If I were the devil
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Fursniper
Active member
Originally Posted By: fw707Ok Fursniper,
tn never answers a direct question. Maybe you will.
Do you believe in a literal fiery he11 of eternal torment and misery?
Yes,
I believe the Bible to be true, but I have a hard time wrapping my mind around some of it. The Bible does make references to a place like that. Here are a couple. i think there are more.
Judgement of Satan
Revelations 20:10 And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
Judgement of the Dead
Revelations 20:15 Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.
tn never answers a direct question. Maybe you will.
Do you believe in a literal fiery he11 of eternal torment and misery?
Yes,
I believe the Bible to be true, but I have a hard time wrapping my mind around some of it. The Bible does make references to a place like that. Here are a couple. i think there are more.
Judgement of Satan
Revelations 20:10 And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
Judgement of the Dead
Revelations 20:15 Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.
Originally Posted By: FursniperOriginally Posted By: fw707Ok Fursniper,
tn never answers a direct question. Maybe you will.
Do you believe in a literal fiery he11 of eternal torment and misery?
Yes,
I believe the Bible to be true, but I have a hard time wrapping my mind around some of it. The Bible does make references to a place like that. Here are a couple. i think there are more.
Judgement of Satan
Revelations 20:10 And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
Judgement of the Dead
Revelations 20:15 Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.
If I was forced to watch ISIS lock a human up in a cage, soak them down with gasoline, and then burn them to death, I think it would take me several months at least until I could sleep all night.
If anybody could look forward to the idea of an eternity in paradise, while knowing that even one friend or family member, or even one stranger, will be burning in misery for eternity, that person has something broken inside of them.
If I honestly believed that, I think I would be so crippled by grief that I couldn’t function.
*
tn never answers a direct question. Maybe you will.
Do you believe in a literal fiery he11 of eternal torment and misery?
Yes,
I believe the Bible to be true, but I have a hard time wrapping my mind around some of it. The Bible does make references to a place like that. Here are a couple. i think there are more.
Judgement of Satan
Revelations 20:10 And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
Judgement of the Dead
Revelations 20:15 Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.
If I was forced to watch ISIS lock a human up in a cage, soak them down with gasoline, and then burn them to death, I think it would take me several months at least until I could sleep all night.
If anybody could look forward to the idea of an eternity in paradise, while knowing that even one friend or family member, or even one stranger, will be burning in misery for eternity, that person has something broken inside of them.
If I honestly believed that, I think I would be so crippled by grief that I couldn’t function.
*
tnshootist
New member
Why is it not possible that a person is responsible for his own decisions.
You have asked several times about a place of torment and who goes there and why.
I wonder why you are not interested in Heaven and who goes there and why.
If a man has his heart set on getting to Heaven he don't have to worry about he)).
I have a longing for Heaven not a fear of he)).
I hesitate to give direct answers to some questions because I know I am not qualified.
I can tell you only what I believe.
If I make it till tomorrow I will have another day to try to understand and do a little better.
So far I have lasted through five heart attacks,blood poisoning,auto wrecks,motorcycle wrecks,shot at but not hit,big truck wheels coming off,working on towers and things where one mistake would have been it.
For some reason I am still here.
When someone asks if there is God I have to say yes.
If asked to explain His plan in detail I can not. I can tell you what I believe. I am just a man.
I think it would be a better world to live in if everyone tried as best he can to follow Jesus.
You have asked several times about a place of torment and who goes there and why.
I wonder why you are not interested in Heaven and who goes there and why.
If a man has his heart set on getting to Heaven he don't have to worry about he)).
I have a longing for Heaven not a fear of he)).
I hesitate to give direct answers to some questions because I know I am not qualified.
I can tell you only what I believe.
If I make it till tomorrow I will have another day to try to understand and do a little better.
So far I have lasted through five heart attacks,blood poisoning,auto wrecks,motorcycle wrecks,shot at but not hit,big truck wheels coming off,working on towers and things where one mistake would have been it.
For some reason I am still here.
When someone asks if there is God I have to say yes.
If asked to explain His plan in detail I can not. I can tell you what I believe. I am just a man.
I think it would be a better world to live in if everyone tried as best he can to follow Jesus.
tnshootist
New member
Since you bring it up I have watched someone burn to death and listened to their screams.
