the thousands of people they've murdered on the alter. I also give some slack to the early jews, for the hundreds of thousands of animals they've wastefully bled out, as they've seeked their mythical "atonement".
Modern man on the other hand, I expect a little more from. maybe I'm missing something here, but seems to me the whole foundation of Christianity is built off blood sacrifice? To an all loving God? That had hundreds of thousands of animals killed to temporarily absolve sin?
I wonder if Jesus never came, would our farm animals be safe? Just something to think about.
Oh yeah, very conveniently btw, a lot of money was made to sacrifice these animals.seems like quite a racket, they had going on back then. Some things never change in the business of "sin"
Modern man on the other hand, I expect a little more from. maybe I'm missing something here, but seems to me the whole foundation of Christianity is built off blood sacrifice? To an all loving God? That had hundreds of thousands of animals killed to temporarily absolve sin?
I wonder if Jesus never came, would our farm animals be safe? Just something to think about.
Oh yeah, very conveniently btw, a lot of money was made to sacrifice these animals.seems like quite a racket, they had going on back then. Some things never change in the business of "sin"
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Did the cow you ate get killed, or did you go out and hack off a steak with it alive?
Come on swampy.. You can't seriously believe that killing something in the name of their religion doesn't mean they didn't eat it.
Where did you get that idea?? Have you seen a sacrifice? In Africa they do that today, yes it's part of their spiritual beliefs. But, stop and think for a minute about the idea that they are killing something in the name of their Belief, a honor as they see it, and then just toss the animal aside?
Buddhist, as an example have offerings all the time. Their's don't involve killing, but it's still along the same lines.
If you really want to learn vs. acting like a troll here, get out and learn, not read some internet site, get out and learn first hand.
Come on swampy.. You can't seriously believe that killing something in the name of their religion doesn't mean they didn't eat it.
Where did you get that idea?? Have you seen a sacrifice? In Africa they do that today, yes it's part of their spiritual beliefs. But, stop and think for a minute about the idea that they are killing something in the name of their Belief, a honor as they see it, and then just toss the animal aside?
Buddhist, as an example have offerings all the time. Their's don't involve killing, but it's still along the same lines.
If you really want to learn vs. acting like a troll here, get out and learn, not read some internet site, get out and learn first hand.
Fursniper
Active member
Originally Posted By: fw707 How do you differentiate between “cults” and denominations?
I consider a cult to be more of a destructive religious group that can be either Christian or non-Christian. It can be destructive by how it differs from the historic mainstream interpretation of the Bible. It can also be destructive by how the group is structured for power and control over its followers.
I consider a denomination to be Christian based that uses the old and new testament. They have a mainstream interpretation of the Bible and they are not destructive. Different denominations are just different styles of teaching the word of God. It is important that there are a diversity of denominations so God can reach out and connect with different types of people. One denomination is not better than another.
My interpretation of Calvinism is that it is a borderline cult because it is destructive. I do not agree with their views that God is hateful, unloving, not having grace, and playing favorites to elite groups of people.
I consider a cult to be more of a destructive religious group that can be either Christian or non-Christian. It can be destructive by how it differs from the historic mainstream interpretation of the Bible. It can also be destructive by how the group is structured for power and control over its followers.
I consider a denomination to be Christian based that uses the old and new testament. They have a mainstream interpretation of the Bible and they are not destructive. Different denominations are just different styles of teaching the word of God. It is important that there are a diversity of denominations so God can reach out and connect with different types of people. One denomination is not better than another.
My interpretation of Calvinism is that it is a borderline cult because it is destructive. I do not agree with their views that God is hateful, unloving, not having grace, and playing favorites to elite groups of people.
Fursniper
Active member
Originally Posted By: swampwalkerPutting The whole message of the Bible aside, whether you think it's good or bad. can someone explain, how in the hades does a modern man end up worshiping a God that honors a "blood sacrifice" system? I mean, due to their ignorance of the natural world, I give the Aztec's a little wiggle room, for the thousands of people they've murdered on the alter. I also give some slack to the early jews, for the hundreds of thousands of animals they've wastefully bled out, as they've seeked their mythical "atonement".
Modern man on the other hand, I expect a little more from. maybe I'm missing something here, but seems to me the whole foundation of Christianity is built off blood sacrifice? To an all loving God? That had hundreds of thousands of animals killed to temporarily absolve sin?
I wonder if Jesus never came, would our farm animals be safe? Just something to think about.
Oh yeah, very conveniently btw, a lot of money was made to sacrifice these animals.seems like quite a racket, they had going on back then. Some things never change in the business of "sin"
I'll try to explain it, but I'll probably need some help.
The first laws that mankind lived by started in the Old Testament. The Book of Leviticus describes how animals were sacrificed for the purposes of a sin offering. People did things the way they did because Moses said so and he had communications with God. The first few books of Moses is the basis of the Jewish faith. I do not know why God wanted things to start out this way and use animals as sin offerings.