I have held someones head in my lap with my thumb over the bullet hole under their eye.
I have held little childrens limp body in my arms.
I have done a lot of things.
I have traveled the full circle from anger at God to just not understanding to humility and understanding that He does not have to explain Himself to me.
Because I also have seen people injured so bad I didn't think they could last another minute but they did. I have seen strength and grace beyond what I would have thought a man could have.Most if they said anything contributed their strength to their faith.
I have seen some healed and some not and I came to understand it was not necessary that I understand.
I didn't just wake up one morning and feel as I do now.
It has been a journey.
I have held someones head in my lap with my thumb over the bullet hole under their eye.
I have held little childrens limp body in my arms.
I have done a lot of things.
I have traveled the full circle from anger at God to just not understanding to humility and understanding that He does not have to explain Himself to me.
Because I also have seen people injured so bad I didn't think they could last another minute but they did. I have seen strength and grace beyond what I would have thought a man could have.Most if they said anything contributed their strength to their faith.
I have seen some healed and some not and I came to understand it was not necessary that I understand.
I didn't just wake up one morning and feel as I do now.
It has been a journey.
no, I was thinking of jonestown & the heaven's gate bunch.
tnshootist
New member
I knew you would show your usual class.
My experiences that shaped who I am today did not come from being an internet warrior.
You brought up the subject of terrible things and how you would be wracked with grief and so on.
Well It's not just an abstract thought for me. I can tell you what it smells like and the taste you get in your mouth.
There are many others who have similar or worse experiences that has shaped their lives.
Your catchy response tell me you have no such knowledge and no respect for anything.
I was not by myself when these things and others happened. Some of it is public record.
But I could not care any less what you think.
You sir are all mouth.
My experiences that shaped who I am today did not come from being an internet warrior.
You brought up the subject of terrible things and how you would be wracked with grief and so on.
Well It's not just an abstract thought for me. I can tell you what it smells like and the taste you get in your mouth.
There are many others who have similar or worse experiences that has shaped their lives.
Your catchy response tell me you have no such knowledge and no respect for anything.
I was not by myself when these things and others happened. Some of it is public record.
But I could not care any less what you think.
You sir are all mouth.
Originally Posted By: tnshootistI knew you would show your usual class.
My experiences that shaped who I am today did not come from being an internet warrior.
You brought up the subject of terrible things and how you would be wracked with grief and so on.
Well It's not just an abstract thought for me. I can tell you what it smells like and the taste you get in your mouth.
There are many others who have similar or worse experiences that has shaped their lives.
Your catchy response tell me you have no such knowledge and no respect for anything.
I was not by myself when these things and others happened. Some of it is public record.
But I could not care any less what you think.
You sir are all mouth.
Looks like we know now who should be praying for whom.
I don’t think I’ve ever seen so much bitterness from your “perspective”.
Your focus on heaven for yourself, and your lack of concern for he11 for everybody else is a consistent theme throughout all of your posts and threads.
My experiences that shaped who I am today did not come from being an internet warrior.
You brought up the subject of terrible things and how you would be wracked with grief and so on.
Well It's not just an abstract thought for me. I can tell you what it smells like and the taste you get in your mouth.
There are many others who have similar or worse experiences that has shaped their lives.
Your catchy response tell me you have no such knowledge and no respect for anything.
I was not by myself when these things and others happened. Some of it is public record.
But I could not care any less what you think.
You sir are all mouth.
Looks like we know now who should be praying for whom.
I don’t think I’ve ever seen so much bitterness from your “perspective”.
Your focus on heaven for yourself, and your lack of concern for he11 for everybody else is a consistent theme throughout all of your posts and threads.
tnshootist
New member
More hogwash.
Is your reading comprehension poor or do you think everyone else's is.
I would wish everyone would believe in Jesus.I wish no one would have reason to not make it to Heaven.
I am afraid those who are fixated with the details of he)) and spend their time studying that place my be in some trouble. I don't think much good comes from there.
I thought you might list some of the things that have happened in your life that has made you so bitter.You must have reasons.
I don't want you to not make Heaven your last stop.
I just think by your cute insults and so forth that you have little of any substance to offer.
I took a chance and offered some things in my life that changed my life. That might help you understand the process some people go through and still wind up with faith not bitterness and anger.
You come back with your sharp mocking tongue even then.
I believe thats all you are capable of.
You call it debate but you twist everything anyone says.
you ask a question than when you get an answer you twist what they say and fling it back at them.
You feel you have won the debate by getting the last word.
What have you accomplished?
These questions you think are so deep that you ask have been resolved in one way or another in the hearts of men for thousands of years.
As I said before. You are all mouth.
Coyote are going at it. Done here.
Is your reading comprehension poor or do you think everyone else's is.
I would wish everyone would believe in Jesus.I wish no one would have reason to not make it to Heaven.
I am afraid those who are fixated with the details of he)) and spend their time studying that place my be in some trouble. I don't think much good comes from there.
I thought you might list some of the things that have happened in your life that has made you so bitter.You must have reasons.
I don't want you to not make Heaven your last stop.
I just think by your cute insults and so forth that you have little of any substance to offer.
I took a chance and offered some things in my life that changed my life. That might help you understand the process some people go through and still wind up with faith not bitterness and anger.
You come back with your sharp mocking tongue even then.
I believe thats all you are capable of.
You call it debate but you twist everything anyone says.
you ask a question than when you get an answer you twist what they say and fling it back at them.
You feel you have won the debate by getting the last word.
What have you accomplished?
These questions you think are so deep that you ask have been resolved in one way or another in the hearts of men for thousands of years.
As I said before. You are all mouth.
Coyote are going at it. Done here.
swampwalker
New member
Originally Posted By: FursniperOriginally Posted By: swampwalkerPutting The whole message of the Bible aside, whether you think it's good or bad. can someone explain, how in the hades does a modern man end up worshiping a God that honors a "blood sacrifice" system? I mean, due to their ignorance of the natural world, I give the Aztec's a little wiggle room, for the thousands of people they've murdered on the alter. I also give some slack to the early jews, for the hundreds of thousands of animals they've wastefully bled out, as they've seeked their mythical "atonement".
Modern man on the other hand, I expect a little more from. maybe I'm missing something here, but seems to me the whole foundation of Christianity is built off blood sacrifice? To an all loving God? That had hundreds of thousands of animals killed to temporarily absolve sin?
I wonder if Jesus never came, would our farm animals be safe? Just something to think about.
Oh yeah, very conveniently btw, a lot of money was made to sacrifice these animals.seems like quite a racket, they had going on back then. Some things never change in the business of "sin"
I'll try to explain it, but I'll probably need some help.
The first laws that mankind lived by started in the Old Testament. The Book of Leviticus describes how animals were sacrificed for the purposes of a sin offering. People did things the way they did because Moses said so and he had communications with God. The first few books of Moses is the basis of the Jewish faith. I do not know why God wanted things to start out this way and use animals as sin offerings.
My guess is that Jesus was going to be used as a sin offering thousands of years later to take away the sins of the world. God probably knew this ahead of time. There are hundreds of prophesies that describe how God was going to come again that were added to the Old Testament by other authors over a thousand plus of years. When Jesus came, he fulfilled the hundreds of prophesies that were predicted to happen in the Old Testament.
When Jesus came to the world, he was born Jewish, The laws of the land were still based on the Old Testament. Anyone who did not go along with those law were killed. Jesus ended up changing how things were done. Jesus also changed other traditions that man had invented to worship God. This was the start of Christianity.
Jesus started a new way to worship God which began at the "Last Supper." Instead of animal sacrifices, bread represented the body of Christ and wine represented the blood of Christ. It is taken by Christians in remembrance of Jesus and for the sacrifice he made to use his body as a sin offering for the world.
People that believe Jesus is the son of God, who repent, and ask for forgiveness of their sins can be made pure and enter Heaven.
Thanks for the reply fursniper and enjoy your retirement. To me, it seems like your response underscores the points I've made in my post. That basically Jesus's death absolves sin, In the same way that slaughtered chickens, goats and various farm animals used to.