My guess is that Jesus was going to be used as a sin offering thousands of years later to take away the sins of the world. God probably knew this ahead of time. There are hundreds of prophesies that describe how God was going to come again that were added to the Old Testament by other authors over a thousand plus of years. When Jesus came, he fulfilled the hundreds of prophesies that were predicted to happen in the Old Testament.
When Jesus came to the world, he was born Jewish, The laws of the land were still based on the Old Testament. Anyone who did not go along with those law were killed. Jesus ended up changing how things were done. Jesus also changed other traditions that man had invented to worship God. This was the start of Christianity.
Jesus started a new way to worship God which began at the "Last Supper." Instead of animal sacrifices, bread represented the body of Christ and wine represented the blood of Christ. It is taken by Christians in remembrance of Jesus and for the sacrifice he made to use his body as a sin offering for the world.
People that believe Jesus is the son of God, who repent, and ask for forgiveness of their sins can be made pure and enter Heaven.
Modern man on the other hand, I expect a little more from. maybe I'm missing something here, but seems to me the whole foundation of Christianity is built off blood sacrifice? To an all loving God? That had hundreds of thousands of animals killed to temporarily absolve sin?
I wonder if Jesus never came, would our farm animals be safe? Just something to think about.
Oh yeah, very conveniently btw, a lot of money was made to sacrifice these animals.seems like quite a racket, they had going on back then. Some things never change in the business of "sin"
I'll try to explain it, but I'll probably need some help.
The first laws that mankind lived by started in the Old Testament. The Book of Leviticus describes how animals were sacrificed for the purposes of a sin offering. People did things the way they did because Moses said so and he had communications with God. The first few books of Moses is the basis of the Jewish faith. I do not know why God wanted things to start out this way and use animals as sin offerings.
My guess is that Jesus was going to be used as a sin offering thousands of years later to take away the sins of the world. God probably knew this ahead of time. There are hundreds of prophesies that describe how God was going to come again that were added to the Old Testament by other authors over a thousand plus of years. When Jesus came, he fulfilled the hundreds of prophesies that were predicted to happen in the Old Testament.
When Jesus came to the world, he was born Jewish, The laws of the land were still based on the Old Testament. Anyone who did not go along with those law were killed. Jesus ended up changing how things were done. Jesus also changed other traditions that man had invented to worship God. This was the start of Christianity.
Jesus started a new way to worship God which began at the "Last Supper." Instead of animal sacrifices, bread represented the body of Christ and wine represented the blood of Christ. It is taken by Christians in remembrance of Jesus and for the sacrifice he made to use his body as a sin offering for the world.
People that believe Jesus is the son of God, who repent, and ask for forgiveness of their sins can be made pure and enter Heaven.
Originally Posted By: Fursniper
People that believe Jesus is the son of God, who repent, and ask for forgiveness of their sins can be made pure and enter Heaven.
How about the folks that don’t meet that requirement?
Do you believe a loving god will send them to a literal, eternal fiery he11?
People that believe Jesus is the son of God, who repent, and ask for forgiveness of their sins can be made pure and enter Heaven.
How about the folks that don’t meet that requirement?
Do you believe a loving god will send them to a literal, eternal fiery he11?
tnshootist
New member
God don't send anyone.If you send yourself He will let you.
If a man wants to show God how independent and proud he is God will let him.
If a man wants to show God how independent and proud he is God will let him.
Originally Posted By: tnshootistGod don't send anyone.If you send yourself He will let you.
If a man wants to show God how independent and proud he is God will let him.
Well that’s certainly an interesting perspective!
You get to keep your image of your loving and merciful god in your imagination, and you still get the satisfaction of believing that people who don’t share your fantasy will suffer an eternal punishment!
Do y’all believe in a literal fiery he11 of eternal torment and misery?
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If a man wants to show God how independent and proud he is God will let him.
Well that’s certainly an interesting perspective!
You get to keep your image of your loving and merciful god in your imagination, and you still get the satisfaction of believing that people who don’t share your fantasy will suffer an eternal punishment!
Do y’all believe in a literal fiery he11 of eternal torment and misery?
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Fursniper
Active member
Originally Posted By: fw707Originally Posted By: Fursniper
People that believe Jesus is the son of God, who repent, and ask for forgiveness of their sins can be made pure and enter Heaven.
How about the folks that don’t meet that requirement?
Do you believe a loving god will send them to a literal, eternal fiery he11?
I don't know, it is not for me to judge.
According to John 3:16, For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
Mathew 7:14 For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.
People that believe Jesus is the son of God, who repent, and ask for forgiveness of their sins can be made pure and enter Heaven.
How about the folks that don’t meet that requirement?
Do you believe a loving god will send them to a literal, eternal fiery he11?
I don't know, it is not for me to judge.
According to John 3:16, For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
Mathew 7:14 For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.
a denomination is what I believe, a cult is what someone else believes that I don't.
it often involves odd requirements such as flavorade or castration...
it often involves odd requirements such as flavorade or castration...