Does this sound even remotely logical? What's wrong with simply apologizing to those you've done wrong to, or perhaps rectifying a bad situation you've made? Doesn't this seem like a more reasonable approach to the "sin" dilemma? Why does something or someone that's completely detached from your actions have to die?? Think about it...
Modern man on the other hand, I expect a little more from. maybe I'm missing something here, but seems to me the whole foundation of Christianity is built off blood sacrifice? To an all loving God? That had hundreds of thousands of animals killed to temporarily absolve sin?
I wonder if Jesus never came, would our farm animals be safe? Just something to think about.
Oh yeah, very conveniently btw, a lot of money was made to sacrifice these animals.seems like quite a racket, they had going on back then. Some things never change in the business of "sin"
I'll try to explain it, but I'll probably need some help.
The first laws that mankind lived by started in the Old Testament. The Book of Leviticus describes how animals were sacrificed for the purposes of a sin offering. People did things the way they did because Moses said so and he had communications with God. The first few books of Moses is the basis of the Jewish faith. I do not know why God wanted things to start out this way and use animals as sin offerings.
My guess is that Jesus was going to be used as a sin offering thousands of years later to take away the sins of the world. God probably knew this ahead of time. There are hundreds of prophesies that describe how God was going to come again that were added to the Old Testament by other authors over a thousand plus of years. When Jesus came, he fulfilled the hundreds of prophesies that were predicted to happen in the Old Testament.
When Jesus came to the world, he was born Jewish, The laws of the land were still based on the Old Testament. Anyone who did not go along with those law were killed. Jesus ended up changing how things were done. Jesus also changed other traditions that man had invented to worship God. This was the start of Christianity.
Jesus started a new way to worship God which began at the "Last Supper." Instead of animal sacrifices, bread represented the body of Christ and wine represented the blood of Christ. It is taken by Christians in remembrance of Jesus and for the sacrifice he made to use his body as a sin offering for the world.
People that believe Jesus is the son of God, who repent, and ask for forgiveness of their sins can be made pure and enter Heaven.
Thanks for the reply fursniper and enjoy your retirement. To me, it seems like your response underscores the points I've made in my post. That basically Jesus's death absolves sin, In the same way that slaughtered chickens, goats and various farm animals used to.
Does this sound even remotely logical? What's wrong with simply apologizing to those you've done wrong to, or perhaps rectifying a bad situation you've made? Doesn't this seem like a more reasonable approach to the "sin" dilemma? Why does something or someone that's completely detached from your actions have to die?? Think about it...
Fursniper
Active member
Originally Posted By: swampwalker Thanks for the reply fursniper and enjoy your retirement. To me, it seems like your response underscores the points I've made in my post. That basically Jesus's death absolves sin, In the same way that slaughtered chickens, goats and various farm animals used to.
Does this sound even remotely logical? What's wrong with simply apologizing to those you've done wrong to, or perhaps rectifying a bad situation you've made? Doesn't this seem like a more reasonable approach to the "sin" dilemma? Why does something or someone that's completely detached from your actions have to die?? Think about it...
I fully understand your point and its a good one.
Here is the dilemma that God has. Nothing impure can enter heaven. God has set the standards so high for what a good person is that none of us can achieve it. Something has to be used as a scapegoat to blame our sins on so we can become pure (super clean) to enter heaven. Otherwise, God would have to torch everybody. So God now has the system set up to make it pretty easy for us to get into heaven. All we have to do is believe that Jesus is his son, repent, and we can be forgiven and made pure. If people can't at least do that much for themselves, then they get torched.
I got to go sacrifice a turkey with a shotgun.....be back later
Does this sound even remotely logical? What's wrong with simply apologizing to those you've done wrong to, or perhaps rectifying a bad situation you've made? Doesn't this seem like a more reasonable approach to the "sin" dilemma? Why does something or someone that's completely detached from your actions have to die?? Think about it...
I fully understand your point and its a good one.
Here is the dilemma that God has. Nothing impure can enter heaven. God has set the standards so high for what a good person is that none of us can achieve it. Something has to be used as a scapegoat to blame our sins on so we can become pure (super clean) to enter heaven. Otherwise, God would have to torch everybody. So God now has the system set up to make it pretty easy for us to get into heaven. All we have to do is believe that Jesus is his son, repent, and we can be forgiven and made pure. If people can't at least do that much for themselves, then they get torched.
I got to go sacrifice a turkey with a shotgun.....be back later
mbaysinger89
Active member
removed for content
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mbaysinger89
Active member
Its fun to play a player. No more disrespect meant than what was already given.
Hey FW. I'm a Christian, born and raised Methodist, both grandparents on my mother's side were ministers, my family attended a Methodist Church weekly. Is that okay with you that I believe in my religion, or is it not okay? You can do whatever you want, as per the bill of rights, or are you above that?
Seems a pretty similar fight that BLM, KKK, Antifa, NN, Nazis, etc; "I don't believe in what you do, therefore you don't deserve crap on a plate for dinner." I thought "Everybody has to think what I think" was a millennial state of mind. Its interesting it travels back so far
Hey FW. I'm a Christian, born and raised Methodist, both grandparents on my mother's side were ministers, my family attended a Methodist Church weekly. Is that okay with you that I believe in my religion, or is it not okay? You can do whatever you want, as per the bill of rights, or are you above that?
Seems a pretty similar fight that BLM, KKK, Antifa, NN, Nazis, etc; "I don't believe in what you do, therefore you don't deserve crap on a plate for dinner." I thought "Everybody has to think what I think" was a millennial state of mind. Its interesting it travels back so far
Originally Posted By: mbaysinger89Its fun to play a player. No more disrespect meant than what was already given.
Hey FW. I'm a Christian, born and raised Methodist, both grandparents on my mother's side were ministers, my family attended a Methodist Church weekly. Is that okay with you that I believe in my religion, or is it not okay? You can do whatever you want, as per the bill of rights, or are you above that?
Seems a pretty similar fight that BLM, KKK, Antifa, NN, Nazis, etc; "I don't believe in what you do, therefore you don't deserve crap on a plate for dinner." I thought "Everybody has to think what I think" was a millennial state of mind. Its interesting it travels back so far
You are a credit to your religion.
Hey FW. I'm a Christian, born and raised Methodist, both grandparents on my mother's side were ministers, my family attended a Methodist Church weekly. Is that okay with you that I believe in my religion, or is it not okay? You can do whatever you want, as per the bill of rights, or are you above that?
Seems a pretty similar fight that BLM, KKK, Antifa, NN, Nazis, etc; "I don't believe in what you do, therefore you don't deserve crap on a plate for dinner." I thought "Everybody has to think what I think" was a millennial state of mind. Its interesting it travels back so far
You are a credit to your religion.
Bad Dawg
Banned From Church
Originally Posted By: mbaysinger89Its fun to play a player. No more disrespect meant than what was already given.
Hey FW. I'm a Christian, born and raised Methodist, both grandparents on my mother's side were ministers, my family attended a Methodist Church weekly. Is that okay with you that I believe in my religion, or is it not okay? You can do whatever you want, as per the bill of rights, or are you above that?
Seems a pretty similar fight that BLM, KKK, Antifa, NN, Nazis, etc; "I don't believe in what you do, therefore you don't deserve crap on a plate for dinner." I thought "Everybody has to think what I think" was a millennial state of mind. Its interesting it travels back so far
Yeah, you're a Christian alright. Why don't you sit down at a table with your bible, tear out a page one by one and eat them until you are full. That may help cure that little potty mouth of yours.
Hey FW. I'm a Christian, born and raised Methodist, both grandparents on my mother's side were ministers, my family attended a Methodist Church weekly. Is that okay with you that I believe in my religion, or is it not okay? You can do whatever you want, as per the bill of rights, or are you above that?
Seems a pretty similar fight that BLM, KKK, Antifa, NN, Nazis, etc; "I don't believe in what you do, therefore you don't deserve crap on a plate for dinner." I thought "Everybody has to think what I think" was a millennial state of mind. Its interesting it travels back so far
Yeah, you're a Christian alright. Why don't you sit down at a table with your bible, tear out a page one by one and eat them until you are full. That may help cure that little potty mouth of yours.
mbaysinger89
Active member
I never said I still attend. I credit those who do. Those who believe in whatever they want, including you. I believe in friends, family, good work ethic, doing everything I can to make the people I'm around lives better. Or is that belief not okay either?